The page was moved on 09:53, 9 August 2016
and the first comment on the talk page was only on 7 August 2016 (UTC)
There were discussions before that too. Have been following it.
I am just concerned about a 'change in page name' being used as a form of
censorship of the talk record.
Can someone show me a way to access the 'talk' of the earlier page please?
Assuming that can be done?
On 23 February 2017 at 14:37, Andre Engels <andreengels(a)gmail.com> wrote:
The discussion page was moved together with the page
discussion is still on the discussion page of the new page.
On Mon, Feb 20, 2017 at 10:18 AM, Frederick FN Noronha फ्रेड्रिक
नोरोन्या *فريدريك نورونيا <fredericknoronha(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Continuing a thread from some time back:
Is it possible to get back the earlier discussion from this page
prior to it being shifted?
(The page was earlier called Journalist Richard Gutjahr)
After the name was changed, the earlier discussion is not easily
accessible, or someone visiting a page would not get an idea of what was
said about it.
I'm concerned that there might be some systemic flaw with the way the
Wikipedia works here.
Any change of name in a page could result in the loss of all the earlier
discussion, or make it difficult to find. Even if it's very relevant to
page as currently renamed.
Please note, that this page has since got a "may not meet Wikipedia
notability guidelines" tag, which I think could be a sign of things going
wrong due to a flaw in how the software works.... and the fact that the
earlier discussion is not easily accessible now.
On 23 December 2016 at 20:25, Ben Salvidrim <benoit_landry(a)hotmail.com>
> "Redirecting" an article normally means editing the article to replace
> content with "#REDIRECT
[[Target]]". It shouldn't affect the talk page
> What might be confusing is that, for example, if you redirect [[Foo]] to
> [[Bar]] (by editing [[Foo]]'s content to be "#REDIRECT [[Bar]]"), by
> afterwards navigating to the [[Foo]] page you are automatically
> to [[Bar]] (that's the whole point),
which means the "Talk" tab at the
> will lead to [[Talk:Bar]]. The talk page for
[[Foo]] is still at
> [[Talk:Foo]] but to access it, you will need to either navigate to it
> directly, or if you go to [[Foo]] and it loads [[Bar]], you should have
> note under the page header that says
"(Redirected from [[Foo]])", where
> can click on the link to [[Foo]] and thus
load the [[Foo]] page without
> being redirected, and then the "Talk" tab will lead to [[Talk:Foo]].
> Hopefully that makes sense! If you tell us exactly what page you're
> talking about we'll be able to help you more precisely.
> ~ Ben / Salvidrim!
> · English Wikipedia Administrator & SPI Clerk
> · Wikimedia Canada member
> · UTRS Ambassador
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Wikipedia-l [mailto:email@example.com] On
> Behalf Of Frederick FN Noronha ????????? ???????? *??????? ???????
> Sent: 23 déc. 2016 03:09
> To: Wikipedia mailing list <wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org>
> Subject: Re: [Wikipedia-l] Losing the 'talk' discussion on a page....
> This happened with me once. I redirected a page (for entirely legitimate
> reasons), and to my surprise and horror found that the 'Talk' page
> accompanying it had more or less vanished, and could not longer be
> accessed. Maybe it was still available
somewhere, but it was not easy
> find, nor was it linked to the main entry of
> My intention in this case was not to hide the Talk page (since it had
> valuable discussion, and multiple points of
view on it).
> It just struck me that if there was some controversial content, the best
> way anyone wanting to block or censor it (the Talk page) would be to
> redirect a page!
> My question: (i) are the earlier talk pages easily find-able after a
> has been redirected elsewhere? (ii) is there
some way they can be made
> prominent, so that the earlier discussion is also available for the
> Thanks and regards,
> On 22 December 2016 at 21:15, Ben Salvidrim <benoit_landry(a)hotmail.com>
> > If you tell us what page you’re talking about Frederick, we might be
> > able to help you locate the talk page you can’t find. ☺
> > ========================================
> > ~ Ben / Salvidrim<https://salvidrim.net/>
> > · English Wikipedia Administrator & SPI Clerk
> > · Wikimedia
> > Canada<https://ca.wikimedia.org/wiki/Main_Page>
> > member
> > · UTRS
> > Ambassador<https://utrs.wmflabs.org/team.php#tamb>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Wikipedia-l [mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org] On
> > Behalf Of Ynhockey
> > Sent: 22 déc. 2016 10:25
> > To: Wikipedia mailing list <wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org>
> > Subject: Re: [Wikipedia-l] Losing the 'talk' discussion on a page....
> > The person who moves the page can specify whether the talk page moves
> > with it, so either it moves with the actual page, or stays behind with
> > the old title. In any case it isn't deleted.
> > —Yan (User:Ynhockey).
> > On Thu, Dec 22, 2016 at 12:01 AM, Frederick FN Noronha फ्रेड्रिक
> > नोरोन्या *فريدريك نورونيا <fredericknoronha(a)gmail.com<mailtomailto:
> > fredericknoronha(a)gmail.com>> wrote:
> > > Is this a bug or is it a feature?
> > >
> > > Just wanted to know what happens to the 'talk' section of a
> > > Wikipedia
> > > entry once (or if) a page gets shifted.
> > >
> > > I noticed that the earlier discussions (that might have come up via
> > > the
> > > Talk) just disappears.
> > >
> > > Now, this isn't very helpful. Because all the earlier talk seems to
> > > be
> > > untraceable, and there is a complete vacuum about what was said
> > >
> > > If anyone wishes, this system can be abused (for instance, to cover
> > > earlier discussions... by simply changing the title of the page).
> > >
> > > Am I missing something here?
> > >
> > > FN
> > >