At one time I thought I had read that there was a group of MW users who were getting together to discuss more 'business' needs in wiki.
Was I dreaming or is there such?
Is there a better place to put up questions discussing possible extensions that would probably never be used in WP worlds but would be better aimed at usage by business.
Is there interest in such?
Thanks
DSig David Tod Sigafoos | SANMAR Corporation PICK Guy
At one time I thought I had read that there was a group of MW users who were getting together to discuss more 'business' needs in wiki.
Well, I remember having been involved in this: http://wikis.wikia.com/wiki/Wiki_sales_pitch But that's not exactly what you're looking for. There's also Enterprise Wikimania, hosted by Socialtext: http://www.eu.socialtext.net/ewikimania/index.cgi Though that's pretty much dead as far as I can tell (and it's obviously not focused on the MediaWiki engine either)...
Is there a better place to put up questions discussing possible extensions that would probably never be used in WP worlds but would be better aimed at usage by business. Is there interest in such?
I would certainly be interested in that, but I'm not sure whether or how I could contribute...
What kind of topics - other than the obvious access restrictions - are you thinking of?
-- F.
My thoughts are these ..
First, none of this is looking for a replacement to MW site. This has been a great source of information. I just recognize that there might be a bit much chatter on the MW site about things that they don't really care about. Anything the comes about from this type of source *must be* shared with MW as far as I am concerned.
a location where problems that have come up trying to do 'business' things with MW are addressed. As mentioned in my original post, these are things that will probably never fit into the MW/WP world. As you mentioned 'access restriction', different reporting/special pages. Processes that 'implementors' (probably better than business?) might need that WikiWorld wont.
The wiki is a great way of sharing information. But sometimes businesses need a little more than just 'editing' and viewing. One example would be the BoilerplateSelection extension I did. We have various formatted documents (currently formatted in 'word') that we want to use. This extension allows auto-seed depending on article name. This works well for us (could be modified for various uses).
a location where people can 'team' to work out a specific problem. A WYSIWYG editor might be an example. Although not everyone wants one of these, if there are some developers who would help out on something like this it would be great. Not all of us have all the knowledge of MW to develop something this complex but I am sure the knowledge is out there
I am sure that there are other examples that can be thought of that something like this might work for.
The trick would be to keep the MW core developers involved with these ideas as their knowledge is crucial to get any of these things working. But letting them be distant enough that they aren't 'expected' to answer questions.
DSig David Tod Sigafoos | SANMAR Corporation
-----Original Message----- From: mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org [mailto:mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of Frederik Dohr Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 7:52 To: MediaWiki announcements and site admin list Subject: Re: [Mediawiki-l] Looking for MW Business Users
At one time I thought I had read that there was a group of MW users
who
were getting together to discuss more 'business' needs in wiki.
Well, I remember having been involved in this: http://wikis.wikia.com/wiki/Wiki_sales_pitch But that's not exactly what you're looking for. There's also Enterprise Wikimania, hosted by Socialtext: http://www.eu.socialtext.net/ewikimania/index.cgi Though that's pretty much dead as far as I can tell (and it's obviously not focused on the MediaWiki engine either)...
Is there a better place to put up questions discussing possible extensions that would probably never be used in WP worlds but would be better aimed at usage by business. Is there interest in such?
I would certainly be interested in that, but I'm not sure whether or how
I could contribute...
What kind of topics - other than the obvious access restrictions - are you thinking of?
Dave Sigafoos wrote:
a location where problems that have come up trying to do 'business' things with MW are addressed. As mentioned in my original post, these are things that will probably never fit into the MW/WP world. As you mentioned 'access restriction', different reporting/special pages. Processes that 'implementors' (probably better than business?) might need that WikiWorld wont.
This will sound more negative than I intend, but bear with me - I'll use a bit of hyperbole to make a point.
The business community has been getting a free ride on Internet stuff for a long time now. They have done little to contribute to the development of the Internet, WWW or much of anything else (network and software- or hardware-specific companies excepted). Yet they have been quick to grab onto whatever they can and warp it into something it was not intended to be (e.g - the WWW, a document publishing mechanism became a transaction processing system with kludges to HTML etc to support retail operations).
If the business community really needs something on the Internet, maybe they should put their money where their mouth is and make substantial contributions to the whole effort instead of taking stuff for free and expecting it to be modified to their wants.
---- I see a lot of demand for the kind of secure/restricted/whatever versions of wikis for business. I think that the business community should get together and _pay_ for such a system and then sell it to other businesses. Leave the wikis to the wiki users and create a lightweight document management system for businesses if that's what they really want.
Mike
On 6/28/07, Michael Daly michaeldaly@kayakwiki.org wrote:
Dave Sigafoos wrote:
a location where problems that have come up trying to do 'business' things with MW are addressed. As mentioned in my original post, these are things that will probably never fit into the MW/WP world. As you mentioned 'access restriction', different reporting/special pages. Processes that 'implementors' (probably better than business?) might need that WikiWorld wont.
This will sound more negative than I intend, but bear with me - I'll use a bit of hyperbole to make a point.
The business community has been getting a free ride on Internet stuff for a long time now. They have done little to contribute to the development of the Internet, WWW or much of anything else (network and software- or hardware-specific companies excepted). Yet they have been quick to grab onto whatever they can and warp it into something it was not intended to be (e.g - the WWW, a document publishing mechanism became a transaction processing system with kludges to HTML etc to support retail operations).
If the business community really needs something on the Internet, maybe they should put their money where their mouth is and make substantial contributions to the whole effort instead of taking stuff for free and expecting it to be modified to their wants.
I see a lot of demand for the kind of secure/restricted/whatever versions of wikis for business. I think that the business community should get together and _pay_ for such a system and then sell it to other businesses. Leave the wikis to the wiki users and create a lightweight document management system for businesses if that's what they really want.
Mike
You have the usual software development process backwards.
More often, someone thinks there's a demand, and forms a company to fill the demand.
It's hard to make money enhancing GPLed code, however. One can sell support, and one can sell the improved code, but it remains GPLed and you also have to give it away. There are exceptions - the former Cygnus Support, RedHat and the other Linux companies, MySQL AG. But those are the exceptions.
You're setting up a false dichotomy here, too. You're suggesting that the needs that business users have are incompatible with, or detrimental to, the open use of MediaWiki by projects like WP (among others). I have to disagree. Some business features might never get turned on or used on a Wikipedia type project, but I don't think they'd detract at all. Having a single, common toolbase which everyone could base projects off of would be good for a lot of things. MediaWiki has redefined the Wiki markup language and set performance standards which stand head and shoulders above the competition, except in a few business support areas. Telling us to go do another program, or the implied alternative (fork MW or something silly like that) doesn't make any sense. MW is an excellent tool in the sweet spot for a lot of commercial use as well as community use.
Perhaps a new next-generation wiki tool will do better for everyone, but as far as I know nobody's working on one.
Mike .. that was one of the funniest emails I ever read .. On first blush I thought 'Hey .. this guy is serious' but then after rereading and writing a flame that might have brought the net down itself I got it. It was the 'hyperbole' that I had missed. Of course that got me to understand that this was some kind of satirical look at business from that 'apple kid' character on the commercials. As they say .. thanks I needed that <g>
" This will sound more negative than I intend, but bear with me - I'll
use a bit of hyperbole to make a point"
The problem with hyperbole is that it usually misses the mark completely <g>
And don't take this wrong <G>
"The business community has been getting a free ride on Internet stuff
for a long time now. They have done little to contribute to the ... "
They've done little to contribute .. I can only assume that this was meant as comic relief.
OR
"I see a lot of demand for the kind of secure/restricted/whatever
versions of wikis for business. I think that the business community should get together and _pay_ for such a system and then sell it to .. "
When I do something for any of my clients I get paid for it. If I make an extension either it is my time or a clients. In either SOMEONE is paying for it.
This idea that businesses who give time/resources to Open Source projects really aren't paying is nonsense. I don't know about you but I get paid well for what I do. If I spend my time (which most of this is) then I am paying .. if I get paid by my clients then they are paying.
As my daddy always said .. TNSTAAFL
DSig David Tod Sigafoos | SANMAR Corporation
-----Original Message----- From: mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org [mailto:mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of Michael Daly Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 14:33 To: MediaWiki announcements and site admin list Subject: [Mediawiki-l] [SPAM] Re: Looking for MW Business Users
Dave Sigafoos wrote:
a location where problems that have come up trying to do 'business' things with MW are addressed. As mentioned in my original post, these are things that will probably never fit into the MW/WP world. As you mentioned 'access restriction', different reporting/special pages. Processes that 'implementors' (probably better than business?) might need that WikiWorld wont.
This will sound more negative than I intend, but bear with me - I'll use
a bit of hyperbole to make a point.
The business community has been getting a free ride on Internet stuff for a long time now. They have done little to contribute to the development of the Internet, WWW or much of anything else (network and software- or hardware-specific companies excepted). Yet they have been quick to grab onto whatever they can and warp it into something it was not intended to be (e.g - the WWW, a document publishing mechanism became a transaction processing system with kludges to HTML etc to support retail operations).
If the business community really needs something on the Internet, maybe they should put their money where their mouth is and make substantial contributions to the whole effort instead of taking stuff for free and expecting it to be modified to their wants.
---- I see a lot of demand for the kind of secure/restricted/whatever versions of wikis for business. I think that the business community should get together and _pay_ for such a system and then sell it to other businesses. Leave the wikis to the wiki users and create a lightweight document management system for businesses if that's what they really want.
Mike
The English Wikipedia has an extended toolbar for the edit box while the default installation (and the one used on the MediaWiki site) is much shorter. I was wondering if anyone knew how to extend the toolbar and make it like the one on Wikipedia.
======================================= Kimon Andreou Information Technology Royal Caribbean Cruises, Ltd. SW 389-1 14700 Caribbean Way Miramar, FL 33027 Tel: (954) 517-5460 Cell: (954) 309-7141
http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/mediawiki-l/2007-June/020904.html
KAndreou wrote:
The English Wikipedia has an extended toolbar for the edit box while the default installation (and the one used on the MediaWiki site) is much shorter. I was wondering if anyone knew how to extend the toolbar and make it like the one on Wikipedia.
Go to this page
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Common.js
You really only need the bits in the "Extra toolbar options" section
This can be cut/paste into your local MediaWiki:Common.js
DSig David Tod Sigafoos | SANMAR Corporation PICK Guy 206-770-5585 davesigafoos@sanmar.com
-----Original Message----- From: mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org [mailto:mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of KAndreou@rccl.com Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 9:24 To: MediaWiki announcements and site admin list Subject: [Mediawiki-l] How can I add extra buttons to the edit toolbar?
The English Wikipedia has an extended toolbar for the edit box while the
default installation (and the one used on the MediaWiki site) is much shorter. I was wondering if anyone knew how to extend the toolbar and make it like the one on Wikipedia.
Kimon;
Please ignore my post, the link that Alexis sent is the one you want to use
DSig David Tod Sigafoos | SANMAR Corporation
-----Original Message----- From: mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org [mailto:mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of Dave Sigafoos Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 9:55 To: MediaWiki announcements and site admin list Subject: Re: [Mediawiki-l] How can I add extra buttons to the edit toolbar?
Go to this page
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Common.js
You really only need the bits in the "Extra toolbar options" section
This can be cut/paste into your local MediaWiki:Common.js
-----Original Message----- From: mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org [mailto:mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of KAndreou@rccl.com Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 9:24 To: MediaWiki announcements and site admin list Subject: [Mediawiki-l] How can I add extra buttons to the edit toolbar?
The English Wikipedia has an extended toolbar for the edit box while the
default installation (and the one used on the MediaWiki site) is much shorter. I was wondering if anyone knew how to extend the toolbar and make it like the one on Wikipedia.
_______________________________________________ MediaWiki-l mailing list MediaWiki-l@lists.wikimedia.org http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/mediawiki-l
Thanks everyone - I copied the code and images and the site works as expected!
======================================= Kimon Andreou Information Technology Royal Caribbean Cruises, Ltd. SW 389-1 14700 Caribbean Way Miramar, FL 33027 Tel: (954) 517-5460 Cell: (954) 309-7141
mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org wrote on 29-06-2007 13:15:17:
Kimon;
Please ignore my post, the link that Alexis sent is the one you want to use
DSig David Tod Sigafoos | SANMAR Corporation
-----Original Message----- From: mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org [mailto:mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of Dave Sigafoos Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 9:55 To: MediaWiki announcements and site admin list Subject: Re: [Mediawiki-l] How can I add extra buttons to the edit toolbar?
Go to this page
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Common.js
You really only need the bits in the "Extra toolbar options" section
This can be cut/paste into your local MediaWiki:Common.js
-----Original Message----- From: mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org [mailto:mediawiki-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of KAndreou@rccl.com Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 9:24 To: MediaWiki announcements and site admin list Subject: [Mediawiki-l] How can I add extra buttons to the edit toolbar?
The English Wikipedia has an extended toolbar for the edit box while the
default installation (and the one used on the MediaWiki site) is much shorter. I was wondering if anyone knew how to extend the toolbar and make it like the one on Wikipedia.
MediaWiki-l mailing list MediaWiki-l@lists.wikimedia.org http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/mediawiki-l
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