No,
But I can expect them to read the mailing list.
Thanks,
GerardM
On 3/5/07, Mark Williamson <node.ue(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I take it, then, that you have informed these people of the reason
their requests are not approved yet?
We can't expect them to be telepathic, after all.
Mark
On 05/03/07, GerardM <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Hoi,
I will be happy to see that you are right once the message files exist.
Thanks,
GerardM
On 3/5/07, Mark Williamson <node.ue(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I'm not protesting it, I am simply saying that obviously nobody is
> aware of this requirement.
>
> The people who are working on these projects are very dedicated, if
> they knew that this requirement existed, you can be sure that it would
> be fixed right away.
>
> Mark
>
> On 05/03/07, GerardM <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hoi,
> > We are now at the stage where we have a policy. We are not
interested
in
> > talking the proposal to death. We are
first going to see how it
> functions.
> > When we find that it does not work, we will tweak things carefully.
The
> lack
> > of having message files for all languages is one of the major
> shortcomings
> > in the current localisation procedures.
> >
> > You may think of it as a technicality or not fair. The point is that
the
> > developers proved to be unwilling to
remedy things in the past (for
> instance
> > for Marathi). The only consequence can be that new projects have to
> > have message
> > files from the start. It is not fair to start new languages that are
> > incomplete; it is not fair to require the localisation to be done
again
> when
> > a new project is requested in the same language.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > GerardM
> >
> >
> >
> > On 3/5/07, Mark Williamson <node.ue(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > I'm not complaining about be.wp, I know that is a difficult
situation
> > > and I do not expect that it can be
resolved soon.
> > >
> > > It doesn't appear that anybody told any of these people that they
are
> > > required to have a message file.
> > >
> > > These requests are simply sitting there, nobody has actually told
> > > these people "We do not see ____, when you get that we will
proceed
> > > further with considerations for
your Wiki."
> > >
> > > These people are very dedicated, I am sure if anyone had actually
told
> > > them what exactly it is that they
need to do to move forward, they
> > > would do it right away. I am sure the messages file would be
> > > translated into Kabyle, for example, in less than a week, if
anyone
> > > had ever actually informed those
people that it is needed.
> > >
> > > - Wls - if there is "no reasonable support", the number of
speakers is
> > > entirely irrelevant, of course the
project is not viable since it
has
> > > 0 articles in the incubator and
nobody currently asking for its
> > > creation (there was only one person who did).
> > > - Twd - this case needs to be probed further to see how much
Twents
> > > people would support it as a Wiki
separate from nds-nl. There are
> > > already over two hundred articles in it, but the majority are at
> > > nds-nl.wp. User:Tubantia indicated preliminary support of such a
> > > request some time ago, so it needs to be re-investigated to see if
> > > this is a viable project or not, and whether the needs of
> > > Twents-speakers are currently being surved by our existing project
> > > (nds-nl)
> > > - Stq - this is obviously a viable project. There is support of
native
> > > speakers, many many pages and very
active on the incubator. So you
> > > want a message file. Why didn't you tell the people working on
this
> > > project? I am sure they would
prepare it in several days.
> > > - Pfl - this project appears to still be in the early stages of
> > > incubator development. At this point in time, I don't expect it to
be
> > > approved by anyone.
> > > - Lld - same as pfl, except I do not expect its development soon.
> > > Someone needs to investigate how well existing users are served by
> > > rm.wp and fur.wp.
> > > - Kok - although this is a major language of India with millions
of
> > > speakers, it is a problem that
there are currently no articles.
I'm
> > > sure Frederick Noronha could
remedy this, though; in the meantime,
I
> > > agree and do not think it would be
reasonable to approve the
project.
> > > - Kab - same as stq.
> > >
> > > Others you failed to mention:
> > >
> > > - Bat-ltg/lv-ltg - same situation as stq.
> > > - Crh - same situation as stq.
> > > - Dsb - same situation as stq.
> > >
> > > It seems that if your rules mean that these Wikis are not able to
be
> > > created now, it is not necessarily
the case that there is no
> > > opposition (although it may be), the case currently is that
_nobody
> > > knows about the rules_. When you
have a new policy with as much
impact
> > > as this one, it is imperative that
it be solicited to all the
persons
> > > and communities to whom it is
relevant, and their opinion awaited.
> > > This is a Wiki, I am sure that even people who support the policy
will
> > > have suggestions for its
improvement, but so far very few have
shown
> > > up because you have not advertised
it much.
> > >
> > > Mark
> > >
> > > On 05/03/07, Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > Mark Williamson schreef:
> > > > > Hello,
> > > > >
> > > > > Perhaps some of you are aware of the formation of the Langcom.
> > > > >
> > > > > Also, you may be aware of the recent reform of the language
> proposal
> > > process.
> > > > >
> > > > > However, what you may not be aware of is that the Language
> Committee
> > > > > is taking a while to actually get underway and to the point
where
> they
> > > > > can excersise control over the creation of new Wikis.
> > > > >
> > > > > Despite that, it seems that they are already looked to as an
> authority
> > > > > in this area, while they do not act as such.
> > > > >
> > > > > There are several new Wikipedia requests which were
> uncontroversial
> > > > > when first posed. Many of dozens of voices of support, and
have
> > > > > thriving tests on the
Incubator.
> > > > >
> > > > > However, their requests were deleted by PathosChild who said
that
> they
> > > > > would have to remake them, which they have. So far, no
proposals
> for
> > > > > Wikipedias in new languages have been _approved_ under the new
> > > > > proposal process, despite its having been around for several
> months
> > > > > now. They just sit there. And sit there. And sit there some
more.
> > > > >
> > > > > I think it's about time something happened. I think it's
about
> time we
> > > > > welcomed these people -- the Kabyles, the Latgalians, the
Lower
> > > > > Sorbians, the Crimeans,
and all the others -- into our
Wikipedia
> > > > > family. They have waited
long enough. Why can't somebody do
> something?
> > > > > Why do they have to wait for the langcom to get underway? For
all
> we
> > > > > know, that could take years.
> > > > >
> > > > > Mark
> > > > Hoi,
> > > > The language committee has proposed things. It does not have the
> power
> > > > to force issues. We are now at the stage where we have published
our
> > > > guidelines. We have given
warning that we do adopt these
guidelines
> as a
> > > > rule if there was no indication of opposition to this. This has
not
> > > > happened. From our POV the
rules as we published them apply.
> > > >
> > > > All projects for a new language that do not have a work in
progress
> in
> > > > the Incubator are denied. Starting in the Incubator is
mandatory.
> > > > Working on the localisation
is a strong factor in favour for
> granting a
> > > > new language a project.
> > > >
> > > > We have some questions outstanding with the board; particularly
> about
> > > > the Belarus Wikipedia. In our opinion only the official Belarus
> > > > Wikipedia has the right to the be.wikipedia label. We have asked
at
> > > > least a month ago for a
resolution of this issue from the board.
We
> do
> > > > not want to take up new things that much if open things do not
get
> > > > resolved. It is a waste of
our time otherwise.
> > > >
> > > > We have already denied one proposal for an artificial languages
that
> has
> > > > no wide support. That one was obvious.
> > > >
> > > > *The wls project has no reasonable amount of support at the
moment,
> > > > there are only 29,768 people
speaking it .. Is this a reasonable
> > > proposal ?
> > > > *The twd project has no reasonable amount of support at the
moment,
> > > > there is not even an
estimation how many people are speaking it
..
> Is
> > > > this a reasonable proposal ?
> > > > *The stq project does not have a message file.. so we cannot
assess
> the
> > > > localisation of the messages
> > > > *The pfl project does not have a message file.. so we cannot
assess
> the
> > > > localisation of the messages. There are insufficient articles of
a
> > > > sufficient length.
> > > > *The lld project does not have a message file.. so we cannot
assess
> the
> > > > localisation of the messages. There are insufficient articles of
a
> > > > sufficient length.
> > > > *The kok project does not have a message file.. so we cannot
assess
> the
> > > > localisation of the messages. There are no articles
> > > > *The kab project does not have a message file.. so we cannot
assess
> the
> > > > localisation of the messages.
> > > >
> > > > So basically from our point of view, it seems that the message
files
are
> > not there. They are required.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > GerardM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > Wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org
> >
http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-l
> >
>
>
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