Re: [Wikimedia-l] Can we see the Knight grant application and grant offer?

15 Feb 2016


      Hoi,
Search is relatively stand alone. It has been improved in the past. As it
is, there are gaping holes that are easily fixed with a hack by Magnus.
Search for instance on the Tamil Wikipedia for an English Wikipedia article
only or for an American like Valerie Simpson that does not.
Improving search does not have the same impact that the editor has. The
quality as it is poor to say the least. How for instance do you find
pictures of a 'paard' the windmill thingie? The notion that something has
to be done in a particular way is imho a knee jerk reaction. We do not
fulfil our mission; sharing in the sum of all knowledge, we do not even
begin to share what is available to us.
Has the community ever decided that search is any good? Really, it has
improved a lot over the years but it is still poor and we can use the money
of the Knight foundation to do a better job. It needs to be exponentially
better.
Thanks,
       GerardM
On 15 February 2016 at 17:13, Steinsplitter Wiki <
steinsplitter-wiki@live.com> wrote:
...
Regarding
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Jimbo_Wales/Statement_of_principles
Any changes to the software must be gradual and reversible. We
need to make sure that any changes contribute positively to the
community, as ultimately determined by the Wikimedia Foundation, in full
 consultation with the community consensus.

Lila at all, Why you don't consult he community about new projects/code?
...
Date: Mon, 15 Feb 2016 02:35:06 -0800
From: lila@wikimedia.org
To: wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Can we see the Knight grant application and
grant  offer?
...
Hi Gnangarra,
Thank you for forwarding, the authors of the article seem to be confused
about the nature of the project. Our Comms team is working to clarify
this.
...
Please expect to see something from us in next few days.
Lila
On Sun, Feb 14, 2016 at 8:51 PM, Gnangarra gnangarra@gmail.com wrote:
...
FYI making main stream media
http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2016-02-15/wikimedia-foundation-aims-to-take-o...
...
...
On 14 February 2016 at 00:49, Anthony Cole ahcoleecu@gmail.com
wrote:
...
...
...
Anne, we're talking about almost the same thing, but not exactly. I
say
...
...
...
"advised" you say "consulted". "Consulted" implies soliciting or
expecting
...
some kind of response or engagement - probably
approval/disapproval/critique/input. "Advised" means they got the
memo. I
...
...
...
think "advised" is enough, and if the board wants more engagement,
they
...
...
can
...
initiate it - presuming the notification is clear and comprehensive,
of
...
...
...
course.
Anthony Cole
On Sat, Feb 13, 2016 at 10:37 AM, Risker risker.wp@gmail.com
wrote:
...
...
...
...
Well, I'm not sure about that, Anthony.  By "consulted", I would
mean
...
...
...
...
something to the effect of "We're looking at applying to XX for a
grant
...
...
...
of
...
$YYY to do ZZZ" and asking the Board if they would be likely to
agree
...
...
to
...
...
accept such a grant if the application is successful.  The grant
application, evaluation and approval process is costly in both
time and
...
...
...
...
resources, and for both the applicant and the grantmaker.  Being
informed
...
...
that a grant has been approved sounds more like a fait accompli
situation
...
...
for the Board - they look petty and ungrateful if they say no,
even if
...
...
...
they
...
don't think it was a reasonable grant application.  In this case,
we're
...
...
...
...
only dealing with $250,000.  What if this was $1 million?  $10
million?
...
...
...
...
I think it is healthier for everyone if the Board is properly
consulted
...
...
...
...
before the application is submitted.  (And again, I note that we
don't
...
...
...
know
...
how much was actually requested in this case, only what was
granted.)
...
...
...
...
Risker/Anne
On 12 February 2016 at 21:23, Anthony Cole ahcoleecu@gmail.com
wrote:
...
...
...
Anne, regarding:
"Since the Board must approve acceptance of any donations over
$100,000
...
...
...
USD, it seems to be obvious that they should be consulted and
possibly
...
...
...
should actively approve any grant applications where the dollar
value
...
...
...
...
...
sought is higher than that amount."
I'm not sure that the board should be *consulted* ahead of such
applications' or should prior-approve all such applications. That
seems a
...
...
bit like micromanagement. But it makes sense to me for the board
to
...
...
be
...
...
...
*advised
*of such applications and when they're being actively
contemplated or
...
...
...
...
...
prepared.
Anthony Cole
On Fri, Feb 12, 2016 at 9:11 PM, Risker risker.wp@gmail.com
wrote:
...
...
...
...
...
> I'm sorry to hear that you feel this way, Gerard. I personally
would
...
...
like
...
> to feel more assured that the WMF is looking into the longer
future
...
...
...
and
...
...
> actively plannning for the day that donations no longer
support a
...
...
...
large
...
...
> staff doing lots of things.
>
> I am concerned today that the team specifically tasked to work
closely
...
...
with
> so many elements of the community has lost 7% of its staff,
and 30%
...
...
...
of
...
...
its
> leaders, in a single week. This should be a concern in any
organization.
...
>
> With respect to the Knight grant - I know that many times grant
> applications are made for considerably more than is given, and
I am
...
...
...
...
...
> interested to know how much the WMF requested in the first
place.
...
...
I
...
...
...
would
> also like to know whether or not the Board was formally
advised of
...
...
...
the
...
...
> request before it was submitted.  Since the Board must approve
acceptance
...
> of any donations over $100,000 USD, it seems to be obvious that
they
...
...
...
should
> be consulted and possibly should actively approve any grant
applications
...
> where the dollar value sought is higher than that amount.  I
don't
...
...
...
...
...
believe
> the current policies require advance approval or even advance
notification,
> though.
>
> Risker/Anne
>
> On 12 February 2016 at 03:54, Gerard Meijssen <
gerard.meijssen@gmail.com
...
>
> wrote:
>
> > Hoi,
> > I am not complaining. I point out that all this huha does
not get
...
...
...
us
...
...
> > anywhere. I am not afraid to give an opinion and I am not
afraid
...
...
to
...
...
be
...
a
> > contrarian when I think it makes sense. Yes, things happened
that
...
...
...
...
were
...
> not
> > beautiful. They are not what upset me. What upsets me is that
people
...
...
like
> > Siko and Anna are leaving. Because they are part of "my"
Wikimedia
...
...
...
> > Foundation. What upsets me is that I routinely use Magnus's
tool
...
...
...
and
...
...
> > process hundreds of thousands of records and am to understand
that
...
...
...
> official
> > query is stunted and does not allow for this "because it was
not
...
...
in
...
...
the
...
> > design" and it is then pointed out that it takes money to
solve
...
...
...
...
this...
...
> >
> > My point is that baying for blood is not what helps us
forward.
...
...
...
What
...
I
...
do
> > know is that when sheer negativity is not coupled with an
ability
...
...
...
to
...
...
stop
> > and move forward, we will get in a downward spiral. I fault
Pine
...
...
...
for
...
...
not
> > being able to stop. What I wish for is for people like Anna
and
...
...
...
Siko
...
...
and
> > money for our environment and not for an endowment.
> > Thanks,
> >       GerardM
> >
> > On 12 February 2016 at 09:35, Michel Vuijlsteke <
wikipedia@zog.org
...
...
...
> wrote:
> >
> > > Gerard,
> > >
> > > I was waiting for this mail. For me personally, your
complaining
...
is
...
...
> > > achieving exactly the opposite of what you think.
> > >
> > > It sounds as if you'd much rather prefer to stick your
head in
...
...
...
the
...
...
sand
> > and
> > > hope things will blow over. "Move along, nothing to see
here --
...
...
...
oh
...
...
> look!
> > > something positive over there!" is not going to solve
anything.
...
...
...
...
...
> > >
> > > Michel
> > >
> > > On 12 February 2016 at 09:24, Gerard Meijssen <
> gerard.meijssen@gmail.com
> > >
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hoi,
> > > > Pine as you are talking about "self inflicting wounds" I
take
...
...
...
it
...
...
you
> > are
> > > > not talking in your personal capacity. When is it enough
for
...
...
...
you?
...
...
> When
> > > are
> > > > you going to talk about positive things, things that will
move
...
us
...
...
> > > forward.
> > > > Why ask for blood and more blood? What is it that you
hope to
...
...
...
...
...
> achieve?
> > > >
> > > > Who do you represent in this unending litany of
negativity
...
...
and
...
...
what
...
> > have
> > > > you achieved in this way? When Lila was engaged in her
role,
...
...
...
she
...
...
was
> to
> > > > direct in a different direction and she is doing that.
You
...
...
may
...
...
not
...
> like
> > > it
> > > > and that is ok.
> > > > Thanks,
> > > >        GerardM
> > > >
> > > > On 12 February 2016 at 08:43, Pine W <
wiki.pine@gmail.com>
...
...
...
...
wrote:
...
> > > >
> > > > > Dariusz, thanks for continuing to engage here. Besides
the
...
...
...
good
...
...
> > > questions
> > > > > that others have asked, I'll add a few:
> > > > >
> > > > > 1. If the Knowledge Engine is such an important
project,
...
...
why
...
is
...
...
it
> > not
> > > > > mentioned in
> > > > >
> > >
>
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_Annual_Plan/2015-16
...
...
...
...
...
> > > > ?
> > > > >
> > > > > 2. I realize that as a percentage of the WMF budget,
$250k
...
...
...
is a
...
...
> > > > relatively
> > > > > small number. As others have said, this is not a
reason for
...
...
...
...
...
opacity
> > > about
> > > > > it, nor a reason for not having a conversation with the
community
...
> > about
> > > > > something so strategically important as a decision to
explore
...
...
the
...
> > > > question
> > > > > of "Would users go to Wikipedia if it were an open
channel
...
...
...
...
beyond
...
> an
> > > > > encyclopedia?" It's one thing to have a blue-sky
exercise
...
...
...
...
...
thinking
> > > about
> > > > > possibilities, and another thing to take a $250k step
in
...
...
that
...
...
...
> > > direction,
> > > > > especially without consulting the community.
> > > > >
> > > > > 3. I am getting tired about seeing bad news in general
about
...
...
WMF
...
> > > > > governance, planning, and turnover. I am curious how
you
...
...
plan
...
...
to
...
> > > address
> > > > > those issues. Like you, I would rather that we be
talking
...
...
...
about
...
...
our
> > > > > movement plans for the next 10 years. However, it's
difficult
...
...
to
...
> have
> > > > those
> > > > > conversations when WMF is making so many self-inflicted
wounds.
...
...
The
> > > > recent
> > > > > round of resignations is of respectable people from
the WMF
...
...
...
...
staff
...
> is
> > > > making
> > > > > the situation that much more concerning and that much
more
...
...
...
...
...
> difficult
> > to
> > > > > recover from. It seems to me that WMF leadership has
lost
...
...
...
...
control
...
> of
> > > this
> > > > > situation, and I'd like to hear what the recovery plan
is.
...
...
...
...
...
> > Personally,
> > > I
> > > > > feel that we need leadership that can build good
relationships
...
...
with
> > the
> > > > > staff and community, is transparent by default, and is
capable
...
of
...
> > > > restoring
> > > > > the credibility of the organization's planning,
execution,
...
...
...
and
...
...
> > > goodwill.
> > > > I
> > > > > think that we may need new leadership to make that
happen.
...
...
I
...
am
...
...
> > > > interested
> > > > > to hear your thoughts.
> > > > >
> > > > > Pine
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Thu, Feb 11, 2016 at 7:32 PM, Dariusz Jemielniak <
> > darekj@alk.edu.pl
> > > >
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > 11.02.2016 10:23 PM "SarahSV" <
sarahsv.wiki@gmail.com>
...
...
...
...
...
> napisał(a):
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > Hi 
> > > > > > > Dariusz,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > T
> > > > > > > he grant application doesn't restrict the search
engine
...
...
...
to
...
...
> > > Wikimedia
> > > > > > projects. It says that the "Knowledge Engine by
Wikipedia
...
...
...
[is
...
...
a]
> > > system
> > > > > for
> > > > > > discovering reliable and trustworthy public
information
...
...
on
...
...
the
...
> > > > Internet.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > My understanding is that the top range could
potentially
...
...
be
...
...
all
...
> > > > > open/public
> > > > > > resources, but this is the far stretched total goal,
and
...
...
...
...
still
...
> not
> > a
> > > > > > general search engine of all content including
commercial
...
...
...
...
one.
...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > And a rrasonable realistic outcome can be just
improving
...
...
...
our
...
...
> > searches
> > > > > > across projects.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I can't comment on the initial ideas or goals, as I
was
...
...
not
...
...
on
...
> the
> > > > Board
> > > > > > before August 2015, but this is what I understand we
build
...
...
now.
...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > .
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The document says the "Search Engine by Wikipedia"
budget
...
...
for
...
> > > > 2015–2016
> > > > > > ($2.4 million) was approved by the board. Can you
point
...
...
us
...
...
to
...
> > which
> > > > > board
> > > > > > meeting approved it and what was discussed there?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I dont recall this specifically, and I'm going to
elude
...
...
...
this
...
...
> > question
> > > > by
> > > > > > going to sleep (and hoping someone better informed
may
...
...
...
pick).
...
...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Good night!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Dj
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > > >
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
...
...
...
...
...
> > > > > > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > > > > Unsubscribe:
> > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > > > mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org
 > ?subject=unsubscribe>
> > > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > >
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
...
...
...
...
...
> > > > > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > > > Unsubscribe:
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > > mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org
 ?subject=unsubscribe>
> > > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > > > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > > Unsubscribe:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org
?subject=unsubscribe
> > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org
?subject=unsubscribe>
...
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
...
> > <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org
?subject=unsubscribe>
...
...
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
...
...
> <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org
?subject=unsubscribe>
...
...
...
>
_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
...
...
...
<mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org
?subject=unsubscribe>
...
...
...
...
...

Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
...
...
...
...
<mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org
?subject=unsubscribe>
...
...
...
...

Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
...
...
...
mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
--
GN.
President Wikimedia Australia
WMAU: http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/User:Gnangarra
Photo Gallery: http://gnangarra.redbubble.com
_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
--
Lila Tretikov
Wikimedia Foundation
*“Be bold and mighty forces will come to your aid.”*
_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
...
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

2025

2024

2023

2022

2021

2020

2019

2018

2017

2016

2015

2014

2013

2012

2011

2010

2009

2008

2007

2006

2005

2004

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Can we see the Knight grant application and grant offer?