I see the Foundation has withdrawn their support for the Wikimedia Chapters Association, the cross-chapters partnership that WMUK backed. Their statement included some significant criticisms about the way the WCA has been implemented, something that individual Foundation board members expanded on in their personal comments further down the page.
I understand that the WCA Council is meeting on 16th February to discuss this but I wanted to ask if WMUK was planning to review its involvement in the WCA and to review for itself what went wrong in its implementation?
Thanks,
Andrew
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikimedia_Chapters_Association#WMF_Boar...
WMF Board letter regarding the Chapters Association
At our February 2 Board meeting, we spent several hours discussing the proposed Chapters Association and its potential role in the Wikimedia movement.
Despite our initial optimism, we have now reluctantly concluded that the proposed Chapters Association is unlikely to advance the Wikimedia mission significantly. We encouraged the concept in its early stages, but in light of the implementation to date, we regretfully have come to believe it will not be successful.
In our opinion, the Chapters Association hasn’t made a persuasive case that it will be effective. We believe that during its development thus far, it has not consulted sufficiently with movement stakeholders. We are concerned that it will not be equipped to offer oversight, which would be essential for an entity expected to provide governance support and oversight for the chapters. Considering its proposed role in the movement as well as the demand it would place on movement resources, we believe these factors are decisive.
Our reservations about the Chapters Association are serious, and we have difficulty envisioning circumstances in which the Wikimedia Foundation would be able to recognize it. That said, we believe in individuals and movement entities organising themselves to support each other, and that successful models for this exist.
We are acting now because of the recent call for hiring of the Secretary General by the Chapters Association and its apparent plans to incorporate soon.
We acknowledge that significant time and effort have been put into this initiative, and understand that some people will be disappointed by this conclusion. We welcome your comments.
For the Wikimedia board, Kat Walshhttps://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Mindspillage (spill your mind?) https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Mindspillage 05:26, 5 February 2013 (UTC)
On 6 February 2013 21:07, Andrew Turvey andrewrturvey@googlemail.com wrote:
I see the Foundation has withdrawn their support for the Wikimedia Chapters Association, the cross-chapters partnership that WMUK backed.
To be honest, it never really offered any support in the first place... they said they liked the idea, but that's as far as it got. They haven't withdrawn their support, they've said they aren't going to be giving any support - subtly different!
That's an interesting way of putting it! However, now that the WMF has come out against, is there any way that the WCA can fulfill its stated aims? Furthermore, if WMUK continues to support the WCA, will this damage the chapter's relationship with the Foundation? On Feb 6, 2013 9:12 PM, "Thomas Dalton" thomas.dalton@gmail.com wrote:
On 6 February 2013 21:07, Andrew Turvey andrewrturvey@googlemail.com wrote:
I see the Foundation has withdrawn their support for the Wikimedia
Chapters
Association, the cross-chapters partnership that WMUK backed.
To be honest, it never really offered any support in the first place... they said they liked the idea, but that's as far as it got. They haven't withdrawn their support, they've said they aren't going to be giving any support - subtly different!
Wikimedia UK mailing list wikimediauk-l@wikimedia.org http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org
On 6 February 2013 23:08, Andrew Turvey andrewrturvey@googlemail.com wrote:
That's an interesting way of putting it! However, now that the WMF has come out against, is there any way that the WCA can fulfill its stated aims? Furthermore, if WMUK continues to support the WCA, will this damage the chapter's relationship with the Foundation?
The key issue will be funding. The FDC deducted from all the applications any amount intended to be contributed to the WCA and there was a suggestion that the WCA would apply directly to the FDC for funds. I think we can safely assume that won't be happening now. That may mean the FDC will be willing to fund the WCA through chapters, at least once there is a clear budget (that was one of the main reasons they rejected that part of the applications - chapters were just making wild guesses about the amounts). Of course, that would put them on a collision course with the WMF board, who have to approve the FDC's recommendations. Would the WMF board overrules the FDC over it? I have no idea. I also have no idea if the FDC would risk it.
If the FDC doesn't approve funding, chapters can fund the WCA out of their FDC grants anyway (they are unrestricted grants), although they may not want to risk future FDC grants by doing so. The WCA can also be funded by non-WMF money. Only WMDE has a significant amount of that at the moment, and much of it is restricted (mainly to Wikidata), but I know WMUK has been investigating other revenue streams and I'm sure other chapters are too. Without access to WMF funds, the FDC may need to scale down its plans a little, but there doesn't seem to be much appetite for large scale spending anyway. It could probably make do with £100k p.a. if it had to, which works out at an average of £2.5k per chapter (presumably with more coming from wealthier chapters and less from the others), which should be easily achievable.
As long as the FDC can get the funding it needs, there is no reason it can't function as planned. WMF support would make it easier, but isn't essential. Representing the views of the chapters in discussions with the WMF is the only part of its planned activities that involve the WMF, and I don't think the WMF can really refuse to talk to it if that's what the chapters want. (There are plenty of examples of big businesses trying to break unions - it tends not to end well for the big businesses.)
Would continuing to support the WCA harm WMUK's relationship with the WMF? Perhaps, but the only way I can really see that happening is if WMUK funds it out of an FDC grant contrary to the FDC's wishes and there are ways around that.
I put discussing the WCA on this weekend's board meeting agenda a while back. However, the context has obviously changed a lot now. I've just added an agenda item about the current situation, which will hopefully be accepted by the rest of the board. Fæ's already agreed to provide an update at the meeting.
Thanks, Mike
On 6 Feb 2013, at 23:08, Andrew Turvey andrewrturvey@googlemail.com wrote:
That's an interesting way of putting it! However, now that the WMF has come out against, is there any way that the WCA can fulfill its stated aims? Furthermore, if WMUK continues to support the WCA, will this damage the chapter's relationship with the Foundation?
On Feb 6, 2013 9:12 PM, "Thomas Dalton" thomas.dalton@gmail.com wrote: On 6 February 2013 21:07, Andrew Turvey andrewrturvey@googlemail.com wrote:
I see the Foundation has withdrawn their support for the Wikimedia Chapters Association, the cross-chapters partnership that WMUK backed.
To be honest, it never really offered any support in the first place... they said they liked the idea, but that's as far as it got. They haven't withdrawn their support, they've said they aren't going to be giving any support - subtly different!
Wikimedia UK mailing list wikimediauk-l@wikimedia.org http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list wikimediauk-l@wikimedia.org http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org
On 06/02/13 23:08, Andrew Turvey wrote:
That's an interesting way of putting it! However, now that the WMF has come out against, is there any way that the WCA can fulfill its stated aims? Furthermore, if WMUK continues to support the WCA, will this damage the chapter's relationship with the Foundation?
Foundation support for Chapters? When did that start? The German chapter was formed and the Foundation watched other Chapters form..... as I recall.
Gordo
On 6 February 2013 23:08, Andrew Turvey andrewrturvey@googlemail.com wrote:
Furthermore, if WMUK continues to support the WCA, will this damage the chapter's relationship with the Foundation?
I would have thought the way to find out about this would be for someone able to speak for WMUK to consult someone able to speak for the WMF.
Charles
wikimediauk-l@lists.wikimedia.org