Hoi, Dismissing this whole thing as purely technical is something that might have worked in the past. In the present you have a conflict. This conflict needs a compromise. Dismissing all this as something "technical" is consequently not helpful. Thanks, GerardM
On 3/30/07, Alexander Cajcyc czalex@bk.ru wrote:
In that case a solution has already been found long ago, and the question is purely a technical one: one and the same Wiki, but with articles separated into "classical" and "official". As far as I know, this has already been implemented in other Wikis (e.g. Serbian?). So why not just doing the same with Belarusian Wikipedia?
czalex
-----Original Message----- From: GerardM gerard.meijssen@gmail.com To: "Alexander Cajcyc" czalex@bk.ru, wikipedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2007 15:03:43 +0200 Subject: Re: [Wikipedia-l] Be-x-old
Hoi, There is no choice when it comes to the names of the projects. The
standard
is explicit; a private label is indicated by an -x- at the right place
in
the label.
Having two projects is also something I would be against; it does not
bring
collaboration, it does not bring NPOV. You have to get your act together
and
history shows that you now have to compromise big time. It has been indicated that the actual differences are less than what you find in
English
... all the more reason to insist on collaboration.
Thanks, GerardM
On 3/30/07, Alexander Cajcyc czalex@bk.ru wrote:
Hi everybody
I agree with Gerard that we must not deepen the conflict and hould
find a
solution that would satisfy all of us.
Are we all, no matter the orthography, interested in the
representation of
Belarusian language in Wikipedia and in the usage of this tool for the
sake
of all Belarusian speakers no matter whether they prefer the classical orthography or the official one? Yes, we all are. So let's find some compromise.
I propose to leave the official orthography wikipedia where it is now,
OK.
But you just CAN'T allow the 6000 classical Belarusian Wiki articles
to
get lost! The fact that the Belarusian Wiki was created as a Wiki in Taraskievica is a illustrative example to that the classical
orthography has
an important place in Belarus now, especially amoung people who really
DO
speak the language on an every-day basis, while you can even see that
most
forum conversations in the official-orthography Wikipedia are being
hold
in... Russian [what is not bad itself].
So an ideal solution would be to rename be-x-old.wikipedia.org to, e.g
.,
be-classic.wikipedia.org or bel.wikipedia.org and to open it for
editing
so that it could coutinue its effective functioning.
regards,
czalex
-----Original Message----- From: GerardM gerard.meijssen@gmail.com To: wikipedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2007 14:23:35 +0200 Subject: Re: [Wikipedia-l] Be-x-old
Hoi, Please consider that if you have an option to work together, that
you
have
to talk. That you have to give and take. That you will always feel
that
you
give more than what you get.
There are two groups of people who have fought each other in a space
where
such fights are not appreciated. Assertions have been made about
"your"
language, "your" orthography, by trash talking the "other" language
/
orthography. You do not get any sympathy in this way. When you want
to
achieve something, it will be more beneficial to be seen to
cooperate
and to
find some coexistence.
When this coexistence is hard to get because of the enmity that has
been
created in the past, it only means that you will have to give even
more.
Thanks, Gerard
On 3/30/07, Monk monkbel@gmail.com wrote:
Hi,
How can anybody say that Yury Tarasievich and his project is about language, not about politics, after such a letter? No facts, just insults and speculations.
You are an entity, yes, set out to destroy the existing
Belarusian
language and culture and replace it with your version -- okay,
your
right. But get yourself your own blessed language code for that.
This speculation with such aggressive words doesn't help your
case, it
can only make your case worse. I don't even hope any more that you understand that your outrageous insults are absurd. You just dig a
pit
for yourself by your own hands.
P.S. Some years ago I witnessed a creation of one of such sites you
call
"proofs". So, there was 1 tech and 1 editor, who re-edited
everything
incoming (like 90+% or even 99% in standard Belarusian and
Russian)
into his flavour of "classic". It was politics. Thousands pages
(and
I
mean real thousands, there was sort of 4800 or so) of pages.
And...
grant money. I could add -- near to zero interest, excepting the indexing bots.
Another great example of lies. Where could they get any incoming
in
"norm" if people just don't write in it?
Monk.
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