I've certainly made that mistake before! Although, 7 years late is
impressive... Where did you find the email?
I'm curious now, does anyone know what ended up happening with the Norsk
Wikipedias?
On Apr 1, 2012 9:16 AM, "Gerard Meijssen" <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Hoi,
It did not trigger me that it was that old. If I had I would not have
answered it.
Thanks,
Gerard
On 1 April 2012 02:22, M. Williamson <node.ue(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Gerard, on my e-mail this shows as a reply to an
e-mail thread from 2005.
Was this your intention?
2012/3/21 Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com>
> Hoi,
> There is a process for the start of new projects and for the start of
new
> language versions. This is a formal process
and it does not involve the
> voting of people. What it does involve is the existence of languages
> recognised in the ISO-639-3. As such Norwegian, or the no /nor code is
> considered a macro-language and does not qualify for a new project.
>
> It is explicitly understood that by
no.wikipedia.org we expect it to
be
Bokmal.
Thanks,
GerardM
http://translatewiki.net/wiki/Portal:No
2005/4/25 Bjarte Sørensen <bjarte.sorensen(a)gmail.com>
> Dear all,
>
> Most of you would be aware of some of the discussions that have
occurred
> > around Wikipedia in the Norwegian languages. Since the last round of
> > discussions on this list, there has been a lot of internal debate, as
> > well as what seems to be a fairly widely accepted agreement following
> > voting.
> >
> > This e-mail intends to, after a brief recap on Norwegian language and
> > wikipedia issues, take those interested through the latest
development
> > and will stake out the road ahead. It
is also intended to inform the
> > international community about the current agreement on no.wikipedia,
so
> > as to prevent misunderstandings in the
future.
> >
> > Finally, we will mention an unfortunate reaction to the vote by a
small
>
number of users at the Norwegian Bokmål/Riksmål (no:) wikipedia who
want
> to disregard the result of the voting and
are planning to create a
> _third_ Norwegian wikipedia with the sole mission of mixing the
contents
> > of the two current Norwegian versions.
> >
> > == A short language history of Norway ==
> >
> > Spoken Norwegian ("norsk") (ISO 639-2 alpha-2 code "no") is
in a
fairly
> > unique situation compared to most other
languages of the world in
that
> > it has two widely accepted written
standards, Bokmål (ISO 639-2
alpha-2
> > code "nb") and Nynorsk (ISO
639-2 alpha-2 code "nn"). By national
> > legislation they are both regarded as official written forms of
> > Norwegian. In addition, many people still make a distinction between
> > Bokmål and its precursor which still is in use, Riksmål.
> >
> > Briefly speaking, Bokmål and Riksmål are descendants of the Danish
> > written language. Until the 1800s, Danish was the only widely used
> > written language in Norway as a result of four centuries of union
with
> > Denmark. With increasing independence
came a wish to norwegianise the
> > Danish standard, with Knud Knudsen at the forefront for changing
parts
> > of the vocabulary and orthographics.
Thus, Riksmål, and later Bokmål,
> > resulted. These forms together are today probably used by about 90%
of
>
Norway's population, or somewhere around 3,500,000 people.
>
> Parallel to this development, a new written standard was created by
Ivar
> > Aasen. He travelled extensively throughout Norway, and based his new
> > language, landsmål, on the grammar and vocabulary of dialect samples
> > from around the country. This was later renamed Nynorsk. Modern
Nynorsk
>
differs significantly from modern Bokmål, and may be linguistically
> looked upon as as different (or as similar if you like) as Swedish is
to
> > Danish. For English or Dutch/German speakers, the differences may be
> > likened to those between (Lowland) Scots and English or Low German
and
> > Dutch. Today it is estimated that about
500,000-600,000 people have
> > Nynorsk as their first written language.
> >
> > More information about the Norwegian language history can be found in
> > English, German, French, Spanish or Portuguese on the website of the
> > Norwegian Language Council:
> >
http://www.sprakrad.no/templates/Page.aspx?id=653
> >
> > == A short history of Wikipedia in Norwegian ==
> >
> > The first Norwegian wikipedia started 26 November 2001 on the
subdomain
>
no.wikipedia.org. As most wikipedias, its contributor and article
count
> started really picking up around the end of
2003. At the time, it
> accepted all written standards of Norwegian, although the amount of
> Nynorsk was minimal. There were already several debates about the
> feasibilty and appropriateness of keeping the two languages united on
> one Wikipedia. On 31 July 2004 a Wikipedia for Nynorsk was created.
>
> The creation of nn:, however, split the community at no: wikipedia.
Many
> > felt that given that Nynorsk now had its own wikipedia, no: should
> > become a Bokmål/Riksmål Wikipedia only. Others disapproved and
claimed
> > that there was no need to change and
that it should continue its
> > language policy of accepting all and keep its interwiki link name of
> > "Norsk".
> >
> > Nynorsk Wikipedia soon proved a success, as it within the next few
> > months gathered several people who had felt uncomfortable in the
> > (mainly) Bokmål environment at no:. The name displayed in interwiki
> > links became "Norsk (nynorsk)" (languages are not spelt with upper
case
> in
Norwegian). To date it continues to be one of the fastest growing
> wikipedias, with a steady article increase, now at over 6000 articles
> and >50 editors with more than 10 edits since arrival.
>
> == Votes ==
>
> The issue of no:'s language policy has come up time and again, and a
> vote was held in March ([[:no:Wikipedia:Målform]]) as to which policy
to
> adapt. Independent of the method of the
tally (whether or not to
include
> > new contributors etc.) there was a majority for switching to a
> > Bokmål/Riksmål only language policy (50% for Bokmål/Riksmål, 43.2%
for
>
Bokmål/Riksmål/Nynorsk/Høgnorsk, and 6.8% for the official variants
> Bokmål/Nynorsk only).
>
> Following this result, there is now going to be a vote on which
> interwiki link name will most appropriately reflect the current
language
> policy of no:. The result of this vote will
most likely be either
"Norsk
> (bokmål)" or "Norsk
(bokmål/riksmål)".
>
> Understandably, there has also been a debate as to whether the
subdomain
> > should change from "no" to "nb", as this is the correct
representation
> > of Bokmål according to ISO 639-2.
However, there is some resentment
> > towards such a move and currently a general acceptance in letting the
> > Bokmål wikipedia stay at "no". The alternative some have suggested
is a
> > server-side redirect from
"no" to "nb", in the same way that "nb"
today
> is a
server-side redirect to the equivalent page on "no".
>
> == Summary of the problem ==
>
> Unfortunately, a small group of users (who all write Bokmål/Riksmål)
are
> ignoring the results from the vote, and are
claiming they want to
> re-establish a wikipedia for all written standards of Norwegian. They
> claim they have been in touch with people centrally in Wikimedia
> (developers? stewards?) and that they have so far received positive
> comments. With this email, we would like to state the fact that there
> have been no official decisions about creating a third Norwegian
> wikipedia containing both Bokmål and Nynorsk, it is merely an
unofficial
> > initiative from a small group of users which started a sign-on list
at
>
[[:no:Bruker:Norsk_Wikipedia]]. A spontaneous list with signatures
> against this activity was immediately created at
> [[:no:Wikipedia-diskusjon:Fellesnorsk]]. The process of creating a
third
> > Norwegian wikipedia has not gone through a voting process in any of
the
> > two existing Norwegian wikipedias (no:
and nn:) and can not be
> > considered as a decision by the Norwegian Wikipedia community.
> >
> > We believe the creation of a third wikipedia under the Wikimedia
> > foundation would have a serious and unfortunate impact on the
existing
> > wikipedias in Norwegian, no: and nn:,
and would undermine Wikipedia's
> > reputation in Norway. This being said, we are all for extensive co-
> > operation between the four Scandinavian language wikipedias
(including
>
Swedish and Danish), as evident by the recent creation of
> [[:meta:Skanwiki]], the Scandinavian meta-pages, and the use of
featured
> > articles from neighbour wikipedias.
> >
> > == Conclusion ==
> >
> > Hopefully, this letter will help people better understand the
> > complicated language situation of the Norwegian Wikipedia community,
so
> > as to give a background on which
discussion can take place on this
list
> > in the future, such as the inevitable
debate following a possible
> > request for a re-establishment of the common (and third!) Norwegian
> > Wikipedia.
> >
> > >From the community of
no.wikipedia.org and
nn.wikipedia.org,
> >
> > Bjarte Sørensen [[:meta:User:BjarteSorensen]]
(Administrator/bureaucrat
on
> nn:)
> Lars Alvik [[:no:User:Profoss]] (Administrator/bureaucrat on no:)
> Øyvind A. Holm [[:no:User:Sunny256]] (Administrator on no:)
> Onar Vikingstad [[:no:User:Vikingstad]] (Administrator on no:)
> Jon Harald Søby [[:no:User:Jhs]] (Administrator on no:)
> Chris Nyborg [[:no:User:Cnyborg]] (Administrator on no:)
> Guttorm Flatabø [[:no:User:Dittaeva]] (Administrator on nn:)
> Gunleiv Hadland [[:meta:User:Gunnernett]] (Administrator on nn:)
> Jarle Fagerheim [[:nn:User:Jarle]] (Administrator on nn:)
> Øyvind Jo Heimdal Eik [[:en:User:Pladask]] (Administrator on nn: and
no:)
Kristian
André Gallis [[:nn:User:Kristaga]]
Vegard Wærp [[:no:User:Vegardw]]
Nina Aldin Thune [[:no:User:Nina]]
Thor-Rune Hansen [[:no:User:ThorRune]]
Claes Tande [[:no:User:Ctande]]
Arnt-Erik Krokaa [[:no:User:AEK]]
Rune Sattler [[:no:User:Shauni]]
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