Dear All
As you might be aware, we've been have a monthly call between the India Chapter and India Programs team. Since we last updated you, we have had 2 calls and also a face-to-face meeting after WikiConference. Here's an update on these meetings.
I must beforehand apologize for being so late on updating you on these calls / meetings. Shall endeavor to be more on schedule going forward.
Do share your feedback and comments. Do let us know if there are any clarifications we can provide.
Thursday November 9th (Voice Conference) [Arjun, Arun, Naveen, Sudhanwa, Tinu, Asaf & Hisham]
India Programs Update
India Trust has been set up and a formal announcement will be made shortly on this matter. India Education Program has encountered significant problems with regard to copy-pasted material. While efforts have been made (including asking for help from Online Ambassadors), in-class sessions from Campus Ambassadors (in almost every single class of the program), asking for intervention from faculty, asking students only to work on sandboxes, etc., the situation remained particularly serious at College of Engineering, Pune. As a result, the program was suspended at this college. It currently runs at 1 class at Symbiosis School of Economics (while the other classes there have concluded their assignments) and at 1 class at SNDT Women's University. Specifically, the lessons learnt on the pilot were discussed. These included scale, choice of faculty, choice of classes, inadequate engagement and communication with en-wp community, modifications to Campus Ambassador training going forward, modifications to student training going forward, etc. It was pointed out that a comprehensive and honest learnings exercise would be undertaken. Recruitment of additional team members (for Communications and for Team Support) have been delayed because the right candidate was not available. The initial work on the Indic Languages initiatives would start off with preliminary discussions and data analysis of the various language projects. This will help to build a picture with both experience and data of the current state, challenges, opportunities and potential of the various projects. Eventually, the objective will be to identify potential pilots and language communities that might be interested in these pilots. Chapter Update
Arjun said that as Wikipedia is always evolving with contributions of community, any project needs to be carefully planned and executed to minimize the load on community. We had some experiences with Google Translate project, which received adverse reaction from wikipedian community. Even if Foundation undertakes an initiative, there is a possibility of similar adverse response. He hoped that we can use this experience to improve future project planning.
Sunday November 20th (Face to Face Meeting) [Arjun, Arun, Naveen, Sudhanwa, Tinu, Barry & Hisham]
India Programs Update
Point of View was shared about the nature of communication and co-operation between the Chapter and India Programs. It was pointed out that all the activities of India Programs have been in line with the publicly available page at http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_-_India_Programs. The monthly co-ordination calls that the Chapter EC had initaited and that are now being regularly undertaken is useful and must be continued. Chapter EC requested prior information on activities and it was suggested by India Programs (and agreed by Chapter EC) that all important announcements would be sent to the Chapter EC 48 hours before being shared publicly. The nature of the work that was happening on Indic Languages initiatives was shared (including the kinds of discussions and how these discussions were being conducted) and that Shiju will shortly start sharing the updates of language discussions with the community. The learnings process of the India Education Program was shared - including the fact that data gathering was going to be commenced and that the learnings would inform the next steps of the project. Nitika will shortly update the community about how these learnings were going to be gathered. It was reiterated that the plans going forward would be finalized only after a thorough review of the program was conducted. It was proposed to identify potential areas where the Chapter EC and India Programs would work collaboratively.
Chapter Update
Arjun said that it is essential to have clarity on the focus areas of WMF and identify projects where WMF and WMIN could work together. Arun suggested the need for a governance framework for the various activities in India. Arjun summarized the focus of Wikimedia India on Wiki academies and Strengthening City/Language SIGs. Preliminary discussions around Regional Conferences, GLAM, Wiki loves monuments and Knowledge Kiosks are in progress. He explained how Knowledge Kiosks pilot, where visitors to public libraries can access Wikipedia through tablet computers in the language of their choice can be a great help for reaching out to the population, who can't afford computers and Internet. He suggested that it can be a good collaborative project and requested India programs support. India programs could take care of program management and dealing with Library organizations and vendors. Chapter would help in training library personnel and users in the various pilot locations. Hisham suggested inviting fellowships for such a project. Arjun opined that organizational help is really needed to do such projects. It is agreed to have further discussions on this topic after sharing additional information. Wednesday November 23rd (Voice Conference) [Arjun, Arun, Naveen, Sudhanwa & Hisham]
India Programs Update Ambiguity around the two entities "India Programs" and "India Trust" were clarified. India Programs is the team of consultants (currently, Hisham, Shiju & Nitika) who are working as consultants to WMF. Once the funding for the Wikimedia India Program Trust is sorted out (after the appropriate funding has the necessary approvals), these consultants will transition to the Trust. Until then, the Trust is an organisation that has been registered by has no funds available and therefore will not undertake any activities An update was shared the the Trust was going to be filing for the necessary taxation related applications (Sections 12A and 80G) as well as FCRA Prior-Permission in the next few days. An update will be shared after these have been done. A discussion was made on the Chapter EC proposal for Chapter & India Programs to work together on the Knowledge Kiosks initiative of the Chapter. India Programs indicated their preference not to work on projects that require such intensive effort in infrastructure building (both hardware and connectivity.) It was also recommended that the Chapter carefully consider their involvement in such initiatives especially given the kind of effort that will be required in stuff like procurement. It was proposed that the Chapter EC and India Programs work collaboratively on at least 2 broad areas: supporting community outreach & community building (especially volunteer mobilization) as well PR & social media with Chapter EC. Both areas are aspects where India Programs can bring capability to the table and are areas of interest to members of the Chapter EC. An update was shared on the meeting with the Ministry of HRD regarding potential collaboration with Aakash tablet. The meeting was extremely positive and holds potential. Hisham will be sharing an update to the community on the next steps on this after some additional discussions. It was proposed that a discussion commence that will collaboratively arrive at a draft document that provide clarity to how Chapter EC and the India Trust can work together. This will be in the nature of definition of roles. Chapter Update Arjun said that with the kind of resources that the India Programs Trust will have access, it can take up challenging projects like Knowledge Kiosks as it can certainly outsource stuff that can not done by Trust. It is agreed to continue the discussion on this topic. Best
hisham
Hisham, I don't understand why the Executive Committee offer to be informed 48 HOURS in advance of the community. Isn't Wikipedia a community based system? If the chapter or trust is everything then what is the community sitting here to do? I know I sound rude, but I fail to understand why some people get prior preference. Especially after I spend an entire day talking to newcomers telling them that everyone in Wiki is equal.
On 06/12/2011, Hisham hisham@wikimedia.org wrote:
Dear All
As you might be aware, we've been have a monthly call between the India Chapter and India Programs team. Since we last updated you, we have had 2 calls and also a face-to-face meeting after WikiConference. Here's an update on these meetings.
I must beforehand apologize for being so late on updating you on these calls / meetings. Shall endeavor to be more on schedule going forward.
Do share your feedback and comments. Do let us know if there are any clarifications we can provide.
Thursday November 9th (Voice Conference) [Arjun, Arun, Naveen, Sudhanwa, Tinu, Asaf & Hisham]
India Programs Update
India Trust has been set up and a formal announcement will be made shortly on this matter. India Education Program has encountered significant problems with regard to copy-pasted material. While efforts have been made (including asking for help from Online Ambassadors), in-class sessions from Campus Ambassadors (in almost every single class of the program), asking for intervention from faculty, asking students only to work on sandboxes, etc., the situation remained particularly serious at College of Engineering, Pune. As a result, the program was suspended at this college. It currently runs at 1 class at Symbiosis School of Economics (while the other classes there have concluded their assignments) and at 1 class at SNDT Women's University. Specifically, the lessons learnt on the pilot were discussed. These included scale, choice of faculty, choice of classes, inadequate engagement and communication with en-wp community, modifications to Campus Ambassador training going forward, modifications to student training going forward, etc. It was pointed out that a comprehensive and honest learnings exercise would be undertaken. Recruitment of additional team members (for Communications and for Team Support) have been delayed because the right candidate was not available. The initial work on the Indic Languages initiatives would start off with preliminary discussions and data analysis of the various language projects. This will help to build a picture with both experience and data of the current state, challenges, opportunities and potential of the various projects. Eventually, the objective will be to identify potential pilots and language communities that might be interested in these pilots. Chapter Update
Arjun said that as Wikipedia is always evolving with contributions of community, any project needs to be carefully planned and executed to minimize the load on community. We had some experiences with Google Translate project, which received adverse reaction from wikipedian community. Even if Foundation undertakes an initiative, there is a possibility of similar adverse response. He hoped that we can use this experience to improve future project planning.
Sunday November 20th (Face to Face Meeting) [Arjun, Arun, Naveen, Sudhanwa, Tinu, Barry & Hisham]
India Programs Update
Point of View was shared about the nature of communication and co-operation between the Chapter and India Programs. It was pointed out that all the activities of India Programs have been in line with the publicly available page at http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_-_India_Programs. The monthly co-ordination calls that the Chapter EC had initaited and that are now being regularly undertaken is useful and must be continued. Chapter EC requested prior information on activities and it was suggested by India Programs (and agreed by Chapter EC) that all important announcements would be sent to the Chapter EC 48 hours before being shared publicly. The nature of the work that was happening on Indic Languages initiatives was shared (including the kinds of discussions and how these discussions were being conducted) and that Shiju will shortly start sharing the updates of language discussions with the community. The learnings process of the India Education Program was shared - including the fact that data gathering was going to be commenced and that the learnings would inform the next steps of the project. Nitika will shortly update the community about how these learnings were going to be gathered. It was reiterated that the plans going forward would be finalized only after a thorough review of the program was conducted. It was proposed to identify potential areas where the Chapter EC and India Programs would work collaboratively.
Chapter Update
Arjun said that it is essential to have clarity on the focus areas of WMF and identify projects where WMF and WMIN could work together. Arun suggested the need for a governance framework for the various activities in India. Arjun summarized the focus of Wikimedia India on Wiki academies and Strengthening City/Language SIGs. Preliminary discussions around Regional Conferences, GLAM, Wiki loves monuments and Knowledge Kiosks are in progress. He explained how Knowledge Kiosks pilot, where visitors to public libraries can access Wikipedia through tablet computers in the language of their choice can be a great help for reaching out to the population, who can't afford computers and Internet. He suggested that it can be a good collaborative project and requested India programs support. India programs could take care of program management and dealing with Library organizations and vendors. Chapter would help in training library personnel and users in the various pilot locations. Hisham suggested inviting fellowships for such a project. Arjun opined that organizational help is really needed to do such projects. It is agreed to have further discussions on this topic after sharing additional information. Wednesday November 23rd (Voice Conference) [Arjun, Arun, Naveen, Sudhanwa & Hisham]
India Programs Update Ambiguity around the two entities "India Programs" and "India Trust" were clarified. India Programs is the team of consultants (currently, Hisham, Shiju & Nitika) who are working as consultants to WMF. Once the funding for the Wikimedia India Program Trust is sorted out (after the appropriate funding has the necessary approvals), these consultants will transition to the Trust. Until then, the Trust is an organisation that has been registered by has no funds available and therefore will not undertake any activities An update was shared the the Trust was going to be filing for the necessary taxation related applications (Sections 12A and 80G) as well as FCRA Prior-Permission in the next few days. An update will be shared after these have been done. A discussion was made on the Chapter EC proposal for Chapter & India Programs to work together on the Knowledge Kiosks initiative of the Chapter. India Programs indicated their preference not to work on projects that require such intensive effort in infrastructure building (both hardware and connectivity.) It was also recommended that the Chapter carefully consider their involvement in such initiatives especially given the kind of effort that will be required in stuff like procurement. It was proposed that the Chapter EC and India Programs work collaboratively on at least 2 broad areas: supporting community outreach & community building (especially volunteer mobilization) as well PR & social media with Chapter EC. Both areas are aspects where India Programs can bring capability to the table and are areas of interest to members of the Chapter EC. An update was shared on the meeting with the Ministry of HRD regarding potential collaboration with Aakash tablet. The meeting was extremely positive and holds potential. Hisham will be sharing an update to the community on the next steps on this after some additional discussions. It was proposed that a discussion commence that will collaboratively arrive at a draft document that provide clarity to how Chapter EC and the India Trust can work together. This will be in the nature of definition of roles.
Chapter Update Arjun said that with the kind of resources that the India Programs Trust will have access, it can take up challenging projects like Knowledge Kiosks as it can certainly outsource stuff that can not done by Trust. It is agreed to continue the discussion on this topic. Best
hisham
Hi Srikanth R,
Please allow me to share my view.
On Sat, Dec 10, 2011 at 11:39 PM, Srikanth Ramakrishnan < parakara.ghoda@gmail.com> wrote:
Hisham, I don't understand why the Executive Committee offer to be informed 48 HOURS in advance of the community. Isn't Wikipedia a community based system? If the chapter or trust is everything then what is the community sitting here to do? I know I sound rude, but I fail to understand why some people get prior preference. Especially after I spend an entire day talking to newcomers telling them that everyone in Wiki is equal.
I am some times puzzled by assumption that people have about Wikipedia policies for individuals related to editing a wiki page online apply equally to real world Wikimedia organisations with accountabilties to various stakeholders including Government. I am also concerned about the assumed separation between community and chapter based on some recent mails to the India list.
Let me elaborate my thoughts on this.
Chapter members including EC members are part of community and serve Community and the movement. It is just the level and structure of engagement of a person that determines whether he/she is part of Chapter. If a person reads Wikipedia, he/she is member of community. If a person contributes to Wikipedia, he/she is part of smaller subset of communitycalled editors. If a person would like to promote Wikipedia in real world, he could do as an individual or become a member of chapter, leverage the benefits of the legal entity called "Wikimedia chapter", get affiliated with SIGs and contribute.
Chapter IRC is open for everyone. Even membership is open for every Indian aged above 18. So I would request everyone to treat Chapter as a subset of community with more focus on growing the movement in real world.
Coming to your specific question about the plan for sharing public communications in advance, here is my view. As I understand, Trust is an independent legal entity contributing to Wikimedia movement in India. So the coordination calls are a mechanism to share plans and issues so that the overall effectiveness can be improved. Advance notice for any public communication was agreed so that each entity could provide the other feedback if any, if such communication were to attribute some things to the other or lead to confusion in the stakeholders. It is mutual. I am sorry the minutes did not reflect the same, though it was discussed and agreed.
Hope the above helps. I request Hisham to share his view as well.
Cheers
Arjuna Rao Chavala President, Wikimedia India
On 06/12/2011, Hisham hisham@wikimedia.org wrote:
Dear All
As you might be aware, we've been have a monthly call between the India Chapter and India Programs team. Since we last updated you, we have had
2
calls and also a face-to-face meeting after WikiConference. Here's an update on these meetings.
I must beforehand apologize for being so late on updating you on these
calls
/ meetings. Shall endeavor to be more on schedule going forward.
Do share your feedback and comments. Do let us know if there are any clarifications we can provide.
Thursday November 9th (Voice Conference) [Arjun, Arun, Naveen, Sudhanwa, Tinu, Asaf & Hisham]
India Programs Update
India Trust has been set up and a formal announcement will be made
shortly
on this matter. India Education Program has encountered significant problems with regard
to
copy-pasted material. While efforts have been made (including asking for help from Online Ambassadors), in-class sessions from Campus Ambassadors
(in
almost every single class of the program), asking for intervention from faculty, asking students only to work on sandboxes, etc., the situation remained particularly serious at College of Engineering, Pune. As a
result,
the program was suspended at this college. It currently runs at 1 class
at
Symbiosis School of Economics (while the other classes there have
concluded
their assignments) and at 1 class at SNDT Women's University. Specifically, the lessons learnt on the pilot were discussed. These included scale, choice of faculty, choice of classes, inadequate
engagement
and communication with en-wp community, modifications to Campus
Ambassador
training going forward, modifications to student training going forward, etc. It was pointed out that a comprehensive and honest learnings
exercise
would be undertaken. Recruitment of additional team members (for Communications and for Team Support) have been delayed because the right candidate was not available. The initial work on the Indic Languages initiatives would start off with preliminary discussions and data analysis of the various language
projects.
This will help to build a picture with both experience and data of the current state, challenges, opportunities and potential of the various projects. Eventually, the objective will be to identify potential pilots and language communities that might be interested in these pilots. Chapter Update
Arjun said that as Wikipedia is always evolving with contributions of community, any project needs to be carefully planned and executed to minimize the load on community. We had some experiences with Google Translate project, which received adverse reaction from wikipedian community. Even if Foundation undertakes an initiative, there is a possibility of similar adverse response. He hoped that we can use this experience to improve future project planning.
Sunday November 20th (Face to Face Meeting) [Arjun, Arun, Naveen,
Sudhanwa,
Tinu, Barry & Hisham]
India Programs Update
Point of View was shared about the nature of communication and
co-operation
between the Chapter and India Programs. It was pointed out that all the activities of India Programs have been in line with the publicly
available
page at http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_-_India_Programs.
The
monthly co-ordination calls that the Chapter EC had initaited and that
are
now being regularly undertaken is useful and must be continued. Chapter
EC
requested prior information on activities and it was suggested by India Programs (and agreed by Chapter EC) that all important announcements
would
be sent to the Chapter EC 48 hours before being shared publicly. The nature of the work that was happening on Indic Languages initiatives
was
shared (including the kinds of discussions and how these discussions were being conducted) and that Shiju will shortly start sharing the updates of language discussions with the community. The learnings process of the India Education Program was shared -
including
the fact that data gathering was going to be commenced and that the learnings would inform the next steps of the project. Nitika will
shortly
update the community about how these learnings were going to be gathered. It was reiterated that the plans going forward would be finalized only
after
a thorough review of the program was conducted. It was proposed to identify potential areas where the Chapter EC and
India
Programs would work collaboratively.
Chapter Update
Arjun said that it is essential to have clarity on the focus areas of WMF and identify projects where WMF and WMIN could work together. Arun
suggested
the need for a governance framework for the various activities in India. Arjun summarized the focus of Wikimedia India on Wiki academies and Strengthening City/Language SIGs. Preliminary discussions around Regional Conferences, GLAM, Wiki loves monuments and Knowledge Kiosks are in progress. He explained how Knowledge Kiosks pilot, where visitors to public
libraries
can access Wikipedia through tablet computers in the language of their choice can be a great help for reaching out to the population, who can't afford computers and Internet. He suggested that it can be a good collaborative project and requested India programs support. India
programs
could take care of program management and dealing with Library
organizations
and vendors. Chapter would help in training library personnel and users
in
the various pilot locations. Hisham suggested inviting fellowships for
such
a project. Arjun opined that organizational help is really needed to do such projects. It is agreed to have further discussions on this topic
after
sharing additional information. Wednesday November 23rd (Voice Conference) [Arjun, Arun, Naveen,
Sudhanwa &
Hisham]
India Programs Update Ambiguity around the two entities "India Programs" and "India Trust" were clarified. India Programs is the team of consultants (currently, Hisham, Shiju & Nitika) who are working as consultants to WMF. Once the funding
for
the Wikimedia India Program Trust is sorted out (after the appropriate funding has the necessary approvals), these consultants will transition
to
the Trust. Until then, the Trust is an organisation that has been registered by has no funds available and therefore will not undertake any activities An update was shared the the Trust was going to be filing for the
necessary
taxation related applications (Sections 12A and 80G) as well as FCRA Prior-Permission in the next few days. An update will be shared after
these
have been done. A discussion was made on the Chapter EC proposal for Chapter & India Programs to work together on the Knowledge Kiosks initiative of the
Chapter.
India Programs indicated their preference not to work on projects that require such intensive effort in infrastructure building (both hardware
and
connectivity.) It was also recommended that the Chapter carefully
consider
their involvement in such initiatives especially given the kind of effort that will be required in stuff like procurement. It was proposed that the Chapter EC and India Programs work
collaboratively
on at least 2 broad areas: supporting community outreach & community building (especially volunteer mobilization) as well PR & social media
with
Chapter EC. Both areas are aspects where India Programs can bring capability to the table and are areas of interest to members of the
Chapter
EC. An update was shared on the meeting with the Ministry of HRD regarding potential collaboration with Aakash tablet. The meeting was extremely positive and holds potential. Hisham will be sharing an update to the community on the next steps on this after some additional discussions. It was proposed that a discussion commence that will collaboratively
arrive
at a draft document that provide clarity to how Chapter EC and the India Trust can work together. This will be in the nature of definition of
roles.
Chapter Update Arjun said that with the kind of resources that the India Programs Trust will have access, it can take up challenging projects like Knowledge
Kiosks
as it can certainly outsource stuff that can not done by Trust. It is
agreed
to continue the discussion on this topic. Best
hisham
-- Sent from my mobile device
Regards, Srikanth Ramakrishnan. Wikipedia Coimbatore Meetup on December 10th. http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Meetup/Coimbatore
Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Thank you for your explanation for the explanation Arjuna, but I still have a question. What feedback are you looking for?
On 11/12/2011, Arjuna Rao Chavala arjunaraoc@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Srikanth R,
Please allow me to share my view.
On Sat, Dec 10, 2011 at 11:39 PM, Srikanth Ramakrishnan < parakara.ghoda@gmail.com> wrote:
Hisham, I don't understand why the Executive Committee offer to be informed 48 HOURS in advance of the community. Isn't Wikipedia a community based system? If the chapter or trust is everything then what is the community sitting here to do? I know I sound rude, but I fail to understand why some people get prior preference. Especially after I spend an entire day talking to newcomers telling them that everyone in Wiki is equal.
I am some times puzzled by assumption that people have about Wikipedia policies for individuals related to editing a wiki page online apply equally to real world Wikimedia organisations with accountabilties to various stakeholders including Government. I am also concerned about the assumed separation between community and chapter based on some recent mails to the India list.
Let me elaborate my thoughts on this.
Chapter members including EC members are part of community and serve Community and the movement. It is just the level and structure of engagement of a person that determines whether he/she is part of Chapter. If a person reads Wikipedia, he/she is member of community. If a person contributes to Wikipedia, he/she is part of smaller subset of communitycalled editors. If a person would like to promote Wikipedia in real world, he could do as an individual or become a member of chapter, leverage the benefits of the legal entity called "Wikimedia chapter", get affiliated with SIGs and contribute.
Chapter IRC is open for everyone. Even membership is open for every Indian aged above 18. So I would request everyone to treat Chapter as a subset of community with more focus on growing the movement in real world.
Coming to your specific question about the plan for sharing public communications in advance, here is my view. As I understand, Trust is an independent legal entity contributing to Wikimedia movement in India. So the coordination calls are a mechanism to share plans and issues so that the overall effectiveness can be improved. Advance notice for any public communication was agreed so that each entity could provide the other feedback if any, if such communication were to attribute some things to the other or lead to confusion in the stakeholders. It is mutual. I am sorry the minutes did not reflect the same, though it was discussed and agreed.
Hope the above helps. I request Hisham to share his view as well.
Cheers
Arjuna Rao Chavala President, Wikimedia India
On 06/12/2011, Hisham hisham@wikimedia.org wrote:
Dear All
As you might be aware, we've been have a monthly call between the India Chapter and India Programs team. Since we last updated you, we have had
2
calls and also a face-to-face meeting after WikiConference. Here's an update on these meetings.
I must beforehand apologize for being so late on updating you on these
calls
/ meetings. Shall endeavor to be more on schedule going forward.
Do share your feedback and comments. Do let us know if there are any clarifications we can provide.
Thursday November 9th (Voice Conference) [Arjun, Arun, Naveen, Sudhanwa, Tinu, Asaf & Hisham]
India Programs Update
India Trust has been set up and a formal announcement will be made
shortly
on this matter. India Education Program has encountered significant problems with regard
to
copy-pasted material. While efforts have been made (including asking for help from Online Ambassadors), in-class sessions from Campus Ambassadors
(in
almost every single class of the program), asking for intervention from faculty, asking students only to work on sandboxes, etc., the situation remained particularly serious at College of Engineering, Pune. As a
result,
the program was suspended at this college. It currently runs at 1 class
at
Symbiosis School of Economics (while the other classes there have
concluded
their assignments) and at 1 class at SNDT Women's University. Specifically, the lessons learnt on the pilot were discussed. These included scale, choice of faculty, choice of classes, inadequate
engagement
and communication with en-wp community, modifications to Campus
Ambassador
training going forward, modifications to student training going forward, etc. It was pointed out that a comprehensive and honest learnings
exercise
would be undertaken. Recruitment of additional team members (for Communications and for Team Support) have been delayed because the right candidate was not available. The initial work on the Indic Languages initiatives would start off with preliminary discussions and data analysis of the various language
projects.
This will help to build a picture with both experience and data of the current state, challenges, opportunities and potential of the various projects. Eventually, the objective will be to identify potential pilots and language communities that might be interested in these pilots. Chapter Update
Arjun said that as Wikipedia is always evolving with contributions of community, any project needs to be carefully planned and executed to minimize the load on community. We had some experiences with Google Translate project, which received adverse reaction from wikipedian community. Even if Foundation undertakes an initiative, there is a possibility of similar adverse response. He hoped that we can use this experience to improve future project planning.
Sunday November 20th (Face to Face Meeting) [Arjun, Arun, Naveen,
Sudhanwa,
Tinu, Barry & Hisham]
India Programs Update
Point of View was shared about the nature of communication and
co-operation
between the Chapter and India Programs. It was pointed out that all the activities of India Programs have been in line with the publicly
available
page at http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_-_India_Programs.
The
monthly co-ordination calls that the Chapter EC had initaited and that
are
now being regularly undertaken is useful and must be continued. Chapter
EC
requested prior information on activities and it was suggested by India Programs (and agreed by Chapter EC) that all important announcements
would
be sent to the Chapter EC 48 hours before being shared publicly. The nature of the work that was happening on Indic Languages initiatives
was
shared (including the kinds of discussions and how these discussions were being conducted) and that Shiju will shortly start sharing the updates of language discussions with the community. The learnings process of the India Education Program was shared -
including
the fact that data gathering was going to be commenced and that the learnings would inform the next steps of the project. Nitika will
shortly
update the community about how these learnings were going to be gathered. It was reiterated that the plans going forward would be finalized only
after
a thorough review of the program was conducted. It was proposed to identify potential areas where the Chapter EC and
India
Programs would work collaboratively.
Chapter Update
Arjun said that it is essential to have clarity on the focus areas of WMF and identify projects where WMF and WMIN could work together. Arun
suggested
the need for a governance framework for the various activities in India. Arjun summarized the focus of Wikimedia India on Wiki academies and Strengthening City/Language SIGs. Preliminary discussions around Regional Conferences, GLAM, Wiki loves monuments and Knowledge Kiosks are in progress. He explained how Knowledge Kiosks pilot, where visitors to public
libraries
can access Wikipedia through tablet computers in the language of their choice can be a great help for reaching out to the population, who can't afford computers and Internet. He suggested that it can be a good collaborative project and requested India programs support. India
programs
could take care of program management and dealing with Library
organizations
and vendors. Chapter would help in training library personnel and users
in
the various pilot locations. Hisham suggested inviting fellowships for
such
a project. Arjun opined that organizational help is really needed to do such projects. It is agreed to have further discussions on this topic
after
sharing additional information. Wednesday November 23rd (Voice Conference) [Arjun, Arun, Naveen,
Sudhanwa &
Hisham]
India Programs Update Ambiguity around the two entities "India Programs" and "India Trust" were clarified. India Programs is the team of consultants (currently, Hisham, Shiju & Nitika) who are working as consultants to WMF. Once the funding
for
the Wikimedia India Program Trust is sorted out (after the appropriate funding has the necessary approvals), these consultants will transition
to
the Trust. Until then, the Trust is an organisation that has been registered by has no funds available and therefore will not undertake any activities An update was shared the the Trust was going to be filing for the
necessary
taxation related applications (Sections 12A and 80G) as well as FCRA Prior-Permission in the next few days. An update will be shared after
these
have been done. A discussion was made on the Chapter EC proposal for Chapter & India Programs to work together on the Knowledge Kiosks initiative of the
Chapter.
India Programs indicated their preference not to work on projects that require such intensive effort in infrastructure building (both hardware
and
connectivity.) It was also recommended that the Chapter carefully
consider
their involvement in such initiatives especially given the kind of effort that will be required in stuff like procurement. It was proposed that the Chapter EC and India Programs work
collaboratively
on at least 2 broad areas: supporting community outreach & community building (especially volunteer mobilization) as well PR & social media
with
Chapter EC. Both areas are aspects where India Programs can bring capability to the table and are areas of interest to members of the
Chapter
EC. An update was shared on the meeting with the Ministry of HRD regarding potential collaboration with Aakash tablet. The meeting was extremely positive and holds potential. Hisham will be sharing an update to the community on the next steps on this after some additional discussions. It was proposed that a discussion commence that will collaboratively
arrive
at a draft document that provide clarity to how Chapter EC and the India Trust can work together. This will be in the nature of definition of
roles.
Chapter Update Arjun said that with the kind of resources that the India Programs Trust will have access, it can take up challenging projects like Knowledge
Kiosks
as it can certainly outsource stuff that can not done by Trust. It is
agreed
to continue the discussion on this topic. Best
hisham
-- Sent from my mobile device
Regards, Srikanth Ramakrishnan. Wikipedia Coimbatore Meetup on December 10th. http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Meetup/Coimbatore
Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
On Sun, Dec 11, 2011 at 11:07 AM, Srikanth Ramakrishnan < parakara.ghoda@gmail.com> wrote:
Thank you for your explanation for the explanation Arjuna, but I still have a question. What feedback are you looking for?
If the proposed public communication were to contain specific role for the Chapter or expectations from the Chapter or some statement about the understanding reached with Chapter, the same could be agreed through this feedback mechanism.
Cheers Arjun
Responding to both Srikanth R & Arjun's responses.
hisham
On Dec 11, 2011, at 11:07 AM, Srikanth Ramakrishnan wrote:
Thank you for your explanation for the explanation Arjuna, but I still have a question. What feedback are you looking for?
On 11/12/2011, Arjuna Rao Chavala arjunaraoc@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Srikanth R,
Please allow me to share my view.
On Sat, Dec 10, 2011 at 11:39 PM, Srikanth Ramakrishnan < parakara.ghoda@gmail.com> wrote:
Hisham, I don't understand why the Executive Committee offer to be informed 48 HOURS in advance of the community. Isn't Wikipedia a community based system? If the chapter or trust is everything then what is the community sitting here to do? I know I sound rude, but I fail to understand why some people get prior preference.
Srikanth R: It is indeed a community-based system and it is the community that is "everything"!, and yes, everyone is equal. My thinking when I had volunteered the advance notice idea was a combination of continuing to build stronger communication with the Chapter, facilitating better co-ordination with the Chapter , professional courtesy to the Chapter as well as to get their advice and counsel in case we were not on the right track. The idea of 48 hours was just to give some time to look and reflect and feedback. In any case, the information would be shared with the community at large after the 48 hours - and it would hopefully be better that way. As a community member, you should hopefully have better thought out and better communicated initiatives through this.
Especially after I spend an entire day talking to newcomers telling them that everyone in Wiki is equal.
Thank you taking time out for this session!
I am some times puzzled by assumption that people have about Wikipedia policies for individuals related to editing a wiki page online apply equally to real world Wikimedia organisations with accountabilties to various stakeholders including Government. I am also concerned about the assumed separation between community and chapter based on some recent mails to the India list.
Let me elaborate my thoughts on this.
Chapter members including EC members are part of community and serve Community and the movement. It is just the level and structure of engagement of a person that determines whether he/she is part of Chapter. If a person reads Wikipedia, he/she is member of community. If a person contributes to Wikipedia, he/she is part of smaller subset of communitycalled editors. If a person would like to promote Wikipedia in real world, he could do as an individual or become a member of chapter, leverage the benefits of the legal entity called "Wikimedia chapter", get affiliated with SIGs and contribute.
Chapter IRC is open for everyone. Even membership is open for every Indian aged above 18. So I would request everyone to treat Chapter as a subset of community with more focus on growing the movement in real world.
Completely agree with Arjun.
Coming to your specific question about the plan for sharing public communications in advance, here is my view. As I understand, Trust is an independent legal entity contributing to Wikimedia movement in India. So the coordination calls are a mechanism to share plans and issues so that the overall effectiveness can be improved. Advance notice for any public communication was agreed so that each entity could provide the other feedback if any, if such communication were to attribute some things to the other or lead to confusion in the stakeholders. It is mutual. I am sorry the minutes did not reflect the same, though it was discussed and agreed.
Srikanth R: As clarified by Arjun, the Chapter will also be sharing information to India Programs - and I'll be happy to give my feedback to them on anything they send. It'll help in co-ordination and make sure that the action (of India Programs or India Chapter) is appropriate and is appropriately communicated.
Hope the above helps. I request Hisham to share his view as well.
On Sat, Dec 10, 2011 at 23:39, Srikanth Ramakrishnan < parakara.ghoda@gmail.com> wrote:
Hisham, I don't understand why the Executive Committee offer to be informed 48 HOURS in advance of the community. Isn't Wikipedia a community based system? If the chapter or trust is everything then what is the community sitting here to do? I know I sound rude, but I fail to understand why some people get prior preference. Especially after I spend an entire day talking to newcomers telling them that everyone in Wiki is equal.
Srikanth,
Real world is cruel. So the Chapter / Trust might not want to AGF with community / outside world and hence have set some mechanisms. While they are sometimes on the firing line(like what happened on Conference with agitation), its not always that every damn thing requires closed communication / not assuming good faith. But the question of drawing the line depends on which side of the fence you are sitting. You will understand more on hierarchy / "everyone being equal" as you see more of outside world. If you are against hierarchy, just don't be a part of it. But you cant complain its existence, sadly thats how the offline world is. At the end of the day, Chapter / Trust which ever organization cannot do things without community support / goodwill on Wiki Projects, so don't take this too much into yourself. There have been several incidents of community outrage whenever an organization(both internal to movement and external like Google/Microsoft/most recently the Harvard) tried to involve citing mutual benefits. Its just part of the game, when it goes to extreme of hurting the community, the community will stand up and shout. Bala had proposed an interesting talk on the same lines at Conference CfP, but he couldn't make it. May be he may write more.
Logic, thanks for your explanation. I asked th question only after talking to both Pradeep and more importantly Bala at our meetup yesterday. Had they not pointed out, I wouldn't've bothered asking.
On 11/12/2011, Srikanth Lakshmanan srik.lak@gmail.com wrote:
On Sat, Dec 10, 2011 at 23:39, Srikanth Ramakrishnan < parakara.ghoda@gmail.com> wrote:
Hisham, I don't understand why the Executive Committee offer to be informed 48 HOURS in advance of the community. Isn't Wikipedia a community based system? If the chapter or trust is everything then what is the community sitting here to do? I know I sound rude, but I fail to understand why some people get prior preference. Especially after I spend an entire day talking to newcomers telling them that everyone in Wiki is equal.
Srikanth,
Real world is cruel. So the Chapter / Trust might not want to AGF with community / outside world and hence have set some mechanisms. While they are sometimes on the firing line(like what happened on Conference with agitation), its not always that every damn thing requires closed communication / not assuming good faith. But the question of drawing the line depends on which side of the fence you are sitting. You will understand more on hierarchy / "everyone being equal" as you see more of outside world. If you are against hierarchy, just don't be a part of it. But you cant complain its existence, sadly thats how the offline world is. At the end of the day, Chapter / Trust which ever organization cannot do things without community support / goodwill on Wiki Projects, so don't take this too much into yourself. There have been several incidents of community outrage whenever an organization(both internal to movement and external like Google/Microsoft/most recently the Harvard) tried to involve citing mutual benefits. Its just part of the game, when it goes to extreme of hurting the community, the community will stand up and shout. Bala had proposed an interesting talk on the same lines at Conference CfP, but he couldn't make it. May be he may write more.
-- Regards Srikanth.L
wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org