On Tue, Aug 8, 2017 at 2:20 AM, Gnangarra <gnangarra(a)gmail.com> wrote:
its the cultural differences that influence the
policy, so who's culture is
more significant than everyone elses that will dictate the policies.
On 8 August 2017 at 08:14, John Erling Blad <jeblad(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Yes there are cultural differences between
wikipedias on _content_, but
there should be no differences on _policy_ about that content.
Note also that there are some differences on use of _facts_ that are
highly
troublesome, and that comes from relaxed core
policies.
Armenian genocide for example.
On Mon, Aug 7, 2017 at 3:48 PM, Gnangarra <gnangarra(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> to quote, worth a read before even considering policies being global
>
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/asi.23901/abstract
>
> This article explores the relationship between linguistic culture and
the
> > preferred standards of presenting
information based on article
> > representation in major Wikipedias. Using primary research analysis
of
the
> number of images, references, internal links, external links, words,
and
> > characters, as well as their proportions in Good and Featured
articles
on
> the eight largest Wikipedias, we discover a
high diversity of
approaches
> and format preferences, correlating with
culture. We demonstrate that
> high-quality standards in information presentation are not globally
shared
> and that in many aspects, the language culture's influence determines
what
> is perceived to be proper, desirable, and exemplary for encyclopedic
> entries. As a result, we demonstrate that standards for encyclopedic
> knowledge are not globally agreed-upon and “objective” but local and
very
> > subjective.
> >
>
> On 4 August 2017 at 10:18, Ziko van Dijk <zvandijk(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > The number of pillars depends on the language version...
> > And whether some rules is called pilöar not dpes not seem to be pf
much
>
importance
> Ziko
>
> John Erling Blad <jeblad(a)gmail.com> schrieb am Do. 3. Aug. 2017 um
14:42:
>
> > Five pillars are moot.
> >
> > On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 2:59 PM, Gnangarra <gnangarra(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> > >
> > > > The moment you have a centralised policy you take away the
ability
to
> > > > discuss, makes decisions, and achieve consensus from the
community
that
> > > create the projects. Importantly you create the opportunity for
banned
> > and
> > > blocked editors to decide what happens in a community.
> > >
> > > By having a base set of simple policies in the Incubator that are
> > > atuomatically created when a project starts up you give them the
best
> > guide
> > > to establishing themselves well before that project goes live,
ince
a
> > > > project is live it has to be allowed to develop its community.
> > > >
> > > > We already have the 5 pillars which are the basis for the
projects,
but
> > > meta is not a place that the content creating community spends a
lot
> of
> > > > time.
> > > >
> > > > On 3 August 2017 at 19:07, John Erling Blad <jeblad(a)gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Having centralized core policies would lessen the maintenance
and
> >
> process,
> > > > not increase them.
> > > >
> > > > On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 11:17 AM, Strainu <strainu10(a)gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > The core policies should be the ones pushed by board
resolution,
> > and
> > > > > > those should be the absolute minimum required to keep the
> projects
> > > > > > safe from a legal POV. Period. Otherwise, people with
little
> > > > > > understanding of small Wikipedias will try to push stuff
from
> > en.wp.
> > > > > > Just recently someone was trying to have an RFC on meta on
all
the
> > > > > different processes that en.wp has and ro.wp does not have,
with
> > > > > > little consideration on whether the manpower to implement,
let
> > alone
> > > > > > maintain, these processes exists. No thank you to rule
pushing
> > > without
> > > > > > local context.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Having a community take a rule from en.wp is different,
just
as
>
long
> > > > > as some kind of discussion happens within the community about
it.
> > > Even
> > > > > > if the rule is really useless or harmful and the community
did
not
> > > > > realize that in the beginning, at least it can evolve
differently
> > > from
> > > > > > the English one. Have a centralized repository and trying
to
> change
> > > > > > the rules there by consensus would be much more difficult
for
> small
> > > > > > communities.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Strainu
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 2017-08-02 17:05 GMT+03:00 John Erling Blad <
jeblad(a)gmail.com
:
> > > > > > Nearly all Wikipedia projects has virtually the same core
content
> > > > > policies,
> > > > > > but with slightly different wording. Nearly all, because a
lot
> of
> > > the
> > > > > > > smaller lacks them, and a lot has outdated or only
partial
> > > policies.
> > > > It
> > > > > > > takes a lot of time to actually make them and keep
them
> updated.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Creating and maintaining the core content policies
should
not
be
> > > > > something
> > > > > > that small projects should invest a lot of time in, they
should
> > > > simply
> > > > > be
> > > > > > > able to point to existing policies on Meta. The
central
> policies
> > > > should
> > > > > > be
> > > > > > > localized if necessary.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Checking Meta I find
> > > > > > > -
https://meta.wikimedia.org/
wiki/The_no_original_research_
> > policy
> > > > > > > -
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Neutral_point_of_view
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I can't find anything like
"Verifiability".
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Would it be possible for Wikimedia Foundation to make
some
> sound
> > > > > baseline
> > > > > > > policies, and with the option for local projects to
refine
> those?
> > > > > Perhaps
> > > > > > > with assistance from editors on Wikipedia?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Lets try to make the policies accurate, without
"no
original
> >
> research"
> > > > > > diverging into verifiability of external sources. It should
be
> > > about
> > > > > > > original research in content on Wikipedia. Likewise,
at
some
> >
projects
> > > > > > neutral point of view has become "do not diverge from
creators
> > > point
> > > > of
> > > > > > > view"…
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Would this be possible? It would be really nice if
those
> baseline
> > > > > > policies
> > > > > > > pages could be copied to the individual projects like
central
>
user
> > > > pages,
> > > > > > so they would be "internal" to the projects. Thus
the
projects
> > > would
> > > > > have
> > > > > > > more "ownership" of them.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The same thing apply to other meta projects
(Wikipedia,
> > Wikibooks,
> > > > > > > Wiktionary, etc).
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Jeblad
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > --
> > > GN.
> > > President Wikimedia Australia
> > > WMAU:
http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/User:Gnangarra
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