You guys sure take your time, but thank you for doing the right thing eventually!
One question: you said you won't agree to the "mass-deletion of content", does that mean you are deleting some content, just not a large amount? The arguments you make apply to small amounts of content just add much as they do large amounts. On Aug 15, 2012 9:25 PM, "James Forrester" jdforrester@gmail.com wrote:
All,
Over the past few months a number of individuals have asked for some, many, or all e-mails they have written to be removed from the archives. In general, our answer has been a holding 'no', but the mailing list's archives were nevertheless temporarily hidden from view. This was unsatisfactory in a number of ways, and we regret our failure to communicate to the list what was happening. On behalf of all of the UK Wikimedia mailing list's administrators, I would like to apologise, and explain.
As a public mailing list, there is no reasonable expectation of privacy on WikimediaUK-l or any other public Wikimedia-hosted list. Anyone who thinks otherwise is misleading themselves and those to whom they communicate these views. As has been noted before, the act of deletion is very much "blowing up the stable after the horse has bolted": deleting e-mails from the WMF-hosted archives will at best flag them to certain individuals as containing information that is worth ferreting out from the many other archives that are not under our control in any way.
Indeed, deleting e-mails is problematic in a number of ways:
- it hides the institutional knowledge that the mailing list's archives
contain;
- it gives an utterly false sense of security to people concerned
about their privacy;
- it turns an open forum into one where users are unsure about what to
expect in terms of repeatability; and
- it is difficult and resource-expensive to achieve, and risks
breaking the mailing list server for all of the hundreds of WMF-hosted lists.
We will not agree to keeping the lists pseudo-private, or to the mass-deletion of content. We understand that this may concern some users, but we cannot wave a magic wand and fix what is broken. If some users find that this means that they are unable or unwilling to continue to contribute to this list, we are saddened, but would note that similar (and often far stronger) privacy issues are involved in other forms of online engagement, such as visiting most commercial websites, using instant messaging or editing Wikipedia.
The sign-up page for this mailing list[0] is not as clear as it could be as to the general nature of a mailing list, hailing as it does from the days when this was expected prior knowledge of anyone stumbling over the page. We will adjust it to be more explicit about the instant public dissemination and (in practical terms) irrevocable, distributed, permanent public archiving of all messages sent to a public list; this e-mail is also part of that user education work.
For the WikimediaUK-l volunteer mailing list admins,
James F.
[0] - https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
James D. Forrester jdforrester@gmail.com [[Wikipedia:User:Jdforrester|James F.]] (speaking purely in a personal capacity)
Wikimedia UK mailing list wikimediauk-l@wikimedia.org http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org