Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 19:12:42 +0000 From: B?ria Lima berialima@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Fwd: Wikimedia India Program Trust
*The way I see is India is a land of immense potential for the Wikimedia
Movement. IMHO, There is enough space of 10 chapters and Wikimedia
offices
to co-exist and work together in India.*
Did you ever read the Chapter Agreement you signed with WMF? That document states that WMIN is the ONLY chapter of WMF in India, and that any one organization must have their "approval" to work in Indian soil (I'm saying that based in WMPT agreement, WMIN one might be different.)
I think that the spirit of an agreement is more important than its wording but I would like to comment both.
Regarding the wording, in my opinion what the contract says can be interpreted exactly the other way around. It says that to create another chapter in the same geographical area WMIN will be consulted. [1] It doesn’t say that the approval of WMIN is needed. Furthermore to create an organization different than chapters not even that consultation is foreseen.
As for the spirit I feel that the impression that chapters have private ownership of land is a big mistake that can leads us to a situation contrary to our values. This exclusivity is contrary to the spirit of sharing. We are not cultivating potatoes where the owner of the land keeps the potatoes. We give the potatoes away. The more and better people working the land more potatoes can give away. We don’t need land owners, what we need are people working the land.
I think these organizations should be happy of having there each other andsee a chance that what one of them can’t do, perhaps will be done by the other.
http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Agreement_between_chapters_and_Wikimedia...
OMG Gomà, can´t you leave any thread in peace without push your POV? _____ *Béria Lima* http://wikimedia.pt/(351) 925 171 484
*Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho. http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos*
On 15 November 2011 09:37, Joan Goma jrgoma@gmail.com wrote:
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 19:12:42 +0000 From: B?ria Lima berialima@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Fwd: Wikimedia India Program Trust
*The way I see is India is a land of immense potential for the Wikimedia
Movement. IMHO, There is enough space of 10 chapters and Wikimedia
offices
to co-exist and work together in India.*
Did you ever read the Chapter Agreement you signed with WMF? That
document
states that WMIN is the ONLY chapter of WMF in India, and that any one organization must have their "approval" to work in Indian soil (I'm
saying
that based in WMPT agreement, WMIN one might be different.)
I think that the spirit of an agreement is more important than its wording but I would like to comment both.
Regarding the wording, in my opinion what the contract says can be interpreted exactly the other way around. It says that to create another chapter in the same geographical area WMIN will be consulted. [1] It doesn’t say that the approval of WMIN is needed. Furthermore to create an organization different than chapters not even that consultation is foreseen.
As for the spirit I feel that the impression that chapters have private ownership of land is a big mistake that can leads us to a situation contrary to our values. This exclusivity is contrary to the spirit of sharing. We are not cultivating potatoes where the owner of the land keeps the potatoes. We give the potatoes away. The more and better people working the land more potatoes can give away. We don’t need land owners, what we need are people working the land.
I think these organizations should be happy of having there each other andsee a chance that what one of them can’t do, perhaps will be done by the other.
http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Agreement_between_chapters_and_Wikimedia... _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Can we not pick on a person whose "POV" is that he wishes to participate in the Wikimedia movement in the fullest way possible?
Pick on me instead. Oh wait...
Best wishes, Achal
On Tuesday 15 November 2011 07:40 PM, Béria Lima wrote:
OMG Gomà, can´t you leave any thread in peace without push your POV? _____ *Béria Lima* http://wikimedia.pt/(351) 925 171 484
*Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho.http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos*
On 15 November 2011 09:37, Joan Gomajrgoma@gmail.com wrote:
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 19:12:42 +0000 From: B?ria Limaberialima@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Fwd: Wikimedia India Program Trust
*The way I see is India is a land of immense potential for the Wikimedia
Movement. IMHO, There is enough space of 10 chapters and Wikimedia
offices
to co-exist and work together in India.*
Did you ever read the Chapter Agreement you signed with WMF? That
document
states that WMIN is the ONLY chapter of WMF in India, and that any one organization must have their "approval" to work in Indian soil (I'm
saying
that based in WMPT agreement, WMIN one might be different.)
I think that the spirit of an agreement is more important than its wording but I would like to comment both.
Regarding the wording, in my opinion what the contract says can be interpreted exactly the other way around. It says that to create another chapter in the same geographical area WMIN will be consulted. [1] It doesn’t say that the approval of WMIN is needed. Furthermore to create an organization different than chapters not even that consultation is foreseen.
As for the spirit I feel that the impression that chapters have private ownership of land is a big mistake that can leads us to a situation contrary to our values. This exclusivity is contrary to the spirit of sharing. We are not cultivating potatoes where the owner of the land keeps the potatoes. We give the potatoes away. The more and better people working the land more potatoes can give away. We don’t need land owners, what we need are people working the land.
I think these organizations should be happy of having there each other andsee a chance that what one of them can’t do, perhaps will be done by the other.
http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Agreement_between_chapters_and_Wikimedia... _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Achal, I don't quite understand what is the idea, meaning or whatever you wrote in your mail.
Can you explain (this time with full and meaningful sentences), please? _____ *Béria Lima* http://wikimedia.pt/(351) 925 171 484
*Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho. http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos*
On 15 November 2011 14:19, Achal Prabhala aprabhala@gmail.com wrote:
Can we not pick on a person whose "POV" is that he wishes to participate in the Wikimedia movement in the fullest way possible?
Pick on me instead. Oh wait...
Best wishes, Achal
On Tuesday 15 November 2011 07:40 PM, Béria Lima wrote:
OMG Gomà, can´t you leave any thread in peace without push your POV? _____ *Béria Lima* http://wikimedia.pt/(351) 925 171 484
*Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho.http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos*
On 15 November 2011 09:37, Joan Gomajrgoma@gmail.com wrote:
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 19:12:42 +0000 From: B?ria Limaberialima@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Fwd: Wikimedia India Program Trust
*The way I see is India is a land of immense potential for the
Wikimedia
Movement. IMHO, There is enough space of 10 chapters and Wikimedia
offices
to co-exist and work together in India.*
Did you ever read the Chapter Agreement you signed with WMF? That
document
states that WMIN is the ONLY chapter of WMF in India, and that any one organization must have their "approval" to work in Indian soil (I'm
saying
that based in WMPT agreement, WMIN one might be different.)
I think that the spirit of an agreement is more important than its
wording
but I would like to comment both.
Regarding the wording, in my opinion what the contract says can be interpreted exactly the other way around. It says that to create another chapter in the same geographical area WMIN will be consulted. [1] It doesn’t say that the approval of WMIN is needed. Furthermore to create
an
organization different than chapters not even that consultation is foreseen.
As for the spirit I feel that the impression that chapters have private ownership of land is a big mistake that can leads us to a situation contrary to our values. This exclusivity is contrary to the spirit of sharing. We
are
not cultivating potatoes where the owner of the land keeps the
potatoes. We
give the potatoes away. The more and better people working the land more potatoes can give away. We don’t need land owners, what we need are people working the land.
I think these organizations should be happy of having there each other andsee a chance that what one of them can’t do, perhaps will be done by the
other.
http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Agreement_between_chapters_and_Wikimedia...
foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
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Let's not? I'm sure there is a lot of backstory to why some posts to this thread have been so argumentative, but the belligerence is childish and not conducive to a serious and productive discussion.
~Nathan
Hi Beria,
I'm sorry - I wrote this in a hurry and don't necessarily want to further crowd foundation-l.
The point about Goma is that he (and other Catalan Wikipedians) don't need to feel any more excluded than they already do (http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikimedia_CAT/en)
The point about me is superfluous. I guess I was reacting to the incredibly harsh tone of (most) of your messages. I apologise; there is no excuse for reproducing the kind of behaviour that makes me despair.
Achal
On Tuesday 15 November 2011 08:02 PM, Béria Lima wrote:
Achal, I don't quite understand what is the idea, meaning or whatever you wrote in your mail.
Can you explain (this time with full and meaningful sentences), please? _____ *Béria Lima* http://wikimedia.pt/(351) 925 171 484
*Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho.http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos*
On 15 November 2011 14:19, Achal Prabhalaaprabhala@gmail.com wrote:
Can we not pick on a person whose "POV" is that he wishes to participate in the Wikimedia movement in the fullest way possible?
Pick on me instead. Oh wait...
Best wishes, Achal
On Tuesday 15 November 2011 07:40 PM, Béria Lima wrote:
OMG Gomà, can´t you leave any thread in peace without push your POV? _____ *Béria Lima* http://wikimedia.pt/(351) 925 171 484
*Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho.http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos*
On 15 November 2011 09:37, Joan Gomajrgoma@gmail.com wrote:
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 19:12:42 +0000 From: B?ria Limaberialima@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Fwd: Wikimedia India Program Trust
*The way I see is India is a land of immense potential for the
Wikimedia
Movement. IMHO, There is enough space of 10 chapters and Wikimedia
offices
to co-exist and work together in India.*
Did you ever read the Chapter Agreement you signed with WMF? That
document
states that WMIN is the ONLY chapter of WMF in India, and that any one organization must have their "approval" to work in Indian soil (I'm
saying
that based in WMPT agreement, WMIN one might be different.)
I think that the spirit of an agreement is more important than its
wording
but I would like to comment both.
Regarding the wording, in my opinion what the contract says can be interpreted exactly the other way around. It says that to create another chapter in the same geographical area WMIN will be consulted. [1] It doesn’t say that the approval of WMIN is needed. Furthermore to create
an
organization different than chapters not even that consultation is foreseen.
As for the spirit I feel that the impression that chapters have private ownership of land is a big mistake that can leads us to a situation contrary to our values. This exclusivity is contrary to the spirit of sharing. We
are
not cultivating potatoes where the owner of the land keeps the
potatoes. We
give the potatoes away. The more and better people working the land more potatoes can give away. We don’t need land owners, what we need are people working the land.
I think these organizations should be happy of having there each other andsee a chance that what one of them can’t do, perhaps will be done by the
other.
http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Agreement_between_chapters_and_Wikimedia...
foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
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I'm sorry Achal, but I think I never mentioned you in this thread, so I couldn't understand when I was harsh to you.
But let's not continue this on list, after all we both know we both can be much more harsh that we show here, right? ( btw, thanks for one more for my collection!) ;) _____ *Béria Lima* http://wikimedia.pt/(351) 925 171 484
*Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho. http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos*
On 16 November 2011 06:38, Achal Prabhala aprabhala@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Beria,
I'm sorry - I wrote this in a hurry and don't necessarily want to further crowd foundation-l.
The point about Goma is that he (and other Catalan Wikipedians) don't need to feel any more excluded than they already do (http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikimedia_CAT/en)
The point about me is superfluous. I guess I was reacting to the incredibly harsh tone of (most) of your messages. I apologise; there is no excuse for reproducing the kind of behaviour that makes me despair.
Achal
On Tuesday 15 November 2011 08:02 PM, Béria Lima wrote:
Achal, I don't quite understand what is the idea, meaning or whatever you wrote in your mail.
Can you explain (this time with full and meaningful sentences), please? _____ *Béria Lima* http://wikimedia.pt/(351) 925 171 484
*Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho.http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos*
On 15 November 2011 14:19, Achal Prabhalaaprabhala@gmail.com wrote:
Can we not pick on a person whose "POV" is that he wishes to participate in the Wikimedia movement in the fullest way possible?
Pick on me instead. Oh wait...
Best wishes, Achal
On Tuesday 15 November 2011 07:40 PM, Béria Lima wrote:
OMG Gomà, can´t you leave any thread in peace without push your POV? _____ *Béria Lima* http://wikimedia.pt/(351) 925 171 484
*Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho.http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos*
On 15 November 2011 09:37, Joan Gomajrgoma@gmail.com wrote:
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 19:12:42 +0000 From: B?ria Limaberialima@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Fwd: Wikimedia India Program Trust
*The way I see is India is a land of immense potential for the
Wikimedia
> Movement. IMHO, There is enough space of 10 chapters and Wikimedia offices > to co-exist and work together in India.* > Did you ever read the Chapter Agreement you signed with WMF? That
document
states that WMIN is the ONLY chapter of WMF in India, and that any
one
organization must have their "approval" to work in Indian soil (I'm
saying
that based in WMPT agreement, WMIN one might be different.)
I think that the spirit of an agreement is more important than its
wording
but I would like to comment both.
Regarding the wording, in my opinion what the contract says can be interpreted exactly the other way around. It says that to create
another
chapter in the same geographical area WMIN will be consulted. [1] It doesn’t say that the approval of WMIN is needed. Furthermore to create
an
organization different than chapters not even that consultation is foreseen.
As for the spirit I feel that the impression that chapters have
private
ownership of land is a big mistake that can leads us to a situation contrary to our values. This exclusivity is contrary to the spirit of sharing. We
are
not cultivating potatoes where the owner of the land keeps the
potatoes. We
give the potatoes away. The more and better people working the land
more
potatoes can give away. We don’t need land owners, what we need are people working the land.
I think these organizations should be happy of having there each other andsee a chance that what one of them can’t do, perhaps will be done by the
other.
http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Agreement_between_chapters_and_Wikimedia...
foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
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