An Important Perspective from Pune wikimedia Community . Putting blame on students and educational system does not help us to study from this experience . In addition , i was always wondering how we omitted addressing copy-vios from the programme plan, since it is always expected in "assignment" based IEP model . ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Ashwin Baindur <ashwin.baindur(a)gmail.com> Date: Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 9:13 AM Subject: Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] Death and Post-mortem of Indian Education Program pilot To: Wikimedia India Community list <wikimediaindia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org> *On Sun, Nov 13, 2011 at 4:28 PM, Srikanth Lakshmanan <srik.lak(a)gmail.com> wrote:* *I would also request people not to fork any more new threads on this with same thoughts, * CAMPUS AMBASSADOR SETBACK - The Local Community Viewpoint The recent hiatus in the Campus Education program proved what the Pune Community knew. That the statue had feet of clay. For a long time we have kept quiet, not wanting to disturb the boat but the time has come to tell the tale. So it helps all concerned to revisit the previous decisions, actions and provides for better opportunities for improvements in future. Hisham first came to Pune in February to our meetup on his trip around the country to meet communities. He is smart, very likeable, intelligent, focussed and erudite. We were impressed and happy that a suitable person would support communities through the India program. In his subsequent visits over the next two months, whenever we met, there was no mention of the campus ambassador scheme or of a pilot project. The ambassador project was launched without any intimation and/or consultation with the community. The launch of the pilot project in Pune came as a complete surprise to the Community who read it from news reports. Ignoring the slight, on the basis of an email received rather late in the day, we looked forward to participating and hoped to make a meaningful contribution. We felt that with our contacts, experience, knowledge of local language, customs, etc. It would be a mutually beneficial partnership with campus ambassadors, which would result in adding to the strength of the very small community in Pune. We had no illusions that we could add great editting power to the venture because of the size of our community. Instead, we hoped to play the role of friend, philosopher and guide. We hoped to bring the following to the venture: * Wiki editting experience - we had a small handful of veteran editors including an admin (Srikeit). Whereas Hisham had none and little knowledge of the environment or knowledge of the way Wikipedians think. * Huge experience in event management, FOSS, crisis-management in wide fields of experience etc. * Intimate life-long knowledge of the educational system in Pune. One of our communities member Harshad is a notable cog in the academy machinery. Sudhanwa has been instructor in half a dozen colleges and has a valuable network of contacts in Pune as well as insight into attitudes, local politics, expectations etc. The Community also has well-wishers such as Mr Lalit Kathpalia, Director SICSR besides others. * A permanent long-term continuing presence in Pune (which Hisham or his staff do not have even today). * Capacity to act as mentors to campus ambassadors and provide moral and other kinds of support to CAs. * Capacity to act as “train the trainers”. * A limited capacity to edit the offerings of the students (which we considered, the least of the value that we could bring to the table). * Expertise for the Indic wikipedia aspects of the initiative, especially Marathi Wikipedia. Somehow, I do not know why, involvement of the community itself was bypassed, not wanted or not required by the program team. We were always asking for information, it was not directed purposefully towards us. The time came for the first Campus Ambassador. When we suggested that it was time to develop the syllabus, we were sent the American syllabus used to train the CAs which had a different setting to ours. We were wondering how such a thing was to be implemented. We prepared our draft points for how the training should be organised and waited to discuss the issue but by the time we could meet again, it was just a few days away from the training. To our surprise, we came to know of an airlift of PPI bigwigs from America - Frank Schulenberg, Annie Lin and PJ Tabit (an American CA on sabbatical to Pune). When we met just two days before the training became, we were told that Annie was driving the show. When Annie was asked what role she expected us to play, she asked Ashwin to give an opening address and we played some part in some discussions and case studies. Sudhanwa and Ashwin were there on Day One and Madar Kulkarni on Day two. Srikeit was there on both days (we came to know he is being co-opted into the CA program on a fellowship). Mr Lalit Kathpalia, a well-wisher of the Wikipedia Pune Community and Director, Symbiosis Institue of Computer Science and Research and Mr Harshad Gune, Deputy Director and member of Pune Wikipedian community provided the facilities for conduct of the CA program. During the training, the CAs were eager, excited and charged up. Frank, Annie, PJ did a great job in the training, even though it was clear to us that what was the need of the moment was not being taught. Without even the know how of how to do a single meaningful edit, CAs were being motivated to be effective campus ambassadors - the horse was put before the cart. During the training, we felt there was a disjunct between what the Pune community was propagating as the points for immediate action and the message being given in the training. For example, the need for being a competent editor was being glossed over, in fact we felt that the message was that editting and Wiki experience is over-rated, that newcomers do a better job than Wikipedians. After the training, Ashwin wrote a note of dissent on the talk page of the CAs at the time: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikimedia_Foundation_-_India_Programs/I… In the light of how the community perceived itself, we gave address on a number of issues, which were voiced to Hisham over a period of time. At that point of time, the involvement of the Pune community in the WikiConference work had not yet started. A large number of issues were raised. These included: * Need for a project management approach, with deliverables, stages, identification of scaling resources, check-backs, etc was emphasised. * Attitudes of local college managements and how to function in Pune academic environment were given. * Intricacies of academic systems in the colleges, universities in Pune were explained. * Cultural differences between colleges, their goals and priorities, as well as their mutual relations were told. * It was indicated that this was the wrong timing to start the program from point of view of forthcoming exams and vacations. * We asked an important question - what is the take home for the stake holders? There were adequate take-homes for the CA (a certificate, a T shirt, learning experiences. opportunities in Wikiworld, recognition and some marks for the exam). The participating students were only getting wiki-knowledge and assignment marks. Was that enough to motivate them? There was no formal training for the actual editors. * Most important of all, what is there in return to the stake holders like colleges? This question is still unanswered. There has to be something for all the stakeholders (CAs, students, college teachers, college management, community, IEP program team) in the program. Right now, only Wikipedia is the ultimate beneficiary. and partly CAs and some students. For a win-win situation, everybody must have something reasonable for take-home. * We repeatedly emphasised the need for the staff person to be recruited from Pune and function from Pune 24x7, who should preferably be Maharashtrian, and having local contacts, rather than be from Delhi, stationed there and fly in here for a few days a week (as we were told it would be). * The need for rigorous training of campus ambassadors and formal training for student editors. The community felt that it was not quite being listened to. Slowly contact with Hisham dwindled. We never came to know except through grape-vine when Hisham was in town. It appeared to us that the community mattered no more and the IEP (India Education Project) was the whole-soul focus. Our contact with local CAs was not encouraged. When a request was made for at least one Pune community member to be on the CA mailing list so that we could be in the loop and available for ready support and advice, it was not agreed. This led to the community being effectively excluded from CA. Hisham had never seriously advocated interaction of CAs with us and only a few Wikipedian CAs and some other interested CAs interacted with us sporadically. Some of CAs turned up at our last monthly meetup only after they got a bashing about the copy-vios asking for some help. And then vanished again when some suggestions and action plan was given. There was one exception. One of the Pune community members, Prof Radha Misra is running a quiet, efficient IEP in her department and college. The community was invited by her to conduct two wiki-academies in different workshops in her College which were successfully conducted. We thank her for the support to the community. Reluctantly we came to the conclusion that the local Pune community had no role to play in IEP. We decided to support the initiative passively. Soon the WikiConference planning started and our attention and energies were drawn away. program was being grilled by the world community. Out of sheer lack of interest, we had stopped inquiring into CA affairs, we no longer watched IEP pages though we came across some activity going on from time to time. Because of this, the true state of affairs and scope of the setback came to us only with the latest Signpost. Now a lot of blame has been put on the educational system, students attitudes etc. That is true that they are a contributory cause but the blame must also lie with those responsible for planning. If the priorities in training CAs were got wrong, it takes no leap of imagination to imagine other decisions may not have been optimal either. The Campus Ambassadors, God bless them, are mostly blameless. The Pune Community had a clearer idea of what was involved right in the beginning than the India Programs office. Its decades of experience in academicia (Harshad & Sudhanwa), FOSS (Sudhanwa), industry (Mandar), teaching (Sudhanwa & Ashwin), marketing (Mahitgar), retired marathi expert (J), business (Suhel), armed forces (Ashwin), Wikipedia experience (in en:WP, mr:WP, Commons) and the general management experience and detailed on-site knowledge etc were a very valuable human resource, and these were made available to Hisham. He chose to sip sparingly. Perhaps, just perhaps, if he had drunk deeply - recognised that the miniscule Pune community was a true well-wisher, and had made us a true partner, the outcome may have been different. The purpose of this feedback is to educate people about the need to engage local communities. Communities are not easily engaged. Each has its own complexities. Their capacities to help you forward your plans may be limited and nuanced. They cannot be taken for granted either. Often you have to prove your worth to them. Some communities may even be of nuisance value unless engaged. But if properly engaged, they can bring you unique viewpoints, opportunities; they will stand by you in difficult times, sometimes a critical breakthrough may come from them. They are an important stakeholder, no matter what your opinion of them is and they will play a role in your activities. It is up to you to help make them an asset or a liability and that, in our opinion, is a vital lesson to learn in addition to all the others. We are really unhappy that the Pune pilot should falter and that all this has to come out. But the lesson needs to be learned, so the story needs to be told. Warm regards, Sudhanwa Jogalekar, Mandar Kulkarni, Ashwin Baindur and other members of Pune Community _______________________________________________ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l -- "[It is not] possible to distinguish between 'numerical' and 'nonnumerical' algorithms, as if numbers were somehow different from other kinds of precise information." - Donald Knuth -- "[It is not] possible to distinguish between 'numerical' and 'nonnumerical' algorithms, as if numbers were somehow different from other kinds of precise information." - Donald Knuth