I went to check on the state of my contributions to chr.wikipedia.orghttp://chr.wikipedia.orgthis morning and found the Main Page and 19 others have had their content replaced with a Speedy Deletion notice accompanied, in many but not all cases, by something along the lines of "Wrong language". Now it's true that much of the content in the Cherokee (better, Tsalagi) Wikipedia has been in English, and many of these pages doubtless needed culling, but to eliminate the Main Page (part of which was in Tsalagi) or several others (e.g. Europe ᎡᎶᏆ http://chr.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E1%8E%A1%E1%8E%B6%E1%8F%86 and United States Supreme Courthttp://chr.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Supreme_Court) where the process of Tsalagisation was underway) strikes me as vandalistic.
I have reverted the main page (several of whose sections should probably be eliminated and the rest fully tsalagised) and will look at restoring others that may have hope.
I've been talking up Wikipedia in Tsalagi groups (e.g. Yahoo groups like Tsalagi and AniTsalagi_Language) trying to get folks to give up their Cherokee National fonts long enough to acquire Unicode so they can participate here, and I have been in negotiation with the Seattle Public Library to get them to add Cherokee Unicode fonts so I (and others) can participate here from the public access terminals, and I'm sorry but 217.44.22.219 http://217.44.22.219's approach here is costly. In particular the speedy deletion of the Main Page of a Wikipedia that does have content strikes me as reprehensible, and to do so without replying to the disagreements voiced in the Talk Page is I don't know, what's a good NPOV term?
Haruo = dzidzelalic @ chr:
On 7/31/05, Ros' Haruo rosharuo@gmail.com wrote:
I went to check on the state of my contributions to chr.wikipedia.orghttp://chr.wikipedia.orgthis morning and found the Main Page and 19 others have had their content replaced with a Speedy Deletion notice accompanied, in many but not all cases, by something along the lines of "Wrong language".
Of the ones I checked, all but the Main Page were in the wrong language, so I don't see the tagging them of such as vandalism. The Main Page itself obviously needs more work from people who can write Cherokee, but it wasn't completely English, and not a candidate for speedy deletion, so that may have been vandalism or just a bad faith edit.
The wiki only has one admin, Etse, who hasn't edited since last October.
Angela.
Angela says the Main Page is not a candidate for speedy deletion, but it is (and remains so after my reversion) because I cannot access the notice to remove it either on the edit page or at the category page. The notice is on the Main Page under "Selected Anniversaries" (and I would agree that "Selected Anniversaries" could use deletion—but not the main page, for crying out loud. What concerns me is that if I went in now and edited, say "Europe" (ᎡᎶᏆ) so that it was all (except the speedy deletion notice) in Tsalagi and had several good sentences of content and a map or something, so that it clearly was *not* a candidate for speedy deletion under the received criteria, there's still no way I could remove the notice, so it would remain a candidate for speedy deletion, and the process could result in the elimination of a perfectly good Cherokee article. See my comments/venting at http://chr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Speedy_deletions I apologize if my terming this "vandalism" is too extreme. Haruo = dzidzelalic 9 days till Indigenous Peoples Day!
Ros, this doesn't strike me as vandalism.
I've done similar things before, although not to the same degree (I haven't nominated mainpages, or pages which were partly in the right language).
However, even those parts of this which strike me as being a bit extreme, I am sure were made in good faith.
I do think that most of the pages so labelled should indeed be purged, but you are certainly right that some should not.
Cheers Mark
On 31/07/05, Ros' Haruo rosharuo@gmail.com wrote:
I went to check on the state of my contributions to chr.wikipedia.orghttp://chr.wikipedia.orgthis morning and found the Main Page and 19 others have had their content replaced with a Speedy Deletion notice accompanied, in many but not all cases, by something along the lines of "Wrong language". Now it's true that much of the content in the Cherokee (better, Tsalagi) Wikipedia has been in English, and many of these pages doubtless needed culling, but to eliminate the Main Page (part of which was in Tsalagi) or several others (e.g. Europe ᎡᎶᏆ http://chr.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E1%8E%A1%E1%8E%B6%E1%8F%86 and United States Supreme Courthttp://chr.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Supreme_Court) where the process of Tsalagisation was underway) strikes me as vandalistic.
I have reverted the main page (several of whose sections should probably be eliminated and the rest fully tsalagised) and will look at restoring others that may have hope.
I've been talking up Wikipedia in Tsalagi groups (e.g. Yahoo groups like Tsalagi and AniTsalagi_Language) trying to get folks to give up their Cherokee National fonts long enough to acquire Unicode so they can participate here, and I have been in negotiation with the Seattle Public Library to get them to add Cherokee Unicode fonts so I (and others) can participate here from the public access terminals, and I'm sorry but 217.44.22.219 http://217.44.22.219's approach here is costly. In particular the speedy deletion of the Main Page of a Wikipedia that does have content strikes me as reprehensible, and to do so without replying to the disagreements voiced in the Talk Page is I don't know, what's a good NPOV term?
Haruo = dzidzelalic @ chr:
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Mark, you're right, my use of the word "vandalism" was hyperbolic, occasioned by my irritation at finding pages that contained more Cherokee now than they did a month ago deleted and replaced with the bald comment "wrong language" and a speedy deletion notice that seemingly couldn't be removed (Angela has since found out why I couldn't remove the notices, apparently it was because the {{stub}} template had been replaced with a {{delete}} notice itself! It was the effect of this replacement that prompted me to cry not merely vandalism but "bizarre" vandalism)...
I quite agree that the articles that are simply copies of English articles, in English, about topics not particularly central to Tsalagi cultural reality (e.g. the Pakistani motif, or Sid Vicious), ought to be removed. A special case, I think, is the Wilma Mankiller article, which is so far mostly in English but is a topic as important to cover in a Cherokee general encyclopedia as, say, Winston Churchill in an English one. I am hopeful that in the next few weeks that article will be significantly improved as to content and POV as well as degree of tsalagisation.
Haruo = dzidzelalic
On 7/31/05, Mark Williamson node.ue@gmail.com wrote:
Ros, this doesn't strike me as vandalism.
I've done similar things before, although not to the same degree (I haven't nominated mainpages, or pages which were partly in the right language).
However, even those parts of this which strike me as being a bit extreme, I am sure were made in good faith.
I do think that most of the pages so labelled should indeed be purged, but you are certainly right that some should not.
Cheers Mark
On 31/07/05, Ros' Haruo rosharuo@gmail.com wrote:
I went to check on the state of my contributions to chr.wikipedia.org http://chr.wikipedia.orghttp://chr.wikipedia.orgthis
morning and found the
Main Page and 19 others have had their content replaced with a Speedy Deletion notice accompanied, in many but not all cases, by something along the lines of "Wrong language". Now it's true
that
much of the content in the Cherokee (better, Tsalagi) Wikipedia has been
in
English, and many of these pages doubtless needed culling, but to
eliminate
the Main Page (part of which was in Tsalagi) or several others (e.g.
Europe
ᎡᎶᏆ http://chr.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E1%8E%A1%E1%8E%B6%E1%8F%86 and
United
States Supreme Court<http://chr.wikipedia.org/wiki
/United_States_Supreme_Court>)
where the process of Tsalagisation was underway) strikes me as
vandalistic.…
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