Hi,
I was just wondering why there is no individual de.wikipedia.org
database dump at http://download.wikimedia.org/?
Cheers,
Sebastian
PS: Please CC me in replies as I'm not on the list. Thanks!
(Sent incorrectly first time)
On Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:08:12 +0000, Tomer Chachamu <the.r3m0t(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:48:13 -0800 (PST), Daniel Mayer
> <maveric149(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
> > --- Tomer Chachamu <the.r3m0t(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > On Wed, 2 Mar 2005 17:41:45 -0800 (PST), Daniel Mayer
> > > <maveric149(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > If I have time I'll conduct an analysis of the fund drive this weekend. I'm
> > > > particularly interested in what can be done to improve future fund drives.
> > >
> > > Please, could you find how much of the money came from donations of
> > > $100+ (or equivalent in other currencies), how much was from
> > > $75-$100...$10-20, $5-10, $0-5 ?
> >
> > Good idea.
>
> Wikimedia foundation site: "most donations we receive are the
> equivalent of $20 or less." - when I read that for the first time, I
> wondered whether these small donations were actually significant next
> to the occasional much larger one.
>
> Incidentally, the same page ("Wikimedia_needs_your_help") has a
> superscript "1" but there are no footnotes.
>
> So, er, what hardware are you actually planning to buy?
>
> Also, "10 more Squid/apache/memcached servers ordered on 14 January
> 2005. Shipped on 1 Feb with estimated delivery 8 Feb
> Delivered. Awaiting connection and setup. Likely to take several days
> for each step. JamesDay 04:24 Feb 9, 2005 (CET)"
>
> Are these servers up?
I was forwarded this by a colleague at work. While the Google bit isn't accurate, it is nice to see how our information is being used.
APPLES, WIKIPEDIA, AND THE WEB
In January, IRC Afterschool at the International High School at Prospect Heights coordinator John Kowalski began teaching an elective computer class for 25 students from over 15 different countries.
"It didn't take long for the students to start applying their newfound search skills - in no time, they were finding music from each of their home countries. And it didn't take long after that for them to learn to play it at a very soft volume, so as not to drive their teacher crazy," laughed Mr. Kowalski. Between now and June, these students will use laptops to do everything from search the web to create spreadsheets to use html language.
"So far, the classroom activities have involved learning specialized ways of retrieving information from the web - like Google's Wikipedia feature," Mr. Kowalski said. "We will soon study tools for presenting that information, using visual display tools like Powerpoint, Excel, and the web."
The International School @ Prospect Heights opened in September 2004 to serve recent immigrants who are both new to the U.S. and to learning English. IRC New York's afterschool program is currently the only afterschool program offered at the high school.
Mark Williamson a �crit:
> Are any of your students Ossetic speakers, or for
that matter speakers
> of other Russian Federation languages?
>
> Even if you don't know if any of them speak it, it
would be a very
> nice thing to mention.
>
> When Wikipedia is spread from these students to
their friends, it
> would be nice if in addition to "Russian free
encyclopedia which
> anybody can edit", they will go to a Chuvash friend
and say "Free
> encyclopedia which anybody can edit, with even a
version in Chuvash
> waiting to be built".
>
> I think that in this respect, if people were to
mention this more such
> wikipedias would have more contributors.
>
> When Danny or Jimbo or Eloquence or Angela or
whomever presents the
> concept at a conference, as far as I know they
either 1) don't mention
> languages except in passing, 2) mention that it's
multilingual and
> that there are, for example, German and Japanese
versions or 3)
> mention the fact that it is available in the
national language.
Nod... I do not know about how they present Wikipedia
but for Jimbo. And Jimbo mentions it is multilingual.
I several times had that opportunity, either to talk
in a conference, or several times per month at
journalists, and my moto is free, free and
multilingual.
(just always nice to see that I am never listed as one
of those speakers, but well... getting used to it
months after months, thanks for the cheer up Node).
But, I thought the opportunity (your mail) was too
good not to mention my latest blog, since for the
first time I wrote in english rather than french. So,
if many french wont be able to understand it, some
might.
http://anthere.shaihome.net/index.php
I often disagree with you Node, but really, in this
case, I am fullheartedly with you. I recommand you
read my little story at the end of my post in
particular.
PS : my heart is a bit bleeding that yesterday, for
the first time, I wrote in english on my blog.
PPS : My blog is dedicated to Daniel Pink and his
latest article on Wired by the way.
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FYI:
CALL FOR SUBMISSIONS
2005 International Symposium on Wikis
Oct 17-18, 2005, San Diego, California, U.S.A.
Co-located with ACM OOPSLA 2005
http://www.wikisym.org <http://www.wikisym.org/>
OVERVIEW
The 2005 International Symposium on Wikis brings together wiki
researchers, implementers, and users for the first time. The goal of the
symposium is to find a voice for the community. The symposium has a
rigorously reviewed research paper track as well as plenty of space for
practitioner reports, demonstrations, and discussions. We are honored to
announce that Ward Cunningham, the inventor and host of the original
WikiWikiWeb, will present the opening keynote talk at WikiSym 2005.
Anyone who is involved in using, researching, or developing wikis is
invited to WikiSym 2005!
We are seeking submissions for
* research papers
* practitioner reports
* demonstrations
* workshops
* panels
Research paper and practitioner report submissions are due
April 29, 2005
Workshop, and panel submissions are due
April 8, 2005
Demonstration submissions are due
July 1, 2005
Topics of interest to the symposium include, but are not limited to:
* wikis as social software
* wiki user behavior, user dynamics
* wiki user experiences, usability
* wiki implementation experiences and technology
* wiki administration, processes, dealing with abuse
* wiki scalability, social and technical
* domain-specific/special-purpose wikis
SUBMISSION DETAILS
Research papers will be reviewed by the committee to meet rigorous
academic standards of publication. Research papers are expected to
advance the state of the art by describing substantiated new research or
novel technical results or by reporting on significant experience or
experimentation. They are reviewed both with respect to conceptual
quality and clarity of presentation.
Accepted research papers will be provided as part of the conference
proceedings. They will be put into the ACM Digital Library and can be
referenced as papers that appeared in the /Proceedings of the 2005
International Symposium on Wikis./ At the symposium, the presenter will
be given a 25min + 5min Q&A presentation slot. Research papers should
not be longer than 10000 words and should meet the ACM SIG Proceedings
Format, see http://www.acm.org/sigs/pubs/proceed/template.html.
Practitioner reports will be reviewed for suitability of presentation to
the community. The primary evaluation criterion is the interest to the
community. Practitioner reports will be provided as part of the
companion to the conference proceedings handed out at the symposium and
can be referenced as papers that appeared in the /Companion to the
Proceedings of the 2005 International Symposium on Wikis./ Practitioner
reports should not be longer than 6000 words and should meet the ACM SIG
Proceedings Format.
Demonstration, workshop, and panel submissions will be reviewed for
their interest to the community. Submit two pages of description of what
you intend to do and how you meet this criterion. Please include a
100-word abstract and one-paragraph bios of all people relevant to the
submission. Demonstrations will get 45min slots in a booth of their own,
workshops will get a half-day and a room of their own, and panels will
get a 90min slot at the symposium.
Please submit your papers or proposals in PDF format (or postscript, if
you must) by the respective deadline to submissions(a)wikisym.org.
SYMPOSIUM LOGISTICS
The 2005 International Symposium on Wikis will be held at the Town and
Country Resort & Convention Center, San Diego, California, on Oct 17 and
18, 2005. WikiSym 2005 will be co-located with the ACM OOPSLA 2005
conference, and participants may register for the symposium alone, or
may jointly register for OOPSLA 2005.
If you have any questions, please contact Dirk Riehle through
chair(a)wikisym.org.
SYMPOSIUM COMMITTEE
Dirk Riehle, Independent (chair)
Ward Cunningham, Microsoft
Mark Guzdial, Georgia Institute of Technology
Matthias Jugel, Fraunhofer FIRST
Helmut Leitner, HLS Software
James Noble, Victoria University of Wellington
David Ornstein, Microsoft
Sebastien Paquet, National Research Council of Canada
Stephan Schmidt, Fraunhofer FIRST
Sunir Shah, University of Toronto
I got the following message on my (Dutch) userpage:
===========================================================
I don't subscribe to the mailing list, so I respond here:
The Norwegian Wikipedia uses no: as its interwiki code. Until we have
decided to do otherwise, please respect our choice of domain and
interwiki name.
Also, note that no: is not the "bokmål Wikipedia", as bokmål is only
one spelling standard of Standard Norwegian, which also includes
riksmål (both bokmål and riksmål are major spelling standards, the
latter being used e.g. by the most significant Norwegian newspaper
(Aftenposten). Wolfram 2 mrt 2005 15:34 (CET)
============================================================
So now I have (http://mail.wikipedia.org/pipermail/wikipedia-l/2005-February/037750.html)
someone saying it would be best to always use nb: and (above) someone
saying it would be best to always use no:. Then I have people at nn:
who really don't want it to be called no: at THEIR wiki. Could someone
please tell me who I am to listen to? By whom and where is the
decision made in a case like this?
Andre Engels
Hi,
a few HTML tags work in Wikipedia article, but <abbr> doesn't. Is there
a Wikisyntax for abbr? If not, could <abbr> be enabled until there is?
regards,
Gerrit Holl.
--
Weather in Twenthe, Netherlands 02/03 22:55:
-1.0°C wind 0.4 m/s None (57 m above NAP)
--
In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of
unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the
military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of
misplaced power exists and will persist.
-Dwight David Eisenhower, January 17, 1961
Numbers have been updated and corrected.
On Day 4 (Monday 21 February eastern US timezone since PayPal data are not
available in UTC) we made $6,287.52 (USD equivalent) through PayPal (no updates
available for other sources at this time). This is a decrease of -20.23% from
Day 3 but still does represent 18.15% of total funds collected so far
($34,648.06 ; only counting full days) and 8.38% of our goal ($75,000).
Remarkably, the rate of donations were not too adversely affected by the
downtime on Monday. Since the donation forms were not available during a large
part of the downtime, I can only guess that people remembered our PayPal
account name.
Donations did significantly increase soon after a Slashdot story about the
downtime was released (9:28PM, EST on Monday), forcing us to move the backup
donation page once the Slashdot Effect brought down the website hosting it
(http://wikisearch.org ; Sorry about that Angela).
NOTE: Pending transactions are also included in the below numbers (some of them
will likely turn out to be canceled)
Day 4 Day 3 comparison
Breakdown:
PayPal USD equiv USD equiv %change
AUD 29.68 $23.46 $330.90 -92.91%
CAD 750.35 $608.01 $238.93 154.48%
EUR 1410.77 $1,844.16 $2,755.66 -33.08%
GBP 315.19 $598.17 $696.89 -14.17%
JPY 8082 $76.61 $198.96 -61.50%
USD 3137.11 $3,137.11 $3,596.33 -12.77%
PayPal total: $6,287.52 $7,817.66 -19.57%
MoneyBookers
no data $64.00 -100.00%
TOTAL $6,287.52 $7,881.66 -20.23%
Grand totals so far (only counting complete days)
PayPal USD equiv %GrandTotal
AUD 1154.78 $912.85 2.63%
CAD 1685.27 $1,365.57 3.94%
EUR 9390.42 $12,275.16 35.43%
GBP 1637.47 $3,107.59 8.97%
JPY 90304 $855.99 2.47%
USD 15704.20 $15,704.20 45.32%
PayPal total: $34,221.37
Moneybookers:
$426.69 1.23%
GRAND TOTAL $34,648.06 100.00%
% toward goal 46.20%
For the most recent grand total and other details visit
http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Fund_drives/2005/Q1
Some selected comments from Day 4:
See http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Fund_drives/2005/Q1/Day_4
"I use Wiki - I have to pay for it !" by Immo Wetzel
"You have aided me countless times in my academic pursuits in math, science,
and the humanities. I can't thank you guys enough." by Laura Napolitano
"Wiki is the future!" by Christoph Burschka
"Wikipedia is in my opinion one of the most noble collective human endeavours
underway in the world today. Thank you so much for contributing to society with
your wonderful website. I love it and abide" by Matthew Barba
"Wikimedia Rocks!" by Jasmeet Singh
"I have always had a thirst for knowledge, and this project does more than
quench it. I am happy to donate." by Matthew Gluesenkamp
"Cheaper than cable" by Anonymous
Some of my favorites:
"Spread your Squids around the world. And use cached pages for logged in users
as well. Fix those and I'll be happy as a [[clam]]. Good job so far!!!" by Rami
Lehti
"A small price to pay for a project like this. But get a move on with all those
ambitious plans for paper versions. Most of the world doesn't have computers."
by Anonymous
"The Wikimedia Foundations is an acheivement of great proportions spreading the
one firm truth that information is truly free. Thank you." by Siddharth
Bhansali
"Help preserve the sum total of human knowledge for less than the price of two
Caramel Frappuccinos. Wikipedia is not only fat-free and carbohydrate-free, it
will never go straight to your hips!" by Jonet Greene
"Give Wiki a boost!!" by Kiminori Noma
Daniel Mayer,
Wikimedia CFO
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wikipedia-l(a)Wikimedia.org schrieb am 02.03.05 20:41:54:
> Marco Krohn wrote:
> >wikipedia-l(a)Wikimedia.org wrote:
> >>I like to point out to people that the *German* version won in a blind
> >>test against two commercial encyclopedias, and we'd like to bring the
> >>English one up to the same standard. This points out that though en: is
> >>a remarkable achievement, at least one other language version has in
> >>fact tested even better!
> >
> >IMHO the English Wikipedia was and continues to be better than
> >the German one, both in terms of quality and quantity. This of course
> >does not hold for topics that are related to Germany.
> >
> Is it relevant what wikipedia is better ?
I did not wrote anything about the relevance of being better or not.
You wrote that you want to bring the English one to the same standard
and I just pointed out that this is IMHO not necessary, since the English
one already is superior. Also, as Mav correctly remarked, the fact
that the German Wikipedia has been tested does not tell us anything
about the quality of the English version.
Also I doubt that the test was a blind test, at least the two tests
I am aware of were to my knowledge not blind tests, but I can
be wrong about this. Which test do you refer to?
> I think the different
> wikipedias can not be compared because few articles are translated and
> most articles are rewritten.
I have read dozens of articles in both versions and if the topic
is not in particular related to Germany (ICE) the English version in most
cases was better, which does not imply that the German version is bad.
This already is a comparison - of course a limited one, because I am just one
person ;-)
> With a believe that the en:wikipedia is better, you
> will not look into the other projects and find out what the strength is
> of the other projects.
I like orange juice more than apple juice, nevertheless I drink
apple juice from time to time :-)
> One nice translation excercise I learned about the other day were
> Italian students translating German wikipedia articles into Italian. The
> texts were chosen by the teacher, the students translate the article,
> the student corrects and does the proof reading and the translated
> article is posted in the Italian wikipedia. When the students become
> more able with the German language, they will translate into German. :)
This is a great idea! The copyright is a little bit of a problem, but
this should be no big deal as the students probably do not
care about this too much.
best regards,
Marco
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Dear Mark Williamson, Lars Alvik, Andre Engels and Wolfram (who is getting
a BCC of this message),
This is getting so old... <sigh> I agree with Lars Alvik that the no:/nb:
Wikipedia is de facto Norsk (Bokmål). The user interface is about 100%
percent Norsk Bokmål, the vast majority of the articles are Norsk Bokmål
(with varying tendencies towards centrist Bokmål or towards "Moderate
Bokmål"/ Riksmål). Few, if any, new articles are written in Nynorsk. I
don't know what the proportions of existing articles are, but I suspect
that well under 5% of the articles are in Nynorsk now.
nn: is being marketed as "Nynorsk Wikpedia". I am not sure what the
consensus about name for the no:/nb: Wikipedia is. A couple days ago, I
looked around for it, but could not find it. It doesn't really matter very
much for this discussion what self-designation no:/nb: uses. Nynorsk
Wikipedia has a seeming discrepancy of names between its marketed name
(Nynorsk Wikipedia) and the interwiki link name (Norsk (Nynorsk)). It is
extremely unlikely that having a similar discrepancy between marketed name
and interwiki link name is going to have any adverse effect whatsoever on
no:/nb:.
Whether Nynorsk or Bokmål or Riksmål (or Samnorsk or Høgnorsk, at that) is
the good or bad "guy", the oppressor or oppressed, or the "relevant" or
"irrelevant" one in whatever connection, seems to be a factor of very
little relevance.
Interwiki link language names should first and foremost be precise and
descriptive -- right...?
At present there is one Wikipedia with a Bokmål interface (for the record,
the difference between "Moderate Bokmål" and Riksmål is, at most, a few
dozen words with spelling differences of one or two letters) and almost
exclusively Bokmål(/Riksmål) articles. This Wikipedia, which was
established in 2001, is doing quite well -- right now, the article count
shows 18,679 articles.
There is also one Wikipedia with a Nynorsk interface (which includes a few
articles in Høgnorsk). It was started in July 2004 and has 3430 articles
right now -- it is, in other words, also doing quite well.
Both these are predominantly written in an official form of Norwegian.
Neither of the two is more Norwegian, and neither is less.
Nynorsk corresponds most closely to the spoken language of the majority of
Norwegian speakers, Bokmål is written by the majority of Norwegian
speakers. Both are recognised as official languages of Norway. Both have a
large body of literature on a high quality level. As such, they are both
important, relevant expressions of Norwegian and should be treated with the
tolerance, fairness and respect they both deserve.
The term "Standard Norwegian" (quoted by Andre Engels from a message from
Wolfram to him) is a bit of a stretch: There is in fact (as already
mentioned above) no single "Standard Norwegian", but *two*: Bokmål
(including subsets like Riksmål, moderat bokmål and radikalt bokmål; and,
to some extent, Samnorsk) and Nynorsk (including subsets like Høgnorsk,
Midlandsnormal, Austlandsk, etc.)
To Wolfram's defense (since he doesn't subscribe to this list and hence
can't defend himself directly on the list), it should be said that he does
participate on nn: -- in editing, in debates, as well as in uploading
files, and his contributions are as welcome on nn: as I hope that mine, and
others' who also write primarily on nn: these days, are on no:/nb:... :-)
Lars Alvik (whose opinions and discussion manners I have learned to respect
very much), wrote (03:10 03/03/2005 +0000):
>Go for no:.
>Riksmål can be compared to bokmål as american english and english. Minor
>differences. As for Aftenposten it's in theory riksmål, but generally the
>articles is written in moderate bokmål.
>
>As for me i would welcome a formalization of no: to just bokmål
>(and riksmål), but with bokmål as the dominant one, ie, all the
>categories in bokmål. (example Sør-Afrika instead of Syd-Afrika).
I agree almost 100% wholly with what Lars says here.
It would by all likelihood be a major benefit for the no: Wikipedia to
formalise its language as Bokmål, with the very closely-related Riksmål
being accepted as part of this.
One significant part of the reason why Nynorsk Wikipedia was established
was that we wanted to be able to work in an environment tuned-in on Nynorsk
as a written language. This is also very much what we have found to happen:
Besides the basic fact-checking and debating of points of view, we have a
strong emphasis on orthography, syntax, semantics and style.
I suspect that a change of politics on no: towards really focussing on
Bokmål (in its variety) could have a similar effect, and it would very
likely be a very good way of strengthening the Bokmål (widely defined)
writing culture.
But whether the no:/nb: Wikipedia wishes to keep a few articles in Nynorsk
or not, or what the no:/nb: Wikpedia is called is not really the main issue
here, I think.
What the issue seems to be is more about what should show up in interwiki
links.
I believe that the most precise and descriptive LANGUAGE DESCRIPTION in
INTERWIKI links is "Norsk (bokmål)"
-- not "Norsk" (because it is only one of two subsets that are officially
recognised as "Standard Norwegian"), and
-- and not "Bokmål", because this will be likely to cause confusion when
users don't find the language under "N".
Whether this comes up by coding "nb:" or "no:" is not really important. It
is the result that counts, right?
PLEASE NOTE that the question is NOT whether to call no:/nb: "Bokmål" or
"Norsk".
The question is whether interwiki links on the bottom left of the screen
should display "Norsk (bokmål)" or just "Norsk".
It was suggested here earlier that no: be made a general "Norwegian"
portal, and that nb: would be the primary code for the mainly Bokmål
Wikipedia. That seems to be politically impossible in the current environment.
Maybe the most logical step in the current situation would be to change the
display of the "no:" code so that it displays "Norsk (bokmål)" in interwiki
links? That way, the interwiki links will be descriptive/factual: Norsk
(bokmål) vs. Norsk (nynorsk), rather than prescriptive: Norsk vs. Norsk
(nynorsk).
I will support such a modification wholeheartedly. If this happens, I am
pretty sure that the Nynorsk wikipedia community will be as willing as
anyone else to use the code no: exclusively if it displays a descriptive
name of what no: de facto is.
Meanwhile, the use of a currently secondary interwiki code (nb:) is the
only way to ensure logical interwiki links from Norsk (nynorsk) to Norsk
(bokmål), and no matter how Wolfram feels about that, his argument that
no:/nb: should decide their own name has as a consequence that nn:
should decide how to build interwiki links on their own project.
Since this question involves many other parties too, I personally find this
question ("Norsk" vs "Norsk (bokmål)") to be one that should be discussed
and resolved in an open, democratic, respectful and transparent way here on
wikipedia-l -- a forum which is there precisely to work on solving these
kinds of issues... That means that we should stay factual and try very hard
not to avoid loaded characterisations like "Nynorsk hater"/"Bokmål
hater"/"language fanatic" and the like, or imprecise expressions like
"Standard Norwegian" when Bokmål(/Riksmål) (only one out of two standard
forms of Norwegian) is implied.
(When it comes to acceptance/non-acceptance of specific language varieties,
that is a totally different issue that would be at least as logical to
resolve locally to the extent possible.)
I wish that Wolfram, who plays a rather central rôle on no:/nb:, would
participate here and join the open debate in the "Wikipedia spirit". The
burden isn't really that big -- after all, one doesn't have to read every
single message. But it is useful for all parties if central people are able
to participate in debates about their "own" project when these discussions
occur...
Respectfully,
Olve Utne
("User:Olve" -- bureaucrat of nn:, admin of no:/nb:, user on en:, sv:, da:,
etc.)
___________________
Olve Utne
http://utne.nvg.org