(Fwding to Commons list as well)
Hmm... as a Commons admin I find this very interesting. Does it imply that the universal login is really in sight? We can only hope! :)
I hope that the universal login does bring with it some kind of universal talk page "you have new messages...somewhere" notice. Most Commons users don't check their Commons talk pages with any regularity and thus don't receive their image warnings, and feel quite slighted when their copyvios/unsourced images are deleted. Any opportunity to reduce that would be welcome.
I guess I would say that it's a good idea, except it would very welcome if en.wp (and any other projects that do this) would consider "donating" a few admins/keen users to help us out on copyvio patrol. For non-English projects this is especially essential - it is just so fantastic to have a native speaker around to be able to ask/tell them, "you deal with this person, please" :)
Also Commons is, I think, a little more stringent in its application of free image requirements (that is, when we notice).
Last concern is that Commons really requires uploaders to categorise their images, something that is not so necessary on en.wp. Luckily there are a couple of tools to help with this, perhaps one of these could be worked into the interface somehow. See the recent commons-l archive for links.
Brianna
Message: 4 Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 16:05:28 +0100 From: "Rob Church" robchur@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Mediawiki-l] [WikiEN-l] Upload by default to Commons? To: "English Wikipedia" wikien-l@wikipedia.org, wikitech-l@wikimedia.org, "MediaWiki announcements and site admin list" mediawiki-l@wikimedia.org Message-ID: e92136380605030805n7ccef094r346d29ca168037f3@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
[Cross-post to wikien-l, wikitech-l and mediawiki-l; apologies for duplication]
On 03/05/06, Steve Bennett stevage@gmail.com wrote:
Hi all, The "Upload file" link in the left pane of monobook still takes you to the page for uploading an image to the English wikipedia. In most cases, it would be more helpful to be uploading the image to Commons (US fair use being the notable exception).
Since I notice that certain other wikipedias at least make a commons upload link equally prominent, is it time we considered removing the upload-to-EN link entirely, or hiding it somewhere for those that really do want to upload fair use images? And instead, provide a link to upload to commons?
Allow me to recall a #mediawiki anecdote from about a week ago. A user new to the software wanted to set up about three wikis using a fourth as a mini version of our Commons (their own implementation); the "usage" side had been established, but the user queried whether or not uploads from all wikis could be diverted to the new.
Given that the "slave" wikis would all have access to the "master" database (excuse the confusing mix of terminologies for those who are placing this into 'SQL context), I considered it wouldn't be too difficult.
Now for the relevant bit. It's been discussed before, a little, and I touched upon it in a recent discussion sparked off from the newbie's questions...but it could be feasible for us to replace our Special:Upload pages with something a bit more intelligent. Making use of the licencing dropdowns, we could, I think, redirect free images to Commons in a seamless fashion (after checking existence and providing a courteous note to the user, of course).
This has advantages and disadvantages. The user's upload experience is simple, and the image can be used as before without trouble. On the other hand, deliberate or accidental mis-selection of the licence [cw]ould result in an influx of non-free materials arriving on the Commons.
Nevertheless, I think the idea has potential, and it's something I might be interested in helping to hack together in the future. I'll throw it out here and see what people think. And since I'm at it, I'll cross-post to mediawiki-l and wikitech-l, too.
Rob Church
Message: 6 Date: Wed, 03 May 2006 17:35:14 +0200 From: Filip Maljkovic dungodung@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Mediawiki-l] [WikiEN-l] Upload by default to Commons? To: MediaWiki announcements and site admin list mediawiki-l@Wikimedia.org Cc: English Wikipedia wikien-l@wikipedia.org, wikitech-l@wikimedia.org Message-ID: 4458CDB2.90706@gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Rob Church wrote:
[snip] Now for the relevant bit. It's been discussed before, a little, and I touched upon it in a recent discussion sparked off from the newbie's questions...but it could be feasible for us to replace our Special:Upload pages with something a bit more intelligent. Making use of the licencing dropdowns, we could, I think, redirect free images to Commons in a seamless fashion (after checking existence and providing a courteous note to the user, of course).
That's a brilliant idea. I'd really like to see it implemented. Not only for English Wikipedia, but for all Wikimedia projects.
This has advantages and disadvantages. The user's upload experience is simple, and the image can be used as before without trouble. On the other hand, deliberate or accidental mis-selection of the licence [cw]ould result in an influx of non-free materials arriving on the Commons.
Even though I'm not a Commons expert, I can deduce that Commons too has a problem with wrong licenses, hence some of the deletion.
[snip]
Filip
P.S. Sorry for doubleposts... I used Reply to all
Message: 7 Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 16:53:22 +0100 From: "Rob Church" robchur@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Mediawiki-l] [WikiEN-l] Upload by default to Commons? To: "MediaWiki announcements and site admin list" mediawiki-l@wikimedia.org Message-ID: e92136380605030853v488e0b4btf0e62fa9f0d6275b@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
On 03/05/06, Filip Maljkovic dungodung@gmail.com wrote:
That's a brilliant idea. I'd really like to see it implemented. Not only for English Wikipedia, but for all Wikimedia projects.
If it wasn't clear that that was the implication, then I apologise.
Even though I'm not a Commons expert, I can deduce that Commons too has a problem with wrong licenses, hence some of the deletion.
Yes, but how much extra workload would it produce, and would the benefits outweigh the disadvantages?
Rob Church
Message: 8 Date: Wed, 03 May 2006 17:58:41 +0200 From: Filip Maljkovic dungodung@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Mediawiki-l] [WikiEN-l] Upload by default to Commons? To: MediaWiki announcements and site admin list mediawiki-l@Wikimedia.org Message-ID: 4458D331.1020104@gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Rob Church wrote:
On 03/05/06, Filip Maljkovic dungodung@gmail.com wrote:
Even though I'm not a Commons expert, I can deduce that Commons too has a problem with wrong licenses, hence some of the deletion.
Yes, but how much extra workload would it produce, and would the benefits outweigh the disadvantages?
I think they would. But that's just my opinion and I can see why you have doubts about this. It'd be a step that could have a great impact in the future. I'm interested in what others think, though.
Filip
On 04/05/06, Brianna Laugher brianna.laugher@gmail.com wrote:
(Fwding to Commons list as well)
Hmm... as a Commons admin I find this very interesting. Does it imply that the universal login is really in sight? We can only hope! :)
Ask the mage Vibber, for he shall cast the glorious charm of single sign-on and bring joy to our fingertips and hope to our hearts. Or something equally soppy.
I hope that the universal login does bring with it some kind of universal talk page "you have new messages...somewhere" notice. Most Commons users don't check their Commons talk pages with any regularity and thus don't receive their image warnings, and feel quite slighted when their copyvios/unsourced images are deleted. Any opportunity to reduce that would be welcome.
That isn't in the current plans as far as I know, although it would be damn useful. (See http://svn.wikimedia.org/viewvc/mediawiki/trunk/CentralAuth/evil-plans.txt for those, to some extent.)
I guess I would say that it's a good idea, except it would very welcome if en.wp (and any other projects that do this) would consider "donating" a few admins/keen users to help us out on copyvio patrol. For non-English projects this is especially essential - it is just so fantastic to have a native speaker around to be able to ask/tell them, "you deal with this person, please" :)
Also Commons is, I think, a little more stringent in its application of free image requirements (that is, when we notice).
Last concern is that Commons really requires uploaders to categorise their images, something that is not so necessary on en.wp. Luckily there are a couple of tools to help with this, perhaps one of these could be worked into the interface somehow. See the recent commons-l archive for links.
A limited list of categories *could* be provided in a drop-down box. It wouldn't be feasible to load all categories, for performance reasons, but the main ones could be defined in a message somewhere and used to build a nice list, as with the licence selector.
Rob Church
mediawiki-l@lists.wikimedia.org