Le 16/02/2017 à 05:20, Karen Broome a écrit :
Hello,
I know you haven’t heard from me in awhile and I hope this e-mail is
recognized by the list.
No problem as far as I'm concerned, email is for
asynchronous
discussions. :)
I was the original registrant of the ISO “gsw” tag. I’ve read the
discussion page for this, but only in assisted translation, though I
can parse the French OK. I’d also add that I registered this tag maybe
10 years ago and suggested this change on the Wikipedia shortly
afterward before I ever joined Langcom. I think that might have been
how I ended up here? :)
These points may help clarify some things:
1. The “gsw” tag is what’s appropriate for Alsatian, Schweizerdeutsch,
and Alemannic. Those are considered to be dialects of the same
language continuum. It is a bit of an unusual tag in that it does
indicate a range of related dialects. Any discussion of Swabian
relates to what ISO considers a separate language.
Ref:
http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-2/php/langcodes-keyword.php?SearchTerm=…
Ok, thank you for the link and the clarification.
2. The IETF tags discussed are more specific than the ISO code and can
be used to distinguish the three named variants above by region — if
that is useful. This is one case where allowing the IETF tagging could
be very useful, IMHO, but not sure where the group stands with respect
to that. However, it should be noted that there is more than one
dialect of GSW just in Germany. But there are other variant tagging
options for that. That could be preferable. I can’t say.
Well, at least for
wiktionnary, it seems that it might be an interesting
possible solution.
3. But ISO codes are not assigned by region. It appears that someone
is questioning why other languages spoken in Alsace are not part of
the same tag? There, I may have lost something in translation. The
Amish language discussed is also considered distinct, but would have
to look up the code.
Well I will look back at the discussion to be sure, but
basically there
are many dialect and subdialects in the region. It also says that one of
the subdialect (alemán coloniero) is used by a diaspora among which an
"important" Amish US community.
4. Those familiar with these dialects should be clear that gsw and
gsw-CH are not used to describe High German as written in Switzerland
for formal purposes. They describe the more casual dialect used in
informal situations that is not easily understood by speakers of High
German.
Yes, that's totally clear that it's about casual dialect. :)
In any event, “gsw” certainly seems to be a better tag than “als.”
Just some question as to whether the Wiki contains a specific variant
that could be identified with more specific tagging and whether we
want to allow that. I will look through the discussion more closely. I
could provide a better answer if I knew more about the community that
works on this and which variant is primarily used, or whether the
dialect variants are mixed throughout the Wikipedia. Hope this helps.
Yes, thank
you Karen
Regards,
Karen Broome
On Feb 8, 2017, at 2:09 AM, mathieu stumpf guntz
<psychoslave(a)culture-libre.org
<mailto:psychoslave@culture-libre.org>> wrote:
By the way, we use "als" (
https://als.wikipedia.org/) for Alemannic
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alemannic_German> whose ISO 639-3 is
"gsw". Should we do something about that ?
There are active discussions on Alemannic language*s*
<https://fr.wiktionary.org/wiki/Sp%C3%A9cial:Recherche?search=gsw&prefix=Wiktionnaire%3AWikid%C3%A9mie&fulltext=Rechercher+dans+les+archives+de+la+Wikid%C3%A9mie&fulltext=Search>
on the French Wikitionnary, with a good summary of the situation
<https://fr.wiktionary.org/wiki/Wiktionnaire:Wikid%C3%A9mie/janvier_2017#Que_faire_de_l.27alsacien_.3F>
and solution proposals by Lyokoï. Discussions are following works
around the project "langues de France
<https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Projet:Langues_de_France>", especially
lingualibre <http://www.lingualibre.fr/>, and various support from
OLCA (/Office pour la Langue et la Culture d’Alsace/, Office for the
Language and Culture of Alsace) which provided active help in finding
location to host the next Wikiconvention francophone
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/WikiConvention_francophone/2017/fr>.
There are also some discussion on "gsw" on the Alemanic Wikipedia
<https://als.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spezial:Suech?search=gsw&prefix=Wikipedia%3AStammtisch%2F&fulltext=Archiv+dursueche&fulltext=Search&searchToken=agupy8m0zs1u98f6wtoje1n9a>.
Bis bàll,
Mathieu
Le 02/02/2017 à 16:50, Danny B. a écrit :
Hello,
here is the summary of ISO 639-3 annual changes:
Retirements (= the following codes no longer exist)
* 5 simple retirements
** prb / Lua'
** puk / Pu Ko
** rie / Rien
** rsi / Rennellese Sign Language
** snh / Shinabo
* 3 merged retirements
** jeg / Jeng -> oyb /Oy
** skk / Sok -> oyb / Oy
** krm / Krim -> bmf / Bom-Kim
* 1 split language
** kgd / Kataang -> ncq / Northern Katang + sct / Southern Katang
Additions (= the following codes have been added)
* 8 newly created languages not previously associated with another
language in the code set
** gie / Gaɓogbo
** ibh / Bih
** lth / Thur
** npx / Noipx
** nql / Ngendelengo
** szs / Solomon Islands Sign Language
** ukk / Muak Sa-aak
** xdo / Kwandu
* 2 newly created languages created by splitting the previously existing
** ncq / Northern Katang (ex kgd / Kataang)
** sct / Southern Katang (ex kgd / Kataang)
Updates
* 8 name updates, either change to a name form or addition of a name
form
** blv: Bolo -> Kibala
** bmf: Bom -> Bom-Kim
** cug: Chung -> Chungmboko
** klw: Lindu -> Tado
** krr: Kru'ng 2 -> Krung
** lgn: Opuuo -> T'apo
** ngt: Ngeq -> Kriang
** ovd: Övdalian -> Elfdalian
* 2 denotation updates of a language into which another variety or
two was merged
** oyb (+jeg, +skk)
** bmf (+krm)
Kind regards
Danny B.
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