genocide involves the destorying of culture. americinization is a form of genocide. stop saying that i should be banned for opposing King Jimbo Wales, whoever that is, he probably would rather see the correct name of things, than the same ol americanized crap.
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On Thu, Nov 21, 2002 at 01:01:31AM -0800, Bridget [name omitted for privacy reasons] wrote:
genocide involves the destorying of culture. americinization is a form of genocide. stop saying that i should be banned for opposing King Jimbo Wales, whoever that is, he probably would rather see the correct name of things, than the same ol americanized crap.
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. If you want Americans to stop destroying other cultures, you won't accomplish it be trying to destroy American culture. Americans have as much right to their culture as anyone else has to theirs.
Jonathan
Jonathan Walther krooger@debian.org wrote: On Thu, Nov 21, 2002 at 01:01:31AM -0800, Bridget [name omitted for privacy reasons] wrote:
genocide involves the destorying of culture. americinization is a form of genocide. stop saying that i should be banned for opposing King Jimbo Wales, whoever that is, he probably would rather see the correct name of things, than the same ol americanized crap.
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. If you want Americans to stop destroying other cultures, you won't accomplish it be trying to destroy American culture. Americans have as much right to their culture as anyone else has to theirs.
Jonathan
It might be best not to answer to that kind of message, maybe. See how Lir is trying to irritate each of us in turns. Wikipedians in americans and others. British and others. French and vietnamese. Promoting similar reactions, such as european and americans (hey, Eclecticology, aren't you canadian ?). Bugging people and antagonizing them is just one way some follow to express themselves. They can do so. You can choose not to answer.
I'll be glad if people could agree that - HERE at least - we are more wikipedians than french, american, german or whatever. Let's stick together for godsake ! Learning from each others and recognising our differences will help more for the preservation of each cultural identity than throwing into faces painful assumptions and worn-out statements.
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Well most names like "Munich" were anglicized long before the USA existed. Nowadays we anglicize less - we tend to leave the names of people as they are; if Spanish actor became an international star today, we might call him Christobal Colon; but as it is we're left with past anglicization.
Do you think the French wikipedia should write "london" instead of "londres"?
Bridget [name omitted for privacy reasons] wrote:
genocide involves the destorying of culture. americinization is a form of genocide. stop saying that i should be banned for opposing King Jimbo Wales, whoever that is, he probably would rather see the correct name of things, than the same ol americanized crap.
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Yes, she does. She's said so frequently. Zoe tarquin tarquin@planetunreal.com wrote: Do you think the French wikipedia should write "london" instead of "londres"?
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You know Zoe, most of your posts are a real mystery to me...
Who is she ?
Is it okay to answer "yes she does" to a "do you think this should be" ?
Since when is an encyclopedia talking ?
What is "frequent" ?
Did you ever go on the french wiki and check the "Londres" article (please some bilingual do something for that poor lonesome city...)
I am at a loss really
--- Zoe zoecomnena@yahoo.com wrote:
Yes, she does. She's said so frequently. Zoe tarquin tarquin@planetunreal.com wrote: Do you think the French wikipedia should write "london" instead of "londres"?
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explication: c'etait au sujet de Lir, celle / celui que Jimbo a aujourd'hui barr'e du EN-Wiki.
Lir a monte une campagne contre l'anglicization des noms propres, et aurai voulu qu'on ait, par ex., une page "Munchen" au lieu de "Munich". pour remuer un peu, j'avais dit -- et les autres langues? faut-il qu'elles aussi utilises les noms propres etrangers dans leur forme d'origine? c'etait purement de la rhetorique.
je passerai voir "Londres", mais je previens que j'ai du mal a taper les accents, meme sur mon Mac.
Anthere wrote:
You know Zoe, most of your posts are a real mystery to me...
Who is she ?
Is it okay to answer "yes she does" to a "do you think this should be" ?
Since when is an encyclopedia talking ?
What is "frequent" ?
Did you ever go on the french wiki and check the "Londres" article (please some bilingual do something for that poor lonesome city...)
I am at a loss really
--- Zoe zoecomnena@yahoo.com wrote:
Yes, she does. She's said so frequently. Zoe tarquin tarquin@planetunreal.com wrote: Do you think the French wikipedia should write "london" instead of "londres"?
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--- tarquin tarquin@planetunreal.com wrote:
explication: c'etait au sujet de Lir, celle / celui que Jimbo a aujourd'hui barr'e du EN-Wiki.
Lir a monte une campagne contre l'anglicization des noms propres, et aurai voulu qu'on ait, par ex., une page "Munchen" au lieu de "Munich". pour remuer un peu, j'avais dit -- et les autres langues? faut-il qu'elles aussi utilises les noms propres etrangers dans leur forme d'origine? c'etait purement de la rhetorique.
je passerai voir "Londres", mais je previens que j'ai du mal a taper les accents, meme sur mon Mac.
Super! A part sa jolie photo, cette page est intersid�ralement vide...
Les accents ne sont pas un probl�me. D autres personnes ne les mettent pas non plus car ils sont a l etranger avec un clavier anglosaxon, et je sais combien c est penible. D autres reprennent apr�s ;-)
Par contre, le systeme de "mispeeling" ne marche pas pour les accents. Le terme "l�g�r" n est pas reconnu comme tel, "�gyptien" est confondu avec "egyption".
C'est un bug !
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Les accents ne sont pas un problème. D autres personnes ne les mettent pas non plus car ils sont a l etranger avec un clavier anglosaxon, et je sais combien c est penible. D autres reprennent après ;-)
Par contre, le systeme de "mispeeling" ne marche pas pour les accents. Le terme "légèr" n est pas reconnu comme tel, "égyptien" est confondu avec "egyption".
C'est un bug !
L'interpretation des accents par les ordinateurs est au-delà de mes compréhension. À l'heure actuelle je m'en sers d'un clavier franco-canadien. En effet ça veut dire un clavier ou les lettres sont placées de la façon américaine, avec des clefs spéciales qu'il faut pour écrire le français. Quand-même, je m'en sers avec un logiciel anglais. Pour qu'il fonctionne comme il faut j'aurais besoin de changer des préférences dans mon système, ce qui me causerait de nouvelles peines. Mais je m'habitue, et pour écrire "é", par example, je m'en sers de Alt + 0233. Ça devrait fonctionner car si mon texte est cité dans une réponse, il est tout en forme.
Ce qui me confond sont les textes que je reçois. J'ai bien copié le texte ci-dessus de ton messagee, et les lettres accentées ont l'air bien rendu. Mais dans le courriel que j'ai reçu toutes ces lettres accentées sont représenter pae un espèce de carreau noir contenant un point d'interogation.. Je ne comprends pas comment ça peut arriver.
Eclecticology
I did not have to time to go through all the mails, so I don't know if so raised the subject, but in spite of the changes yesterday the lags on the fr.wiki are horrible. Yesterday evening, it took between 5 to 20 mn to edit a page. I just saved a couple of them then give up.
We had no contributions at all between 21h and 0h which are usually the busiest time of the day. I guess everybody just gave up.
This has been going on for several days now. The day before, we got the message connexion error very often for example.
People are getting very weary, and I am worried that the contributions will drop tremendously if this goes on for a long time. Most contributors are from Europe. Most can only contribute in the evening. If it doesnot go better, they will just stop. Meanwhile, the en.wiki was not accessible for us either. But, I noticed it was still working for some as people were contributing. It was impossible on the french wiki.
I know you do your best. I saw on the announcement, you made some change to improve the matter. Well, yesterday, it was worse than ever : -(((
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On Thu, 2002-11-21 at 22:22, Anthere wrote:
I know you do your best. I saw on the announcement, you made some change to improve the matter.
Bit by bit; problem areas are being identified and optimized. In particular, the slowest operations tend to bog down everything when traffic is high, because other pages have to wait on them to finish.
Right now I'm going through and adding indexes for user id and user name; this *vastly* speeds up the 'user contributions' pages. (Note that as I add the indexes, the various wikis may be briefly unavailable for a few moments.)
I've also just made a tweak to "Most wanted pages" which for the English wiki takes the generation time down from about 90 seconds to about 30. Still too long, but it's an improvement.
Well, yesterday, it was worse than ever : -(((
In the middle of the day the whole database server was bogged down somehow for a while until I killed and restarted Apache and MySQL; this may or may not be related to weird segfaults I was seeing from the PHP cache system when running my experimental RDF generator script (see http://meta.wikipedia.org/wiki/RDF_spool ). (I've disabled it for the meantime on the off chance it was causing trouble.)
-- brion vibber (brion @ pobox.com)
Brion Vibber brion@pobox.com writes:
Bit by bit; problem areas are being identified and optimized. In particular, the slowest operations tend to bog down everything when traffic is high, because other pages have to wait on them to finish.
Please could you tell us which are these slowest operations? Until the speed problem is fixed it would be a good idea, I think, that everybody knows which links he should _not_ klick. Maybe there is a lot goodwilled people can do to (or better avoid) to keep Wikipedia at a reasonable speed.
I really worry that we may loose contributors...
greetings, elian
Are you serious, or are you being facetious? Tarquin's was in response to Lir's comments regarding americanizatin of the Wikipedia. I was responding to was his question to Lir. Zoe Anthere anthere5@yahoo.com wrote:You know Zoe, most of your posts are a real mystery to me...
Who is she ?
Is it okay to answer "yes she does" to a "do you think this should be" ?
Since when is an encyclopedia talking ?
What is "frequent" ?
Did you ever go on the french wiki and check the "Londres" article (please some bilingual do something for that poor lonesome city...)
I am at a loss really
--- Zoe wrote:
Yes, she does. She's said so frequently. Zoe tarquin wrote: Do you think the French wikipedia should write "london" instead of "londres"?
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Sorry, no I was serious. I'm absolutely not a facetious person :-) the top of the message was missing...I just missed a step...boum
Excuse me Zoe
PS : about the strange duplication of messages (apart from potential quadripletion from the tech, the inter, the main and the en), I remember it started when we moved from nupedia to wikipedia.org. Could it be still related ?
--- Zoe zoecomnena@yahoo.com wrote:
Are you serious, or are you being facetious? Tarquin's was in response to Lir's comments regarding americanizatin of the Wikipedia. I was responding to was his question to Lir. Zoe Anthere anthere5@yahoo.com wrote:You know Zoe, most of your posts are a real mystery to me...
Who is she ?
Is it okay to answer "yes she does" to a "do you think this should be" ?
Since when is an encyclopedia talking ?
What is "frequent" ?
Did you ever go on the french wiki and check the "Londres" article (please some bilingual do something for that poor lonesome city...)
I am at a loss really
--- Zoe wrote:
Yes, she does. She's said so frequently. Zoe tarquin wrote: Do you think the French wikipedia should write "london" instead of "londres"?
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now
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http://www.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-l
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I think a lot of the problem has to do with the fact that Yahoo forces us to put our replies at the top instead of interspsersed through the message. If we could do that, it would be much easier to follow. Zoe Anthere anthere5@yahoo.com wrote:Sorry, no I was serious. I'm absolutely not a facetious person :-) the top of the message was missing...I just missed a step...boum
Excuse me Zoe
PS : about the strange duplication of messages (apart from potential quadripletion from the tech, the inter, the main and the en), I remember it started when we moved from nupedia to wikipedia.org. Could it be still related ?
--- Zoe wrote:
Are you serious, or are you being facetious? Tarquin's was in response to Lir's comments regarding americanizatin of the Wikipedia. I was responding to was his question to Lir. Zoe Anthere wrote:You know Zoe, most of your posts are a real mystery to me...
Who is she ?
Is it okay to answer "yes she does" to a "do you think this should be" ?
Since when is an encyclopedia talking ?
What is "frequent" ?
Did you ever go on the french wiki and check the "Londres" article (please some bilingual do something for that poor lonesome city...)
I am at a loss really
--- Zoe wrote:
Yes, she does. She's said so frequently. Zoe tarquin wrote: Do you think the French wikipedia should write "london" instead of "londres"?
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now
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http://www.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-l
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Bridget [name omitted for privacy reasons] wrote:
genocide involves the destorying of culture. americinization is a form of genocide.
However true that may be, it's grossly impolite to say so.
stop saying that i should be banned for opposing King Jimbo Wales, whoever that is, he probably would rather see the correct name of things, than the same ol americanized crap.
Banning threats are not a constructive form of debate.
Jimbo Wales is the fiscal benefactor of this project, but as a monarch is very tolerant of the silliness of some of his subjects. He also has the wisdom of mostly remaining silent in these debates. A lot of the rules in this discussion are not his doing; the evidence does not support an accusation of lese-majesty.
Eclecticology
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