Hi all,
Andre Engels has recently locked the sh.wikipedia database at the recommendation of Tim Starling, on the grounds that it is "supposed to be dead".
However, if I recall correctly, there is a story behind the continued existance (until now) of the Serbo-Croatian Wikipedia in the shadow of the Serbian, Croatian, and Bosnian Wikipedias, perhaps something along the line of there still being people who push for the usage of the unified form again?
While I realise that much of the content at sh.wikipedia does not belong there, simple locking of a database is no way to deal with inappropriate content, rather it should be discussed with the relevant people who can help fix it in the proper way.
And while Serbo-Croatian may no longer be the official language of a state, it still exists parallel to Bosnian, Serbian, Croatian, and Montenegrin (this may or may not be an actual language, the whole question of these 5 different varieties which are, depending on who you speak to, different languages or different dialects). Bosnian, Serbian, and Croatian are pushed by Bosnian, Serbian, and Croatian nationalists as well as their respective governments, Montenegrin is pushed in Montenegro (Crna Gora) by nationalists but a measure to make Montenegrin rather than Serbian the official language of Montenegro failed. However, something like 30% of the population writes on the census that rather than Serbian they speak Montenegrin. Serbo-Croatian is very controversial, but it is still pushed by some.
Mark
Mark Williamson wrote:
Hi all,
Andre Engels has recently locked the sh.wikipedia database at the recommendation of Tim Starling, on the grounds that it is "supposed to be dead".
I only commented on procedure and policy, not on the fact of the matter itself. Assessment of the facts was performed by others. As I said previously, I'm sick of the continuous discussion of linguistics on wikipedia-l and I wish it could be taken offlist. I've never made any judgement on the status of Serbo-Croatian and I don't intend to start now.
-- Tim Starling
Tim Starling wrote:
Mark Williamson wrote:
Hi all,
Andre Engels has recently locked the sh.wikipedia database at the recommendation of Tim Starling, on the grounds that it is "supposed to be dead".
I only commented on procedure and policy, not on the fact of the matter itself. Assessment of the facts was performed by others. As I said previously, I'm sick of the continuous discussion of linguistics on wikipedia-l and I wish it could be taken offlist. I've never made any judgement on the status of Serbo-Croatian and I don't intend to start now.
How about a separate mailinglist for 'small language wikipedia's' and 'new wikipedia-related projects'?
regards, Gerrit.
Gerrit wrote:
Tim Starling wrote:
Mark Williamson wrote:
Hi all,
Andre Engels has recently locked the sh.wikipedia database at the recommendation of Tim Starling, on the grounds that it is "supposed to be dead".
I only commented on procedure and policy, not on the fact of the matter itself. Assessment of the facts was performed by others. As I said previously, I'm sick of the continuous discussion of linguistics on wikipedia-l and I wish it could be taken offlist. I've never made any judgement on the status of Serbo-Croatian and I don't intend to start now.
How about a separate mailinglist for 'small language wikipedia's' and 'new wikipedia-related projects'?
I doubt that that would work. A significant portion of the people who are likely to work on these are newbies who are may not be familiar with the list. Each language that is considered will have a whole new set of newbies. Once a particular language wiki is implemented that group will lose interest in the mailing list because they will be too busy with their own pedia.
.Ec
Ray Saintonge ti 2004/11/24 EP 12:30 sia-kong:
Gerrit wrote:
How about a separate mailinglist for 'small language wikipedia's' and 'new wikipedia-related projects'?
I doubt that that would work. A significant portion of the people who are likely to work on these are newbies who are may not be familiar with the list.
They (we) are not too stupid to learn, are they?
Each language that is considered will have a whole new set of newbies.
Great -- they could all learn together.
Once a particular language wiki is implemented that group will lose interest in the mailing list because they will be too busy with their own pedia.
Possibly. But I notice the larger WPs have been implemented some time ago and some haven't lost interest in the mailing lists.
My point is NOT that we should have a list for smaller WPs. It is that there's no ground that I am aware of that would indicate a different set of behaviors on the part of small-language Wikipedians, newbies or not. Indeed everyone started a newbie, including yourself. The way to find out if "those" Wikipedians are interested is to _ask_ them, not imagine (in a dismissive way) what they might or might not do or want, as if they were strawmen or -women.
And please don't tell people to find their own "free" mailing list. They've already been told (by you) to install their own wiki.
~~~~
Henry H. Tan-Tenn ti 2004/11/25 ChS 02:59 sia-kong:
Ray Saintonge ti 2004/11/24 EP 12:30 sia-kong:
And please don't tell people to find their own "free" mailing list. They've already been told (by you) to install their own wiki.
Sorry, my apology. It was not you. It was Evan (ESP).
Henry H. Tan-Tenn wrote:
Henry H. Tan-Tenn ti 2004/11/25 ChS 02:59 sia-kong:
Ray Saintonge ti 2004/11/24 EP 12:30 sia-kong:
And please don't tell people to find their own "free" mailing list. They've already been told (by you) to install their own wiki.
Sorry, my apology. It was not you. It was Evan (ESP).
Apology accepted.
Ec
Henry H. Tan-Tenn wrote:
Ray Saintonge ti 2004/11/24 EP 12:30 sia-kong:
Gerrit wrote:
How about a separate mailinglist for 'small language wikipedia's' and 'new wikipedia-related projects'?
I doubt that that would work. A significant portion of the people who are likely to work on these are newbies who are may not be familiar with the list.
They (we) are not too stupid to learn, are they?
Who said they were. You would marginalize them on a mailing list of one.
Each language that is considered will have a whole new set of newbies.
Great -- they could all learn together.
Right! Let the blind lead the blind in mutually unintelligible languages.
My point is NOT that we should have a list for smaller WPs. It is that there's no ground that I am aware of that would indicate a different set of behaviors on the part of small-language Wikipedians, newbies or not. Indeed everyone started a newbie, including yourself. The way to find out if "those" Wikipedians are interested is to _ask_ them, not imagine (in a dismissive way) what they might or might not do or want, as if they were strawmen or -women.
You can't ask anything of a person who isn't here to be asked.
And please don't tell people to find their own "free" mailing list. They've already been told (by you) to install their own wiki.
I have NEVER told anybody to do that. That allegation is bullshit.
Ec
wikipedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org