Wikipedia-l April 2007

wikipedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org

62 participants
37 discussions

be: and be-x-old: interwiki
by Andre Engels 29 Apr '07

29 Apr '07

Doing interwiki links to be-x-old: is now possible; however, both wikipedias now have "Беларуская" as the name for the language. I think there should be an extra specification to distinguish the two, just like nb: does not have 'Norsk' any more, but is called '‪Norsk (bokmål)'. Does anyone who knows Belarus have good idea for the separate names? My own guess does not get further than a translation of "Belarussian (official)" for be: -- Andre Engels, andreengels(a)gmail.com ICQ: 6260644 -- Skype: a_engels

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A new language
by Antonio Casado 28 Apr '07

28 Apr '07

Hello. I'd like to include a new language in Wikipedia: andalusian (andalú). Andalusia is a country in the South of Spain with a population of 8,000,000. How can I get an andalusian Wikipedia? I wait for your answer. Thank you. Saludos. Me gustaría incluir un nuevo idioma en Wikipedia: andaluz (andalú). Andalucía es un territorio al sur de España con una población de 8,000,000 de personas. ¿Cómo puedo conseguir una Wikipedia en andaluz?. Espero su respuesta. Gracias. Saludoh. Me guhtaría incluí un nuevo idioma en Wikipedia: el andalú. Andalusía eh un territorio ar su d'Ehpaña con una poblasión de 8,000,000 de personah. ¿Cómo puo conseguí una Wikipedia en andalú?. Ehpero su rehpuehta. Grasiah.

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Re: [Wikipedia-l] Wikipedia-l Digest, Vol 45, Issue 21
by gabriela sanhuezagaray 26 Apr '07

26 Apr '07

Por favor mandenme los email en español. Gracias. >From: wikipedia-l-request(a)lists.wikimedia.org >Reply-To: wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >To: wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >Subject: Wikipedia-l Digest, Vol 45, Issue 21 >Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 08:01:21 +0000 > >Send Wikipedia-l mailing list submissions to > wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org > >To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-l >or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > wikipedia-l-request(a)lists.wikimedia.org > >You can reach the person managing the list at > wikipedia-l-owner(a)lists.wikimedia.org > >When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >than "Re: Contents of Wikipedia-l digest..." > > >Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: New Wikipedia in " Romanesco " (David Gerard) > 2. Re: Deletions, speedy deletions... and retributions... > (David Goodman) > 3. Re: Deletions, speedy deletions... and retributions... > (Ronald Chmara) > 4. Re: Deletions, speedy deletions... and retributions... > (Frederick Noronha) > 5. Re: Deletions, speedy deletions... and retributions... > (Till Westermayer) > 6. Re: New Wikipedia in " Romanesco " (Berto 'd Sera) > 7. Re: Deletions, speedy deletions... and retributions... > (Ronald Chmara) > > >---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >Message: 1 >Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2007 23:06:57 +0100 >From: "David Gerard" <dgerard(a)gmail.com> >Subject: Re: [Wikipedia-l] New Wikipedia in " Romanesco " >To: wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >Message-ID: > <fbad4e140704251506v7a220c65o8e1f80771f3a32fb(a)mail.gmail.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > >On 25/04/07, GerardM <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > Read the policy. > > >And one day you will learn that when people question the policy, >answering "Read the policy" only makes them angrier. > > >- d. > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 2 >Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2007 20:07:14 -0400 >From: "David Goodman" <dgoodmanny(a)gmail.com> >Subject: Re: [Wikipedia-l] Deletions, speedy deletions... and > retributions... >To: wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >Message-ID: > <480eb3150704251707n128194ffm7ac0469bf8523d8c(a)mail.gmail.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > >One Way to help: > >One good way that groups (and individuals) in the third world (and >anywhere else) can help wikipedia retain and add to the articles on >their work is to state explicitly on their web sites that the pages >are licensed GFDL (or just public domain). At least the text, and if >possible the images. Very often this is the main source for an >article, and article are often deleted for contain too much copied >text. Many pages and especially images in Europe and elsewhere are >licensed for nonprofit use only, and this does not meet the >requirements of en WP. > >There is of course the mechanism to request permission, but it is >usual for organizations and webmasters not to react fast enough. > >Many of the eds. at WP can & will quickly take such information and >adapt and reduce it to a good article--it takes much longer to rewrite >from scratch. I personally try to rewrite one such article a week, but >if I could use blocks of web text and photos when appropriate I could >do two or three. > >On 4/25/07, Frederick Noronha <fred(a)bytesforall.org> wrote: > > Dear all, > > >... > > The speedy deletions of pages of organisations > > whose work is widely noticed and is certainly relevant to the Third > > World (or the so-called "developing world") is unfair. >... > > Special care needs to be taken about groups working in non-English > > languages and those on the so-called "periphery" (i.e. not in the "big > > cities that matter" or the bigger nations that have so many of their > > denizens active in cyberspace). Many such groups might not be visible > > enough in cyberspace, but that hardly means their work is not > > relevant! > > >... > > Frederick "FN" Noronha > > Goa, India. > > > ---- >David Goodman, Ph.D, M.L.S. >DGG > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 3 >Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2007 22:22:56 -0700 >From: Ronald Chmara <ron(a)Opus1.COM> >Subject: Re: [Wikipedia-l] Deletions, speedy deletions... and > retributions... >To: wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >Message-ID: <503A8207-E736-49C9-807E-B728E05F2D76(a)opus1.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed > >On Apr 25, 2007, at 2:56 PM, Till Westermayer wrote: > > > Hi, > > I have removed the proposed-for-deletion tag -- I guess it is a > > borderline case > >Borderline? Hm... It's WP:COI, the only published "sources" are not >only self generated (WP:SPS), they're also blogs loaded with viagra >SPAM and forum sites... this is the very reason *why* we have so many >guidelines on en, lest folks think that they can just throw up some >content and therefore deserve their own wikipedia entry. AfD'ing >this and any siblings. > > > Frederick Noronha schrieb am 25.04.2007 21:44: > >> Dear all, > >> It appears that my persistent questioning of the decisions to delete > >> pages related to some networks doing significant work, but which > >> might > >> not be sufficiently visible in cyberspace (or the English-dominated > >> sections of it) seems to have led someone to decide to delete a page > >> referring to me at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Noronha ! > >> The grounds given are "borderline notability". Not that this > >> matters.... > >> It's amusing to see oneself being shifted from being a "notable > >> Wikipedian" to "borderline notability" over a short period of time. > >> See http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php? > >> title=Frederick_Noronha&diff=124590095&oldid=23812169 > >Notable wikipedian does not mean notable to the world. http:// >en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:BIO#Articles_on_Wikipedians > > >> I would still maintain that those deleting pages need to act with > >> responsibility. Besides, the success of Wikipedia (as the 11th > >> most-visited site in the world, according to alexa.com) should not > >> lead to arrogance or unhelpfulness that discourages those attempting > >> to get heard in cyberspace > >Write a blog? WIkipedia is not a place to *establish* notability, >it's a place to document things once notability is established. >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:NOT#SOAP > > >> (As one editor > >> once told me, good naturedly, "If I want to give you a reason to > >> block > >> your article, I could give you any one of 31 good reasons for it." > >> Yeah, reasons are easy to come by, once someone's mind is made up.) > >Experienced editors may already be quite familiar with the criteria. >So far, I've counted: VAIN/COI, CORP/ORG, SPS, V. It might or might >not be SNOW, I'll leave that to others to decide. :) > > >> * ..The speedy deletions of pages of organisations > >> whose work is widely noticed and is certainly relevant to the Third > >> World (or the so-called "developing world") is unfair. > >If it's widely noticed, it will be documented, and thus pass WP:V > > >> * There should be good reason for deletion of any page (this should > >> not be taken to mean that I'm making even an indirect case for my > >> page. > >AfD requires reasons, and consensus. > > >> * Many such groups might not be visible > >> enough in cyberspace, but that hardly means their work is not > >> relevant! > >...If it's widely noticed, it will be documented, and thus pass >WP:V... Same answer to all your other questions. You are about to see >how the process works. :) > >-Bop > > > > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 4 >Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 11:30:53 +0530 >From: "Frederick Noronha" <fred(a)bytesforall.org> >Subject: Re: [Wikipedia-l] Deletions, speedy deletions... and > retributions... >To: wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >Message-ID: > <8ea78e010704252300k45e96c3fqf6b4cf747263d309(a)mail.gmail.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > >Hi all: Please don't discuss me or the page referring to me on >Wikipedia. I have no delusions of grandeur, didn't initiate the page >myself (just felt the need to correct the info which was incorrect on >it, after waiting awhile and seeing nothing change!), and don't claim >to be of any level of notability. > >Instead, may I request that the page be deleted, so that this >discussion takes on less of a personal I'm-protectiing-my-interest >kind of tone. > >On 26/04/07, Ronald Chmara <ron(a)opus1.com> wrote: > > On Apr 25, 2007, at 2:56 PM, Till Westermayer wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > I have removed the proposed-for-deletion tag -- I guess it is a > > > borderline case > > > > Borderline? Hm... It's WP:COI, the only published "sources" are not > > only self generated (WP:SPS), they're also blogs loaded with viagra > > SPAM and forum sites... this is the very reason *why* we have so many > > guidelines on en, lest folks think that they can just throw up some > > content and therefore deserve their own wikipedia entry. AfD'ing > > this and any siblings. > >What I am really concerned about is the manner in which entries -- >which really deserve to be included on the Wikipedia (even if needing >a rewrite and better sourcing) -- get tagged for speedy deletion. And >I'm concerned about the decisions being taken obviously by people who >(sorry to be blunt) lack familiarity of the field and probably see it >as Latin and Greek, if not Sanskrit and Khmer! My interests lie in the >field of ICT-for-D (information and communication technology for >development) and the alternative media: > >In particular, I refer to: > >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OURMedia/NUESTROSMedios >[Even links to it deleted. Reasons given: only 200+ members; not >adequately sourced; non notability; etc, etc] > >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rishab_A._Ghosh >He's one of the most prominent persons in the ICT-for-D debate of >Indian origin (and also known for his contribution at studying >European issues). He was the guy who is credited with having first >used the term FLOSS (Free/Libre and Open Source Software), and has >undertaken prominent studies at the European level. Recently, he also >edited a book 'Code: Collaborative Ownership and the Digital Commons' >Rishab Aiyer Ghosh-ed MIT-published (ISBN 0-262-07260-2). So is he >non-notable for Wikipedia? > >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Vikalp >Vikalp, a serious movement against film-censorship in India, linking a >few hundred film-makers, almost gets deleted. Again: "non-notability"! > >Didn't have the time or energy to save another deserving case! >http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Natural_History_of_South_Asia_mai… > >The founder of the most influential cyber not-for-profit operation >from Goa, a former Portuguese colony on the west coast of India, is a >similar victim. Non-notability! And he started what grew into Goa's >most influential mailing-list (current readership 8-10,000+ daily) >when he was a 17-year-old! >http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Herman_Carneiro&action=edit > >Groups in Latin America doing interesting work in the field of ICT4D >get questioned: >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITeM >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ESLARED >Fortunately, just salvaged on time after similar protests! But I can't >spend my life just in verbal skirmishes with certainly don't win >friends (and sometimes, don't even influence people!) > >A friend of mine, who's active in global campaigns on ICT4D, couldn't >believe that Ungana Afrika could be threatened by a 'non-notability' >tag. But when will our Western friends recognise that the work one >does isn't always reflected in cyberspace... in large parts of the >globe, there's a total disjunct between the two. And that's what >shorthand like the 'digital divide' is all about in the first place! >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ungana-Afrika > >Another page deleted. Who cares about Free Software and Open Source in >the world's most populous planet (even if we have a network of 130+ >groups in India alone)? >LUGs, FSUGs, GLUGs in India and Asia >http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=LUGs%2C_FSUGs%2C_GLUGs_in_India_a… > >And another one bites the dust: >http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Gobala_Krishnan&action=edit > >And finally, what triggered it all off: >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OURMedia/NUESTROSMedios > >Okay guys, I rest my case. --FN > > > If it's widely noticed, it will be documented, and thus pass WP:V > >PS: Are you so sure? Most of the cultures of this planet are still not >even documented, let alone digitised. And, in a Western-defined world, >what you're saying is if you aren't digitised, you don't exist! >Well... some fundamental differences in perception here. >-- >FN M: 0091 9822122436 P: +91-832-240-9490 (after 1300IST please) >http://fn.goa-india.org http://fredericknoronha.wordpress.com >Konkani Wikipedia (under incubation) needs your help! >http://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wp/kok > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 5 >Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 08:20:45 +0200 >From: Till Westermayer <till(a)tillwe.de> >Subject: Re: [Wikipedia-l] Deletions, speedy deletions... and > retributions... >To: wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >Message-ID: <463044BD.1050800(a)tillwe.de> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > >Two or three short remarks: > >Ronald Chmara schrieb am 26.04.2007 07:22: > > On Apr 25, 2007, at 2:56 PM, Till Westermayer wrote: > > > >> Hi, > >> I have removed the proposed-for-deletion tag -- I guess it is a > >> borderline case > > > > Borderline? Hm... It's WP:COI, the only published "sources" are not > > only self generated (WP:SPS), they're also blogs loaded with viagra > > SPAM and forum sites... this is the very reason *why* we have so many > > guidelines on en, lest folks think that they can just throw up some > > content and therefore deserve their own wikipedia entry. AfD'ing > > this and any siblings. > >About "throwing up content" -- I guess this overestimates Wikipedias >notability: most often there is some content, and the Wikipedia entry >follows later. That people do it the other way round (or produce >content only to get an Wikipedia entry) is highly improbable and >definitly not the case with FN. > > >>> (As one editor > >>> once told me, good naturedly, "If I want to give you a reason to > >>> block > >>> your article, I could give you any one of 31 good reasons for it." > >>> Yeah, reasons are easy to come by, once someone's mind is made up.) > > > > Experienced editors may already be quite familiar with the criteria. > > So far, I've counted: VAIN/COI, CORP/ORG, SPS, V. It might or might > > not be SNOW, I'll leave that to others to decide. :) > >Argh. "Real life" got me a year ago or so, which lead to a drastical >lowering of my Wikipedia-activity. In that short time, somehow lots of >acronyms creep out somewhere -- most of them I don't recognize. > > >>> * There should be good reason for deletion of any page (this should > >>> not be taken to mean that I'm making even an indirect case for my > >>> page. > > > > AfD requires reasons, and consensus. > >That's the reason why I deleted the notice (and thus enabled that >someone -- you -- brings it to AfD). I don't think the AfD-process >works well in all cases, but we will see. And at least I don't think I >can judge if an Indian FOSS journalist is notable or not -- my >intuition is a sort of notability (not because FN is active here, but >I think the structual bias he describes is there). > >-- >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >till we *) ~ Till Westermayer ~ Hirschstrasse 5 ~ 79100 Freiburg >0761 55697152 ~ till(a)tillwe.de ~ http://www.westermayer.de/till/ >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 6 >Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 09:26:33 +0300 >From: "Berto 'd Sera" <albertoserra(a)ukr.net> >Subject: Re: [Wikipedia-l] New Wikipedia in " Romanesco " >To: <wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org> >Message-ID: <002001c787cb$d59d38b0$0201a8c0@alles> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > >LOL which never kept any of the software vendors to answer me RTFM (read >the >f**ng manual) any time I started to venture in discussion before doing it >:) > >Berto 'd Sera >Personagi dl'ann 2006 per l'arvista american-a Time (tanme tuti vojaotri) >http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1569514,00.html > >-----Original Message----- >From: wikipedia-l-bounces(a)lists.wikimedia.org >[mailto:wikipedia-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of David Gerard >Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2007 1:07 AM >To: wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >Subject: Re: [Wikipedia-l] New Wikipedia in " Romanesco " > >On 25/04/07, GerardM <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > Read the policy. > > >And one day you will learn that when people question the policy, >answering "Read the policy" only makes them angrier. > > >- d. > >_______________________________________________ >Wikipedia-l mailing list >Wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-l > > > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 7 >Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 01:01:13 -0700 >From: Ronald Chmara <ron(a)Opus1.COM> >Subject: Re: [Wikipedia-l] Deletions, speedy deletions... and > retributions... >To: wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >Message-ID: <85B41CA5-D4A1-40BE-8557-CCCA60DD8905(a)opus1.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed > >On Apr 25, 2007, at 11:00 PM, Frederick Noronha wrote: > > Hi all: Please don't discuss me or the page referring to me on > > Wikipedia. I have no delusions of grandeur, didn't initiate the page > > myself (just felt the need to correct the info which was incorrect on > > it, after waiting awhile and seeing nothing change!), and don't claim > > to be of any level of notability. > >When AfD'ing it, and notifying editors, I ran into your User:Talk >page... looks like a cattle {{prod}} zapped it. Ow. > > > Instead, may I request that the page be deleted... > >You can do just that on: >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/ >Frederick_Noronha > > > ... so that this > > discussion takes on less of a personal I'm-protectiing-my-interest > > kind of tone. > >Okay. :) > > > What I am really concerned about is the manner in which entries -- > > which really deserve to be included on the Wikipedia (even if needing > > a rewrite and better sourcing) -- get tagged for speedy deletion. > >I've had a few of those, some admins are pretty quick with the >triggers, but our tiered deletion process is designed to sort out the >possible problems, to a certain extent... > > > In particular, I refer to: > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OURMedia/NUESTROSMedios > > [Even links to it deleted. Reasons given: only 200+ members; not > > adequately sourced; non notability; etc, etc] > >Those are standard reasons, with the core problem being sourcing, >indicating a lack of notability and verifiability. Verifiability is >the primary tool we have to keep people from inventing fictitious >entities, or listing their chess club (that has 50 online members, >and nothing other than their 100 blogs claiming various things), or >an individual writing "THE TRUTH ABOUT MY UFO ABDUCTION" and then >posting it to hundreds (or thousands) of websites. > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rishab_A._Ghosh > > So is he non-notable for Wikipedia? > >73K ghits, member of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ >Open_Source_Initiative (Passes WP:ORG), but it's a stub that needs >more assertions of notability on why he would be, oh..... considered >important, as an individual? > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Vikalp > > http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php? > > title=Natural_History_of_South_Asia_mailing_list&action=edit > > http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Herman_Carneiro&action=edit > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITeM > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ESLARED > > http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=LUGs%2C_FSUGs% > > 2C_GLUGs_in_India_and_Asia&action=edit > > http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Gobala_Krishnan&action=edit > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OURMedia/NUESTROSMedios > > >Some of the recurring themes I'm seeing so far, actually, viewed from >*my* perspective, are articles about topics (and with text inside the >articles about topics) that (to me) are completely *unimportant* in >terms of notability. > >Managing/having a mailing list is not notable, managing a website is >not notable, managing a journal is not notable, nor is being a >journalist, nor being a frequent F/OSS contributor, nor starting a >regional, national, or international group, to *me*, and let me >emphasize the next point quite heavily: "Because all of these things, >right now, are done by almost every bored teenager or adult in >*highly developed countries* with the slightest of inclinations to do >so." > >And this, I think, might be where some bias is kicking in. > >Some examples: In the developing world, running your own nonprofit >ISP might be a major thing, in the United States, I can count at >least five personal friends who did so *as a way of passing time*. >Sure, taking time away from making a living to work on F/OSS project >is very significant, and notable, when one is having to cut down on >their food budget to do so, but in the US, it can be "something to >do" besides sitting on the couch and watching TV. > >See: >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:BIAS > > > > > Okay guys, I rest my case. --FN > >> If it's widely noticed, it will be documented, and thus pass WP:V > > PS: Are you so sure? Most of the cultures of this planet are still not > > even documented, let alone digitised. > >My older brother is a geographic anthropologist. I know that there's >a major, ongoing, effort to take the information from cultures that >lack written documentation and capture it. I also do know that it is >a race against time. Responding directly to your point, though, if >"widely" means 600 people of the culture of a hill tribe in some non- >developed country, wikipedia likely will not have it, and nor will >the rest of the world, unless it is published in a reliable source >(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:RS) first. > > > And, in a Western-defined world, > > what you're saying is if you aren't digitised, you don't exist! > > Well... some fundamental differences in perception here. > >No, I'm saying that unless the story is told to the others, it cannot >be heard by the others. Digitizing makes it easier for things like >testing ghits, be we also have articles that one *must* find paper >copies of some prior text in order to verify the data. > >:) > >-Bop > > > > >------------------------------ > >_______________________________________________ >Wikipedia-l mailing list >Wikipedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-l > > >End of Wikipedia-l Digest, Vol 45, Issue 21 >******************************************* _________________________________________________________________ Charla con tus amigos en línea mediante MSN Messenger: http://messenger.latam.msn.com/

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Re: [Wikipedia-l] "Suicide methods" article
by sarble montegue 26 Apr '07

26 Apr '07

The Transhumanist is/was working on a plan to overhaul the various "help" related pages. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:The_Transhumanist/Help_me_2 and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:The_Transhumanist/Help_me I think he needs guidance on what exactly can/should be done, and how to do it, as many of those pages are skirting WP:NOT in various ways, or turning into very messy Dab. pages. Quiddity <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:NOT#IINFO>

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New Wikipedia in " Romanesco "
by Piercostanzo Vari 26 Apr '07

26 Apr '07

Romanesco is the dialect/language of Rome,Italy. Find "Trilussa" and you will see what kind of language is it. It is not really a language but a dialect.

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Deletions, speedy deletions... and retributions...
by Frederick Noronha 26 Apr '07

26 Apr '07

Dear all, It appears that my persistent questioning of the decisions to delete pages related to some networks doing significant work, but which might not be sufficiently visible in cyberspace (or the English-dominated sections of it) seems to have led someone to decide to delete a page referring to me at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Noronha ! The grounds given are "borderline notability". Not that this matters.... It's amusing to see oneself being shifted from being a "notable Wikipedian" to "borderline notability" over a short period of time. See http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Frederick_Noronha&diff=124590095&… I would still maintain that those deleting pages need to act with responsibility. Besides, the success of Wikipedia (as the 11th most-visited site in the world, according to alexa.com) should not lead to arrogance or unhelpfulness that discourages those attempting to get heard in cyberspace (mostly with legitimate entries in the Wikipedia, but maybe finding it difficult to cope with the one-size-fits-all criteria that is prescribed, of notability, proper referencing etc.... ). In one particular example, a page was sought to be deleted (and links removed) because of a strange mix of reasons. From arguments that it had "only" 200+ members in its network, to other points of view that it lacked sufficient references, or was more suited to an official website rather than for Wikipedia. If this was so, would it not help if the page could be improved, rather than deleted. (As one editor once told me, good naturedly, "If I want to give you a reason to block your article, I could give you any one of 31 good reasons for it." Yeah, reasons are easy to come by, once someone's mind is made up.) Needless to say, I would not bother to make a case for the retention of a page focussing on me. It would be a relief, in fact, if the page went off! Take a look at its history: The page was started on 19:07, 4 August 2005 by Nichalp. It was subsequently edited by others. When I came across it, I realised that my name had initially been spelt wrong. Besides, there were inaccuracies in my description (there is a difference, surely, in being " actively involved in the Indian Free Software Foundation" and writing about it... I am definitely not "a known (sic) for his articles on Christianity" (admittedly am fairly curious about happenings there, though I don't subscribe to the religion I was born in) ... by that time, I had virtually stopped writing (but subsequently resumed, on another theme) for the Indo-Asian News Service in New Delhi... In addition, I'm not "founder" of BytesForAll, as mentioned, but a co-founder. A number of the websites and blogs mentioned were either outdated or non-functional, and there were new ones not noticed. After waiting awhile, I realised nobody would probably make these corrections, and did so under my own name.... which is actually not supposed to be the Wikipedia is to work. That was in late Jan-early Feb 2006 (see http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Frederick_Noronha&action=history ) So, what's the point I'm making? * Rather than handle the message, someone here seems to be intent on shooting the messenger! The speedy deletions of pages of organisations whose work is widely noticed and is certainly relevant to the Third World (or the so-called "developing world") is unfair. * There should be good reason for deletion of any page (this should not be taken to mean that I'm making even an indirect case for my page... I have no problem if it's deleted), and those exercising the decision should preferably be aware of the subject-matter, and its relevance, even if in niche areas. * Special care needs to be taken about groups working in non-English languages and those on the so-called "periphery" (i.e. not in the "big cities that matter" or the bigger nations that have so many of their denizens active in cyberspace). Many such groups might not be visible enough in cyberspace, but that hardly means their work is not relevant! * How will Wikipedia balance its speedy growth in popularity, against the tendency to flood it with irrelevant posts, and also be fair to those who deserve to be on it without unnecessary deletions? * At the end of the day, I believe an "alternate modelled" encyclopedia also needs to be alternate enough to take a wider view of our world. Wikipedia need not be -- indeed, should not be -- constrained by the top-down hierarchical restricted vision of traditional encyclopedias. Or else, it will come to be dismissed as an initiative that is alternative in its organising structure, but not in its vision. Lastly, may I add that I will continue to be a supporter of the Wikipedia, and seek help for those with a record of adding to this experiment to continue doing so, rather than getting caught up in page-deletion battles. Regards, Frederick "FN" Noronha Goa, India. -- FN M: 0091 9822122436 P: +91-832-240-9490 (after 1300IST please) http://fn.goa-india.org http://fredericknoronha.wordpress.com Konkani Wikipedia (under incubation) needs your help! http://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wp/kok

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NEW language - SÄCHSISCH / SAXON
by Robert Knappe 25 Apr '07

25 Apr '07

Hi, I have a request - because I want to open a new WIKI in a language which don´t exist yet in Wikipedia. The new language is "Sächsisch" It´s a language which is spoken in Saxony (eastern Germany) The language code should be SAX , SÄX or SAC. I have some friends which also want to write in saxon so there would be many articles in a short time. ´ Hope you answer to my request. Sincerely Yours Robert -- "Feel free" - 10 GB Mailbox, 100 FreeSMS/Monat ... Jetzt GMX TopMail testen: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/topmail

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Semi-automated AfD nomination script at Commons
by Erik Moeller 24 Apr '07

24 Apr '07

I just saw that the JavaScript wizards at Wikimedia Commons came up with an impressive new tool - if you look at an image description page, you will now see "Nominate for deletion" link in the bottom right corner. If you follow that link and give a deletion reason, everything - the tagging of the image, the listing on the Deletion requests page, and the notification of the uploader - is done automatically using JavaScript. This is quite impressive. I'd love to see more of this kind of automation enabled by default, at least for users in the "autoconfirmed" group. Think about it: * Deletion, peer review, featured article status nominations * Speedy deletion with auto-notification to the affected users * updating news pages & portals with important announcements ... I'm sure there are countless scenarios where this might come in handy. I can see the dangers, but I think the benefits justify some more experiments. Any takers & other examples of similar semi-automated tools? -- Peace & Love, Erik DISCLAIMER: This message does not represent an official position of the Wikimedia Foundation or its Board of Trustees. "An old, rigid civilization is reluctantly dying. Something new, open, free and exciting is waking up." -- Ming the Mechanic

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More on page deletions...
by Frederick Noronha 24 Apr '07

24 Apr '07

This page on a prominent alternate global media event is being called "blatant advertising for a company, product, group, service or person". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OURMedia/NUESTROSMedios To my mind, it is a listing of themes at the conference, and participants, together with some background (including past conferences) that led to the growth of the network. Could others please give their inputs on this? FN -- FN M: 0091 9822122436 P: +91-832-240-9490 (after 1300IST please) http://fn.goa-india.org http://fredericknoronha.wordpress.com Konkani Wikipedia (under incubation) needs your help! http://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wp/kok

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Entries getting delete...
by Frederick Noronha 18 Apr '07

18 Apr '07

Hi all, I am a journalist in Goa, India and a contributor to the Wikipedia. Among other things, my interest is in ICT4D (information and communication technologies for development), and have written quite a bit on the subject. Recently, I find some entries which I initiated coming in for 'speedy deletion', which is kind of discouraging. Take the example below, of a South African group whose work I know, and certainly deserves a Wikipedia entry. http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:_LQK2Uo3l5AJ:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unga… Could I request a closer check before deleting entries, specially deserving ones (which may require a few more details and inputs, but surely not, in my view, deletion!) Regards, FN -- FN M: 0091 9822122436 P: +91-832-240-9490 (after 1300IST please) http://fn.goa-india.org http://fredericknoronha.wordpress.com Konkani Wikipedia (under incubation) needs your help! http://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wp/kok

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Wikipedia-l April 2007