Lojban Wikibooks<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new_languages/Wikibooks_Lojban>: To be honest, this request was made by someone who is, well, a gadfly in the RFL area. That said, this conlang has a Wikipedia already, so I have to take it as being presumptively eligible. At this point, the "test" currently has a single (main) page half in English, created by this user. Unless you have a different opinion, I plan to put this request on hold to see if anyone will actually contribute.
Sindhi Wikinews (reopen)<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new_languages/Wikinews_Sindhi>: This request was filed in April. One (different) user created two pages in February. Otherwise pretty dormant recently. Placing on hold to see if there is a real interest.
Simple English Wikiquote (reopen)<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new_languages/Wikiquote_Simple…>: Request was created by someone now blocked as an LTA. The request page generally shows the community opposed, except for the creator and one IP user. Planning to reject, with the suggestion that if there is really an interest, people should go to either English Wikiquote or to Simple English Wikipedia to try to incubate a test within one of those projects. (That said, I happen to know that SE Wikipedia has no interest.)
Piedmontese Wikisource<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new_languages/Wikisource_Piedm…>: Has been online and active for a while, and has over 1,000 pages of content. Marking as eligible. Will probably get to the question of whether it is actually approvable sometime next month.
Ancash Quechua Wiktionary<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new_languages/Wiktionary_Ancas…>: In February, we marked the Wikipedia test in this language as eligible. This language and code is serving as the de facto consolidation point for a number of Quechua varieties in Ecuador and neighboring Peru, and is based to a great extent on a standardized language being developed in Ecuador. Incubator test has a fair amount of content. Marking as eligible.
Minangkabau Wiktionary<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new_languages/Wiktionary_Minan…>: Wikipedia in this language was created from Incubator in 2013. Test project is being started now. Marking as eligible.
Steven
Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook>
It seems that the only objection that has surfaced so far is from Michael: that there might not be a font available for this purpose—at least available consistent with the license requirements that we have. So Satdeep, I guess there are two tasks for you now:
* Can you determine whether there are any suitable fonts available? You can start here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Multilingual_support#Ol_Chiki, but a couple of the links are dead, and at least one is surely a commercial font.
* Since this is the first project up for approval in the language, can we get an expert in to evaluate the project?
Steven
Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook>
There are fonts developed by C-Dac. One font was developed through Subhashish at CIS-A2K.
I can share olchiki font developed by C-Dac.
On April 23, 2018, at 10:31 PM, Satdeep Gill <satdeepgill(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I have tried with sending emails to topic language experts. I will continue that.
I will find out about the font as well.
On Mon, Apr 23, 2018, 6:55 PM Steven White <Koala19890(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
It seems that the only objection that has surfaced so far is from Michael: that there might not be a font available for this purpose—at least available consistent with the license requirements that we have. So Satdeep, I guess there are two tasks for you now:
Can you determine whether there are any suitable fonts available? You can start here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Multilingual_support#Ol_Chiki, but a couple of the links are dead, and at least one is surely a commercial font.Since this is the first project up for approval in the language, can we get an expert in to evaluate the project?
Steven
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After having left this discussion open for another two weeks (just about), I think it is safe to say that there is no consensus within LangCom to close this wiki.
Steven
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Closure of Malagasy Wikibooks (Oliver Stegen)
2. Re: Closure of Malagasy Wikibooks (Oliver Stegen)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2018 13:08:40 +0200
From: Oliver Stegen <oliver_stegen(a)sil.org>
To: langcom(a)lists.wikimedia.org
Subject: Re: [Langcom] Closure of Malagasy Wikibooks
Message-ID: <a27b4c2d-9939-b038-25f2-36e5c2cf4b49(a)sil.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"
I am also against closing mg:wb, i.e. transferring it to the incubator.
I don't read the outcome of the discussion as a "unanimous" advice to
LangCom to lock the project. There really is only one strong support for
closure, one weak (and very apologetic!) support and then there's is
Jagwar, the only consistently active user at mg:wb, who sounds more
resigned to his lone stance without support for his efforts. I've looked
at the content, and especially the pages on explaining Python (granted,
seven sections may not make a complete book) are an excellent example of
how to go about WikiBooks in a LWC (language of wider communication).
While I agree that *absence* of content since wiki creation would be a
reason for closure, I don't see *absence* of content. Those seven
sections on Python (I've counted the four pages of Python/Teny as one
section) are content enough for me to allow mg:wb to continue at its
project site.
Cheers,
Oliver
On 15-Apr-18 10:57, Gerard Meijssen wrote:
> Hoi,
> I am against.
> Thanks,
> GerardM
>
> On 15 April 2018 at 10:47, MarcoAurelio <strigiwm(a)gmail.com
> <mailto:strigiwm@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Hello. If I am allowed, I'd like to signal that the community
> advices LangCom to lock the project unanimously in the PCP page,
> not for inactivity (which indeed is not a valid reason) but for
> absence of content since the wiki creation, which it is a valid
> reason per policy to do so. Regards, M.
>
> 2018-04-11 8:22 GMT+02:00 Oliver Stegen <oliver_stegen(a)sil.org
> <mailto:oliver_stegen@sil.org>>:
>
> I'm happy with the action that Steven took, including the
> recent re-opening of the discussion (for clarity's sake).
> LangCom appointed him clerk for the kind of activity which he
> brings to the table (and for which LangCom members' activity
> like mine are too sporadic to make LangCom effective - see
> multiple complaints over the years).
>
>
> Closing projects policy was revised after our May 2011 meeting
> exactly so that "closing a project is no longer easier than
> opening one". In the case of Malagasy Wikibooks, I vote for
> rejecting the proposal to close precisely because inactivity
> alone is not a sufficient reason for closure. There's no harm
> in keeping it open, and it would be more work to close it (if
> I understand matters correctly).
>
>
> In the hope that this can be re-resolved quickly (and without
> yet more bureaucracy),
> Oliver
>
>
>
> On 10-Apr-18 23:14, Steven White wrote:
>>
>> Look, I'm not trying to make trouble, nor to ramrod my
>> opinions. With thanks to members who supported my approach, I
>> am going to revert the closure of the discussion.
>>
>>
>> Before I do that, I will just point out that I think I
>> have followed the rules up to this point. Gerard's
>> willingness to agree to the closure happened in March, while
>> we were still in a discussion phase. He did not comment
>> afterwards, so I wouldn't have characterized what he did as
>> negating my proposal. I do think it is within my purview as
>> clerk to put a proposal on the table. If I stretched a point
>> of the rules at all, it was to hypothesize that a
>> "discussion" during which only one member comments is not
>> sufficient to establish a committee consensus to close an
>> existing project, particularly when its only real problem is
>> inactivity. But maybe that's not correct; that needs to be
>> discussed.
>>
>>
>> I would also point out to Marco that per policy, the
>> community's role in such matters is advisory, not binding.
>> Whether or not it should apply to this particular case, the
>> Board and LangCom have expressed a general point of view that
>> they would rather keep projects open than to close them,
>> provided that the project is not full of vandalism. So while
>> the community does seem to support the closure, LangCom need
>> not follow the community's advice, although it certainly may
>> do so.
>>
>>
>> Closing projects policy
>> <https://eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fmeta.wiki…>
>> normally does not involve an actual vote; it is supposed to
>> close on consensus. Again, my perspective is that a consensus
>> discussion to close a project that is not vandalized requires
>> more than one voice. If members disagree, then please say so.
>> (And I'd point out that frequently we allow a single voice to
>> mark a project request as "eligible" or "rejected"; I just
>> think existing projects deserve a little stronger benefit of
>> the doubt.) So let's let this run for at least another week,
>> to April 17, and see what else people have to say about it.
>>
>>
>> Steven
>>
>>
>> Sent from Outlook <https://eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Faka.ms%2Fw…>
>>
>>
>> <https://eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.avg.co…>
>> Virus-free. https://eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=www.avg.com&data=02%7C0…
>> <https://eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.avg.co…>
>>
>>
>> <#m_4284120631935571393_m_4414387168066765486_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
>>
>>
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Look, I'm not trying to make trouble, nor to ramrod my opinions. With thanks to members who supported my approach, I am going to revert the closure of the discussion.
Before I do that, I will just point out that I think I have followed the rules up to this point. Gerard's willingness to agree to the closure happened in March, while we were still in a discussion phase. He did not comment afterwards, so I wouldn't have characterized what he did as negating my proposal. I do think it is within my purview as clerk to put a proposal on the table. If I stretched a point of the rules at all, it was to hypothesize that a "discussion" during which only one member comments is not sufficient to establish a committee consensus to close an existing project, particularly when its only real problem is inactivity. But maybe that's not correct; that needs to be discussed.
I would also point out to Marco that per policy, the community's role in such matters is advisory, not binding. Whether or not it should apply to this particular case, the Board and LangCom have expressed a general point of view that they would rather keep projects open than to close them, provided that the project is not full of vandalism. So while the community does seem to support the closure, LangCom need not follow the community's advice, although it certainly may do so.
Closing projects policy<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Closing_projects_policy> normally does not involve an actual vote; it is supposed to close on consensus. Again, my perspective is that a consensus discussion to close a project that is not vandalized requires more than one voice. If members disagree, then please say so. (And I'd point out that frequently we allow a single voice to mark a project request as "eligible" or "rejected"; I just think existing projects deserve a little stronger benefit of the doubt.) So let's let this run for at least another week, to April 17, and see what else people have to say about it.
Steven
Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook>
Marco, with due respect, I first posted a notice on this on March 19. I let it run until April 2. Up to that point, the only member of LangCom (other than me) who had commented substantively was Gerard. Then on April 2 I announced that if I didn't hear anything else from anyone in another week, I was going to close as rejected. And I heard nothing else, even from Gerard. So on April 9 I marked as rejected. That fulfilled all requirement of the current voting policy.
Frankly, I wish more members of the Committee would take a more active role in discussions. But I am trying very hard not to allow requests to back up, and to work through backlogs. So as long as all requirements of policy have been met, I will continue to move things along.
Steven
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Several updates (MarcoAurelio)
2. Re: Approval for Santali Wikipedia (Michael Everson)
3. Open Wikipedia requests dating to 2011 (fifth and final set)
(Steven White)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2018 22:28:39 +0200
From: MarcoAurelio <strigiwm(a)gmail.com>
To: Wikimedia Foundation Language Committee
<langcom(a)lists.wikimedia.org>
Subject: Re: [Langcom] Several updates
Message-ID:
<CA+DRDAauKMKWhEYz6mMrz0_ow58FHELjOQKBb0U4XY=MnP5NmA(a)mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hi,
>
> Rejecting request to close Malagasy Wikibooks—comment by only one LangCom
member is not sufficient to constitute consensus to close a project that
has no violatons of fundamental rules
>
Sorry but I find this rather innapropriate and contrary to LangCom voting
rules as stated at: <
https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fmeta.wiki…> and the
closure of projects policy decision policy <
https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fmeta.wiki…>.
There has to be a proposal comming from a LangCom member, announced on this
list and to the community, and thereafter a voting has to take place, with
the Board holding ultimate vetoing power.
None of such steps have been taken.
The decision should be reversed as being done against policy.
Thanks, M.
Michael, I have been asked by User:Liuxinyu970226 to bring the following page to your attention: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Multilingual_support#Ol_Chiki
Steven
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Several updates (MarcoAurelio)
2. Re: Approval for Santali Wikipedia (Michael Everson)
3. Open Wikipedia requests dating to 2011 (fifth and final set)
(Steven White)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2018 22:28:39 +0200
From: MarcoAurelio <strigiwm(a)gmail.com>
To: Wikimedia Foundation Language Committee
<langcom(a)lists.wikimedia.org>
Subject: Re: [Langcom] Several updates
Message-ID:
<CA+DRDAauKMKWhEYz6mMrz0_ow58FHELjOQKBb0U4XY=MnP5NmA(a)mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hi,
>
> Rejecting request to close Malagasy Wikibooks—comment by only one LangCom
member is not sufficient to constitute consensus to close a project that
has no violatons of fundamental rules
>
Sorry but I find this rather innapropriate and contrary to LangCom voting
rules as stated at: <
https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fmeta.wiki…> and the
closure of projects policy decision policy <
https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fmeta.wiki…>.
There has to be a proposal comming from a LangCom member, announced on this
list and to the community, and thereafter a voting has to take place, with
the Board holding ultimate vetoing power.
None of such steps have been taken.
The decision should be reversed as being done against policy.
Thanks, M.