--- Sean Barrett sean@epoptic.org wrote:
We think highly of you, too. However, we refrain from posting mindlessly bigoted rants on mailing lists devoted to the process of building a free encyclopedia.
Yeah, ok, maybe over the top.
But, so you know, I am both a French and US citizen, living in Los Angeles now, but lived in Fort Worth, TX for 8 years. Yeeehaw!
Actually, I would like to address the point along the same line of thought that names of large multinational corporations are shunned on en-wikipedia, to the advantage of the brand name that said corporations used to successfully market their product to the american consumer. How do you explain to somebody that Toyota != Toyota Motor Corporation when their level of expertise is limited to US High School education level?
In any case, I get your point.
Chris Mahan 818.943.1850 cell chris_mahan@yahoo.com chris.mahan@gmail.com http://www.christophermahan.com/
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Christopher Mahan wrote:
How do you explain to somebody that Toyota != Toyota Motor Corporation when their level of expertise is limited to US High School education level?
Is it true that in the US, students are not taught anything about other countries?
- -- Alphax OpenPGP key: 0xF874C613 - http://tinyurl.com/8mpg9 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Alphax There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.' - C. S. Lewis
They are not taught about their own country, or even their own town. In Colorado, at least, they are taught about the state.
Fred
On May 27, 2005, at 2:34 AM, Alphax wrote:
Is it true that in the US, students are not taught anything about other countries?
Fred Bauder said:
On May 27, 2005, at 2:34 AM, Alphax wrote:
Is it true that in the US, students are not taught anything about other countries?
They are not taught about their own country, or even their own town. In Colorado, at least, they are taught about the state.
Who needs geography lessons when you can just watch the Simpsons? :)
On Fri, May 27, 2005 at 06:24:08AM -0700, Sean Barrett wrote:
Tony Sidaway stated for the record:
Who needs geography lessons when you can just watch the Simpsons? :)
At least you'll know where Springfield is, eh?
Actually . . .
I know where Springfield is, but considering how rarely it's mentioned in the show, I'm not sure the regular viewers have any idea.
-- Chad Perrin [ CCD CopyWrite | http://ccd.apotheon.org ]
Tony Sidaway wrote:
Fred Bauder said:
On May 27, 2005, at 2:34 AM, Alphax wrote:
Is it true that in the US, students are not taught anything about other countries?
They are not taught about their own country, or even their own town. In Colorado, at least, they are taught about the state.
Who needs geography lessons when you can just watch the Simpsons? :)
A few years ago there was a news story about a school shooting in the small town of Springfield, OR. It was easy to draw the conclusion that Bart Simpson was somehow involved. :-)
During the Gulf War there was also a story that Iraqi broadcast propaganda was trying to demoralize US troops by suggesting that Bart Simpson was trying to get into bed with their wives. :-)
Ec
Alphax stated for the record:
Is it true that in the US, students are not taught anything about other countries?
There are no other countries, only rebellious territories.
-- Sean Barrett | Blizok lokot', da ne ukusish'. sean@epoptic.com |
Alphax wrote:
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Christopher Mahan wrote:
How do you explain to somebody that Toyota != Toyota Motor Corporation when their level of expertise is limited to US High School education level?
Is it true that in the US, students are not taught anything about other countries?
No, that is not true.
-Mark
On 5/27/05, Alphax alphasigmax@gmail.com wrote:
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Christopher Mahan wrote:
How do you explain to somebody that Toyota != Toyota Motor Corporation when their level of expertise is limited to US High School education level?
Is it true that in the US, students are not taught anything about other countries?
Alphax
Well, I'm a sort of an expert here on the subject of US students (I graduate high school in a few days) so I can confidently tell you that yes, we are taught about other countries, and reasonably well- but that goes only for the students who actually care and pay attention. The others, well, all bets are off.
~Maru And there are depressingly many of the latter.
Alphax wrote:
Christopher Mahan wrote:
How do you explain to somebody that Toyota != Toyota Motor Corporation when their level of expertise is limited to US High School education level?
Is it true that in the US, students are not taught anything about other countries?
No, it is not true. It is true that US education tends to be quite heavy on American history, with a lesser focus on European history, and still less on the history of say, China or Africa.
<POV> If I had to criticize the way history is taught in the US, it is not that students are not taught _anything_ about other countries, but rather than they are taught about other countries in a way that tends to suggest that other countries are out there somewhere, but don't have a lot of importance for us except that sometimes they start to fight with each other and we have to go make them stop. </POV>
--Jimbo
To add to that:
American history is a big deal in school here. In highschool though, in order to graduate, you must take at least one class on world history (iirc), and the theme for the entire year of 8th grade is world history I think (by "world", they mean europe, asia, and africa usually).
In some states, students need more credits in state history than they do in "world history" in order to graduate from high school. This is especially outrageous since many will go to college out of state, and may never return for the rest of their lives. How helpful will a detailed knowledge of Arkansas history be in California, let alone Croatia??
In addition, they don't learn much about the present state of any other country. Sure, Byzantines once ruled over much of Europe, but who "rules over" Europe now?
With most Americans, when asked to pick out of a list of four countries which one wasn't real, I would expect that they would get it wrong at least half of the time. Well, actually, it depends on the countries. If you said USA, Canada, Mexico, Laponia, most would know.
However, if you said Maldives, Brunei, Tonga, Laponia, they would very likely choose the wrong answer (hint for those of you who don't know: the Maldives are south of India, Brunei is in Australasia, and Tonga is a Polynesian kingdom).
Mark
On 04/06/05, Jimmy Wales jwales@wikia.com wrote:
Alphax wrote:
Christopher Mahan wrote:
How do you explain to somebody that Toyota != Toyota Motor Corporation when their level of expertise is limited to US High School education level?
Is it true that in the US, students are not taught anything about other countries?
No, it is not true. It is true that US education tends to be quite heavy on American history, with a lesser focus on European history, and still less on the history of say, China or Africa.
<POV> If I had to criticize the way history is taught in the US, it is not that students are not taught _anything_ about other countries, but rather than they are taught about other countries in a way that tends to suggest that other countries are out there somewhere, but don't have a lot of importance for us except that sometimes they start to fight with each other and we have to go make them stop. </POV>
--Jimbo
Wikipedia-l mailing list Wikipedia-l@Wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-l
On Sat, Jun 04, 2005 at 05:08:24PM +0200, Jimmy Wales wrote:
<POV> If I had to criticize the way history is taught in the US, it is not that students are not taught _anything_ about other countries, but rather than they are taught about other countries in a way that tends to suggest that other countries are out there somewhere, but don't have a lot of importance for us except that sometimes they start to fight with each other and we have to go make them stop. </POV>
I have a great many issues with the way history is taught in US public schools, and most of them deal with the way American history is (mis)taught. Heh. A clear indicator is the fact that American history textbooks tend to have titles like "Rise of a Nation", whereas chemistry books tend to be called things like "Principles of Chemistry". To paraphrase someone else (whose name escapes me at the moment), I've never seen a chemistry textbook titled "Rise of the Atom".
I do share your difficulty with the dismissive attitude taken toward other nations' histories in public education. I just tend to believe that's a mere symptom of a pathology in the way American history is taught.
-- Chad Perrin [ CCD CopyWrite | http://ccd.apotheon.org ]
Hello,
On 6/5/05, Chad Perrin perrin@apotheon.com wrote:
never seen a chemistry textbook titled "Rise of the Atom".
Atoms have always existed, regardless if we know about them. Nations, well, haven't. Anyway, I've always liked _The Origin of Species_ better. Would _The Origin of Nations_ be a better title?
I do share your difficulty with the dismissive attitude taken toward other nations' histories in public education. I just tend to believe that's a mere symptom of a pathology in the way American history is taught.
And the way it is taught right now is, well, a mere symptom of a pathology in the way Americans think of America and other nations.
little Alex
Alex Y. Kwan stated for the record:
And the way it is taught right now is, well, a mere symptom of a pathology in the way Americans think of America and other nations.
Of course, all Americans think of America and other nations in exactly the same pathological way.
We all think that all foreigners are mindless bigots who think all Americans think alike.
On Sun, Jun 05, 2005 at 09:38:41AM -0700, Sean Barrett wrote:
Alex Y. Kwan stated for the record:
And the way it is taught right now is, well, a mere symptom of a pathology in the way Americans think of America and other nations.
Of course, all Americans think of America and other nations in exactly the same pathological way.
We all think that all foreigners are mindless bigots who think all Americans think alike.
Hah. That's funny. It's much cleverer than what I was going to say, which was "Incorrect. It's a symptom of a broken government -- no more broken than any other, unfortunately."
Whoops, I said it anyway. In any case, you make a better point.
-- Chad Perrin [ CCD CopyWrite | http://ccd.apotheon.org ]
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