After having left this discussion open for another two weeks (just about), I think it is safe to say that there is no consensus within LangCom to close this wiki.
Steven
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________________________________ From: Langcom langcom-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org on behalf of langcom-request@lists.wikimedia.org langcom-request@lists.wikimedia.org Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2018 7:31 AM To: langcom@lists.wikimedia.org Subject: Langcom Digest, Vol 55, Issue 21
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Closure of Malagasy Wikibooks (Oliver Stegen) 2. Re: Closure of Malagasy Wikibooks (Oliver Stegen)
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Message: 1 Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2018 13:08:40 +0200 From: Oliver Stegen oliver_stegen@sil.org To: langcom@lists.wikimedia.org Subject: Re: [Langcom] Closure of Malagasy Wikibooks Message-ID: a27b4c2d-9939-b038-25f2-36e5c2cf4b49@sil.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"
I am also against closing mg:wb, i.e. transferring it to the incubator. I don't read the outcome of the discussion as a "unanimous" advice to LangCom to lock the project. There really is only one strong support for closure, one weak (and very apologetic!) support and then there's is Jagwar, the only consistently active user at mg:wb, who sounds more resigned to his lone stance without support for his efforts. I've looked at the content, and especially the pages on explaining Python (granted, seven sections may not make a complete book) are an excellent example of how to go about WikiBooks in a LWC (language of wider communication). While I agree that *absence* of content since wiki creation would be a reason for closure, I don't see *absence* of content. Those seven sections on Python (I've counted the four pages of Python/Teny as one section) are content enough for me to allow mg:wb to continue at its project site.
Cheers, Oliver
On 15-Apr-18 10:57, Gerard Meijssen wrote:
Hoi, I am against. Thanks, GerardM
On 15 April 2018 at 10:47, MarcoAurelio <strigiwm@gmail.com mailto:strigiwm@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello. If I am allowed, I'd like to signal that the community advices LangCom to lock the project unanimously in the PCP page, not for inactivity (which indeed is not a valid reason) but for absence of content since the wiki creation, which it is a valid reason per policy to do so. Regards, M. 2018-04-11 8:22 GMT+02:00 Oliver Stegen <oliver_stegen@sil.org <mailto:oliver_stegen@sil.org>>: I'm happy with the action that Steven took, including the recent re-opening of the discussion (for clarity's sake). LangCom appointed him clerk for the kind of activity which he brings to the table (and for which LangCom members' activity like mine are too sporadic to make LangCom effective - see multiple complaints over the years). Closing projects policy was revised after our May 2011 meeting exactly so that "closing a project is no longer easier than opening one". In the case of Malagasy Wikibooks, I vote for rejecting the proposal to close precisely because inactivity alone is not a sufficient reason for closure. There's no harm in keeping it open, and it would be more work to close it (if I understand matters correctly). In the hope that this can be re-resolved quickly (and without yet more bureaucracy), Oliver On 10-Apr-18 23:14, Steven White wrote:Look, I'm not trying to make trouble, nor to ramrod my opinions. With thanks to members who supported my approach, I am going to revert the closure of the discussion. Before I do that, I will just point out that I think I have followed the rules up to this point. Gerard's willingness to agree to the closure happened in March, while we were still in a discussion phase. He did not comment afterwards, so I wouldn't have characterized what he did as negating my proposal. I do think it is within my purview as clerk to put a proposal on the table. If I stretched a point of the rules at all, it was to hypothesize that a "discussion" during which only one member comments is not sufficient to establish a committee consensus to close an existing project, particularly when its only real problem is inactivity. But maybe that's not correct; that needs to be discussed. I would also point out to Marco that per policy, the community's role in such matters is advisory, not binding. Whether or not it should apply to this particular case, the Board and LangCom have expressed a general point of view that they would rather keep projects open than to close them, provided that the project is not full of vandalism. So while the community does seem to support the closure, LangCom need not follow the community's advice, although it certainly may do so. Closing projects policy <https://eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fmeta.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FClosing_projects_policy&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6d7cf78902064ef00b4a08d5a2c466b0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636593886781064248&sdata=D0HR6eTRm0wiy9rcU%2BICA%2BwECX2pSziY5su6M%2BfrKWM%3D&reserved=0> normally does not involve an actual vote; it is supposed to close on consensus. Again, my perspective is that a consensus discussion to close a project that is not vandalized requires more than one voice. If members disagree, then please say so. (And I'd point out that frequently we allow a single voice to mark a project request as "eligible" or "rejected"; I just think existing projects deserve a little stronger benefit of the doubt.) So let's let this run for at least another week, to April 17, and see what else people have to say about it. 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