Dear all, Well as you know, Brazil is a priority, but when spending is a waste. We have a volunteer group that operates in Brazil since 2008 in direct contact with the problems of Brazil, know much about the free national culture, know a lot about education in the country, and their projects, they can tell the reasons why Brazil has poor performance on Wikipedia. Wikimedia Foundation conducted several interviews with the group, I was interviewed three times and had several conversations with several different employees. Also recently a person was hired to do a search on this, already operating in Brazil. And yesterday they announced the arrival of two more employees to ask only that, again. [1] They already have the answer to these interviews, what they are asking again?
And what I find worse is the fact that there is a prohibitive message for explanation of other Wikimedia projects. As for the local group that Wikipedia is not central. And there will be an office of WMF, only to activities for Wikipedia. And many Brazilians criticize the model of the WMF, and that centralization in Wikipedia. Wikipedia is only the tenth seventh most visited site in the country. Need better, yes, but the problem is the community that is not healthy, and that the WMF does not interfere on that. So it's skating, and spending resources unnecessarily.
Several staff members say the Wikipedia impact is larger than the other projects. Which has more impact for you? "The Movement Wikimedia projects through education, created free educational resources available in Wikibooks, and classes on Wikiversity, this could change the lives of thousands of poor children" or "The Movement Wikimedia succeeded in creating an encyclopaedia in Portuguese high quality "
Unfortunately I live in a country that 38% of teens lives in extreme poverty [2], how they want to create a program just with universities, to share knowledge if people that never walk inside one university? Or not be able to read the contents of Wikipedia because they were not properly literate. I'm not talking to literate Brazilians, I'm talking to create free educational resources, and create classes, and encourage businesses and organizations to do that change, this is a collaborative work.
With the money spent to keep three people six days in Brazil from the U.S.A., we could fund a fellow to start a social work with teachers to create this material.What is the interest of the WMF on this? "Our priority is Wikipedia "
*Imagine a world in which every single human being can freely share in the sum of all knowledge. That's our commitment. * I'll keep imagining, and having to push myself very hard to see this world. That will never be reached by Wikipedia alone.Especially in Brazil.
If it were to promote Wikipedia as a site, it would be best to hire a company, not a Foundation, if that way selected, do things as a Foundation.
Sorry for my English, I'm tired and I didn't review.
[1] https://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikip%C3%A9dia:Esplanada/geral/Wikip%C3%A9dia_... [2] http://noticias.r7.com/brasil/noticias/adolescentes-sao-mais-pobres-que-rest...
On Wed, Jan 25, 2012 at 5:51 AM, Rodrigo Tetsuo Argenton < rodrigo.argenton@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear all, Well as you know, Brazil is a priority, but when spending is a waste. We have a volunteer group that operates in Brazil since 2008 in direct contact with the problems of Brazil, know much about the free national culture, know a lot about education in the country, and their projects, they can tell the reasons why Brazil has poor performance on Wikipedia. Wikimedia Foundation conducted several interviews with the group, I was interviewed three times and had several conversations with several different employees. Also recently a person was hired to do a search on this, already operating in Brazil. And yesterday they announced the arrival of two more employees to ask only that, again. [1] They already have the answer to these interviews, what they are asking again?
And what I find worse is the fact that there is a prohibitive message for explanation of other Wikimedia projects. As for the local group that Wikipedia is not central. And there will be an office of WMF, only to activities for Wikipedia. And many Brazilians criticize the model of the WMF, and that centralization in Wikipedia. Wikipedia is only the tenth seventh most visited site in the country. Need better, yes, but the problem is the community that is not healthy, and that the WMF does not interfere on that. So it's skating, and spending resources unnecessarily.
Several staff members say the Wikipedia impact is larger than the other projects. Which has more impact for you? "The Movement Wikimedia projects through education, created free educational resources available in Wikibooks, and classes on Wikiversity, this could change the lives of thousands of poor children" or "The Movement Wikimedia succeeded in creating an encyclopaedia in Portuguese high quality "
Unfortunately I live in a country that 38% of teens lives in extreme poverty [2], how they want to create a program just with universities, to share knowledge if people that never walk inside one university? Or not be able to read the contents of Wikipedia because they were not properly literate. I'm not talking to literate Brazilians, I'm talking to create free educational resources, and create classes, and encourage businesses and organizations to do that change, this is a collaborative work.
With the money spent to keep three people six days in Brazil from the U.S.A., we could fund a fellow to start a social work with teachers to create this material.What is the interest of the WMF on this? "Our priority is Wikipedia "
*Imagine a world in which every single human being can freely share in the sum of all knowledge. That's our commitment.
I'll keep imagining, and having to push myself very hard to see this world. That will never be reached by Wikipedia alone.Especially in Brazil.
If it were to promote Wikipedia as a site, it would be best to hire a company, not a Foundation, if that way selected, do things as a Foundation.
Sorry for my English, I'm tired and I didn't review.
[1]
https://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikip%C3%A9dia:Esplanada/geral/Wikip%C3%A9dia_... [2]
http://noticias.r7.com/brasil/noticias/adolescentes-sao-mais-pobres-que-rest...
-- Rodrigo Tetsuo Argenton
Hi Rodrigo,
I am going to keep my replies on Portuguese Wikipedia going forward. However, I'll try to make a short answer here too...
We want this to be very different than past staff meetups or interviews that have happened in Brazil. We are not interested in the university program, the chapter, the Brazil office, or the fundraiser. That is not what Maryana and I do in the movement.
We only care about hearing from the authors of Portuguese Wikipedia about what their community is like. To lump together all the projects in that discussion would be unfair, because it assumes that Wikipedia, Commons, Wikibooks, and Wikiversity are all the same. I don't have to tell you they are very different, and I think it would be impossible to talk about all of them in just a few hours at a meetup. That is why we suggested that we most want to hear about Portuguese Wikipedia and why we posted our meetup information on Portuguese Wikipedia, not any other project.
If you feel it's a waste of time to get together with us and other Wikipedians just to talk about Portuguese Wikipedia, then that's okay. I don't feel that way, and I think people will be glad to have a meetup where we can focus on the encyclopedia, instead of anything else.
Best regards,
Steven
Steven Walling, 25/01/2012 19:33:
We want this to be very different than past staff meetups or interviews that have happened in Brazil. We are not interested in the university program, the chapter, the Brazil office, or the fundraiser. That is not what Maryana and I do in the movement.
We only care about hearing from the authors of Portuguese Wikipedia about what their community is like. To lump together all the projects in that discussion would be unfair, because it assumes that Wikipedia, Commons, Wikibooks, and Wikiversity are all the same. I don't have to tell you they are very different, and I think it would be impossible to talk about all of them in just a few hours at a meetup. That is why we suggested that we most want to hear about Portuguese Wikipedia and why we posted our meetup information on Portuguese Wikipedia, not any other project.
If you feel it's a waste of time to get together with us and other Wikipedians just to talk about Portuguese Wikipedia, then that's okay. I don't feel that way, and I think people will be glad to have a meetup where we can focus on the encyclopedia, instead of anything else.
For people who didn't follow every single piece of the Brazilian WMF activities, could you please explain how these meetups are «very different than past staff meetups or interviews that have happened in Brazil»?
Nemo
On Wed, Jan 25, 2012 at 11:51 AM, Federico Leva (Nemo) nemowiki@gmail.comwrote:
For people who didn't follow every single piece of the Brazilian WMF activities, could you please explain how these meetups are «very different than past staff meetups or interviews that have happened in Brazil»?
Sure!
Just to recap: to my remembrance the meetups that have included staff in past include...
* Barry, Jessie, Kul and perhaps others who are working on the Brazil Catalyst Project [1] have spent the most time in Brazil recently in support of that work. (We aren't a part of that team, and will not be duplicating any discussions about how to organize outreach in the country.) * Matthew Roth, who was a Storyteller gathering interviews in support of the last fundraiser, interviewed several individuals in Brazil in 2011. * Carolina Rossini also interviewed community members as part of the Catalyst Project, and from my reading on them they focused not just on people's experience as editors, but also broadly about their feelings when it comes to outreach and a chapter.[2]
The basic gist here is that we starting a series of small meetups focused on editor retention issues,[3] and we wanted to start with Brazil because Portuguese is a very important Wikipedia community for a lot of reasons. In the past we've also done quite a bit of research on this topic,[4] but the most important way to learn what's really different about Portuguese Wikipedia in this regard is to go and ask people.
Steven
1. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Brazil_Catalyst_Project 2. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Global/Brazil/Community_Interviews 3. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Community_convenings 4. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research:Portuguese_Wikipedia_trends_and_beh...
to avoid such either/or discussions, would it be possible to fund rodrigos proposal with a similar amount of money? make the money flow to projects conducted by local people seems to be a very well accepted strategy ... even if not everything will be flawless.
rupert On Jan 25, 2012 9:42 PM, "Steven Walling" steven.walling@gmail.com wrote:
On Wed, Jan 25, 2012 at 11:51 AM, Federico Leva (Nemo) nemowiki@gmail.comwrote:
For people who didn't follow every single piece of the Brazilian WMF activities, could you please explain how these meetups are «very
different
than past staff meetups or interviews that have happened in Brazil»?
Sure!
Just to recap: to my remembrance the meetups that have included staff in past include...
- Barry, Jessie, Kul and perhaps others who are working on the Brazil
Catalyst Project [1] have spent the most time in Brazil recently in support of that work. (We aren't a part of that team, and will not be duplicating any discussions about how to organize outreach in the country.)
- Matthew Roth, who was a Storyteller gathering interviews in support of
the last fundraiser, interviewed several individuals in Brazil in 2011.
- Carolina Rossini also interviewed community members as part of the
Catalyst Project, and from my reading on them they focused not just on people's experience as editors, but also broadly about their feelings when it comes to outreach and a chapter.[2]
The basic gist here is that we starting a series of small meetups focused on editor retention issues,[3] and we wanted to start with Brazil because Portuguese is a very important Wikipedia community for a lot of reasons. In the past we've also done quite a bit of research on this topic,[4] but the most important way to learn what's really different about Portuguese Wikipedia in this regard is to go and ask people.
Steven
- https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Brazil_Catalyst_Project
- https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Global/Brazil/Community_Interviews
- https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Community_convenings
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research:Portuguese_Wikipedia_trends_and_beh... _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Le 25/01/2012 14:51, Rodrigo Tetsuo Argenton a écrit :
Dear all, Well as you know, Brazil is a priority, but when spending is a waste. We have a volunteer group that operates in Brazil since 2008 in direct contact with the problems of Brazil, know much about the free national culture, know a lot about education in the country, and their projects, they can tell the reasons why Brazil has poor performance on Wikipedia. Wikimedia Foundation conducted several interviews with the group, I was interviewed three times and had several conversations with several different employees. Also recently a person was hired to do a search on this, already operating in Brazil. And yesterday they announced the arrival of two more employees to ask only that, again. [1] They already have the answer to these interviews, what they are asking again?
And what I find worse is the fact that there is a prohibitive message for explanation of other Wikimedia projects. As for the local group that Wikipedia is not central. And there will be an office of WMF, only to activities for Wikipedia. And many Brazilians criticize the model of the WMF, and that centralization in Wikipedia. Wikipedia is only the tenth seventh most visited site in the country. Need better, yes, but the problem is the community that is not healthy, and that the WMF does not interfere on that. So it's skating, and spending resources unnecessarily.
Several staff members say the Wikipedia impact is larger than the other projects. Which has more impact for you? "The Movement Wikimedia projects through education, created free educational resources available in Wikibooks, and classes on Wikiversity, this could change the lives of thousands of poor children" or "The Movement Wikimedia succeeded in creating an encyclopaedia in Portuguese high quality "
Unfortunately I live in a country that 38% of teens lives in extreme poverty [2], how they want to create a program just with universities, to share knowledge if people that never walk inside one university? Or not be able to read the contents of Wikipedia because they were not properly literate. I'm not talking to literate Brazilians, I'm talking to create free educational resources, and create classes, and encourage businesses and organizations to do that change, this is a collaborative work.
With the money spent to keep three people six days in Brazil from the U.S.A., we could fund a fellow to start a social work with teachers to create this material.What is the interest of the WMF on this? "Our priority is Wikipedia "
*Imagine a world in which every single human being can freely share in the sum of all knowledge. That's our commitment.
I'll keep imagining, and having to push myself very hard to see this world. That will never be reached by Wikipedia alone.Especially in Brazil.
That's interesting. What kind of "free educational resources" would you like to be developed ? What about a Wikikids in portugese ?
By the way, on that subject, I'd like to point out this discussion I had on simple.wikipedia about Wikikids/Vikidia : https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Simple_talk/Archive_96#WikiKids_...
However, even if this project is doing well in two languages yet (wikikids.nl and fr.vikidia.org), I'm not sure it can be endorsed or just supported by the WMF !
wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org