Nature has a special report at http://www.nature.com/news/2005/051212/full/438900a.html , detailing the results of an accuracy comparison between WP and EB. While the Wikipedia articles often contained more inaccuracies than Britannica's, they don't look at the article sizes in each case. With Maveric149's help, I did:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_%28news%29#Nature_follow...
Result: Average article size for Wikipedia: 6.80 KB; Britannica: 2.60 KB. Number of errors per 2KB for Wikipedia: 1; Britannica: 6.
Put another way: Wikipedia has 4 errors to their 3; our articles were also 2 1/2 times longer on average.
Can someone please check my math, I did this pretty fast, and was half asleep :) It's not 100% accurate, but I was only going for a ballpark estimate. Note: we copied the displayed WP text, not the edit box text, and removed the TOC, See also, references, external links, and any other big tables or lists. The WP text came from just before the Nature article was published.
Raul654 and I separately submitted stories to Slashdot, and I would suggest anyone willing do something similar. The more requests they have for this, the more likely they are to accept it.
brian0918
That's just great information.
What would be interesting also would be to draw a social map of articles in WP and EB, in order to see if they take care of the same topics or concentrate on different things.
Brian wrote:
Nature has a special report at http://www.nature.com/news/2005/051212/full/438900a.html , detailing the results of an accuracy comparison between WP and EB. While the Wikipedia articles often contained more inaccuracies than Britannica's, they don't look at the article sizes in each case. With Maveric149's help, I did:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_%28news%29#Nature_follow...
Result: Average article size for Wikipedia: 6.80 KB; Britannica: 2.60 KB. Number of errors per 2KB for Wikipedia: 1; Britannica: 6.
Put another way: Wikipedia has 4 errors to their 3; our articles were also 2 1/2 times longer on average.
Can someone please check my math, I did this pretty fast, and was half asleep :) It's not 100% accurate, but I was only going for a ballpark estimate. Note: we copied the displayed WP text, not the edit box text, and removed the TOC, See also, references, external links, and any other big tables or lists. The WP text came from just before the Nature article was published.
Raul654 and I separately submitted stories to Slashdot, and I would suggest anyone willing do something similar. The more requests they have for this, the more likely they are to accept it.
brian0918 _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Brian wrote:
Nature has a special report at http://www.nature.com/news/2005/051212/full/438900a.html , detailing the results of an accuracy comparison between WP and EB. While the Wikipedia articles often contained more inaccuracies than Britannica's, they don't look at the article sizes in each case. With Maveric149's help, I did:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_%28news%29#Nature_follow...
Result: Average article size for Wikipedia: 6.80 KB; Britannica: 2.60 KB. Number of errors per 2KB for Wikipedia: 1; Britannica: 6.
Put another way: Wikipedia has 4 errors to their 3; our articles were also 2 1/2 times longer on average.
True as this may be, there is no need for a campaign of spin doctoring.
I think that the "Nature" article was largely sympathetic. Our best response would be to review the articles surveyed to make whatever corrections are needed, or even to make corrections that they failed to notice as well. Once this is done it could be brought to the attention of the "Nature" staff and a challenge issued to see how long it takes EB to make its corrections. 8-)
Ec
On 12/15/05, Ray Saintonge saintonge@telus.net wrote:
I think that the "Nature" article was largely sympathetic. Our best response would be to review the articles surveyed to make whatever corrections are needed, or even to make corrections that they failed to notice as well.
Agreed.
Once this is done it could be brought to the attention of the "Nature" staff and a challenge issued to see how long it takes EB to make its corrections. 8-)
But why, why why go into this competition thing? :( I believe Britannica and Wikipedia are pursuing the same goals, with different means. Although I find it excellent that we take Britannica as an example and as a goal, I believe we have much to learn from them, and they from us. Can't we work hand in hand to achieve that goal? Competition should be an incentive to get better, for them and for us, not because we want to be the best, not because of stupid numbers, but because we are looking to achieve this:
"Le but d'une encyclopédie est de rassembler les connaissances éparses sur la surface de la terre ; d'en exposer le système général aux hommes avec qui nous vivons, et de les transmettre aux hommes qui viendront après nous" --Denis Diderot
(bad translation) "the goal of an encyclopaedia is to gather knowledge scattered all over the Earth's surface; to expose its general system to the men with whom we live, and to pass it along to those who will come after us " --Denis Diderot
Tell you what, what I hope is that in 2 years from now, Nature will do the same study, and find 0 mistake. Neither in Britannica, nor in Wikipedia.
(a hopeful) Delphine -- ~notafish
Delphine Ménard wrote:
I believe Britannica and Wikipedia are pursuing the same goals, with different means.
Well, not quite the same goals. Britannica does not in any way advance the goal of having a Free compendium of human knowledge.
-Mark
Delphine Ménard wrote:
But why, why why go into this competition thing? :( I believe Britannica and Wikipedia are pursuing the same goals, with different means. Although I find it excellent that we take Britannica as an example and as a goal, I believe we have much to learn from them, and they from us. Can't we work hand in hand to achieve that goal? Competition should be an incentive to get better, for them and for us, not because we want to be the best, not because of stupid numbers, but because we are looking to achieve this:
It's good to see that Brockhaus is trying to work out how to work with the upstart newcomer (de:). If Britannica can do so, that will be fantastic for both us and them.
(The Encyclopaedia Britannica is one of the greatest non-fiction books of Anglophone culture, up there with the Oxford English Dictionary. I really, really hope they can get the business side profitable once more!)
Tell you what, what I hope is that in 2 years from now, Nature will do the same study, and find 0 mistake. Neither in Britannica, nor in Wikipedia.
That would be nice to see :-)
- d.
Delphine Ménard wrote:
On 12/15/05, Ray Saintonge saintonge@telus.net wrote:
I think that the "Nature" article was largely sympathetic. Our best response would be to review the articles surveyed to make whatever corrections are needed, or even to make corrections that they failed to notice as well.
Agreed.
Once this is done it could be brought to the attention of the "Nature" staff and a challenge issued to see how long it takes EB to make its corrections. 8-)
But why, why why go into this competition thing? :(
Touché! I had in mind the ability to correct things quickly, which is not there in a paper encyclopedia, but you're right, it does seem competitive in retrospect. My remarks were perhaps insensitive.
I believe Britannica and Wikipedia are pursuing the same goals, with different means. Although I find it excellent that we take Britannica as an example and as a goal, I believe we have much to learn from them, and they from us. Can't we work hand in hand to achieve that goal? Competition should be an incentive to get better, for them and for us, not because we want to be the best, not because of stupid numbers, but because we are looking to achieve this:
"Le but d'une encyclopédie est de rassembler les connaissances éparses sur la surface de la terre ; d'en exposer le système général aux hommes avec qui nous vivons, et de les transmettre aux hommes qui viendront après nous" --Denis Diderot
(bad translation) "the goal of an encyclopaedia is to gather knowledge scattered all over the Earth's surface; to expose its general system to the men with whom we live, and to pass it along to those who will come after us " --Denis Diderot
Tell you what, what I hope is that in 2 years from now, Nature will do the same study, and find 0 mistake. Neither in Britannica, nor in Wikipedia.
Sentiment makes me agree with you, and this noble idea. I wonder if Britannica can even survive. That's sad for an institution that's been around for 250 years. They were built on the model of a bulky multi-volume set of books. Who's going to buy that if one can find so much more information at no cost? At present Wikipedia is well ahead of Britannica in quantity, and almost equal in quality. Recent events have forced us to look at quality, and there is certainly incentive to do something about it. Where does that leave them when the only asset they have left is an established name?
If one can depend on Alexa ratings they show that we are at that part of the pyramid where the air is thin. How we managed to get there has probably left most of us puzzled. When you're that big it's hard to roll over in bed without crushing the one beside you. What are the ethical implications of being where we are? Maybe as a group we need to address some of these issues in Boston.
Can I start pushing the POV that Wikimania 2007 should be in Africa?
Ec
Can I start pushing the POV that Wikimania 2007 should be in Africa?
Ec
Ermmmmm Bangkok is already busy launching a bid for 2007 ;) just to inform you .... I finally found some Thai wikipedians interested in the idea. One of whom has organised conferences before. Asia is host to some big languages and a few of the larger wikipedia's. Bangkok has direct flights to all continents but South America. Visas are absolutely no problem for almost any nationality. Local costs are extremely low. Meals can be had for 1 or 2 euros, also every major cuisine and many "minor" ones are catered for, so even if you do not want to eat Thai food you have choices aplenty. The price if the youthhostel in Frankfurt will put you in a great hotel here. Rooms are available from 3 euro's and up, you usually pay per room not per person! And last but not least we do not need to hold the conference in Bangkok. Many beachresort have excellent facilities. So we could have a wikimania at the beach!
Waerth/Walter
are you serious? i'd love the idea!
oscar
On 12/16/05, Walter van Kalken walter@vankalken.net wrote:
Can I start pushing the POV that Wikimania 2007 should be in Africa?
Ec
Ermmmmm Bangkok is already busy launching a bid for 2007 ;) just to inform you .... I finally found some Thai wikipedians interested in the idea. One of whom has organised conferences before. Asia is host to some big languages and a few of the larger wikipedia's. Bangkok has direct flights to all continents but South America. Visas are absolutely no problem for almost any nationality. Local costs are extremely low. Meals can be had for 1 or 2 euros, also every major cuisine and many "minor" ones are catered for, so even if you do not want to eat Thai food you have choices aplenty. The price if the youthhostel in Frankfurt will put you in a great hotel here. Rooms are available from 3 euro's and up, you usually pay per room not per person! And last but not least we do not need to hold the conference in Bangkok. Many beachresort have excellent facilities. So we could have a wikimania at the beach!
Waerth/Walter _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
oscar wrote:
are you serious? i'd love the idea!
oscar
Yes I am,
We had a wikipedia presentation last week on a congress for teachers. We were invited there by a wikipedian (Korakot) who works for the Thailand Knowledge Management Institute (KMI) ... kinda the Thai version of Kennisnet ... who sponsored us for that congress. He says he is sure he can find sponsors from KMI and thinks others are sure. It all started with a discussion on how to get Jimbo to Thailand. Another Thai wikipedian (TouTou) who is a university teacher and was also helping with the presentation then said she had organised congresses already and that her university has facilities but that congressspace is cheap and aplenty in Thailand anyway. So we have two persons who have experience in the field. And one village idiot (me) so that seems enough to start a serious bid because people will always offer help once the train starts rolling.
Waerth/Walter
And I suppose Wikimania 2011 will end up being at McMurdo Station. It will take some working up to. [Then 2012 : in orbit? There was something about a sub-orbital bid. And depending on what the next World Age brings -- Revelation... Apokemon... Xists -- 2013 may be something completely different.]
-- sj
On 12/15/05, Walter van Kalken walter@vankalken.net wrote:
oscar wrote:
are you serious? i'd love the idea!
oscar
Yes I am,
We had a wikipedia presentation last week on a congress for teachers. We were invited there by a wikipedian (Korakot) who works for the Thailand Knowledge Management Institute (KMI) ... kinda the Thai version of Kennisnet ... who sponsored us for that congress. He says he is sure he can find sponsors from KMI and thinks others are sure. It all started with a discussion on how to get Jimbo to Thailand. Another Thai wikipedian (TouTou) who is a university teacher and was also helping with the presentation then said she had organised congresses already and that her university has facilities but that congressspace is cheap and aplenty in Thailand anyway. So we have two persons who have experience in the field. And one village idiot (me) so that seems enough to start a serious bid because people will always offer help once the train starts rolling.
Waerth/Walter _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
-- ++SJ
SJ wrote:
And I suppose Wikimania 2011 will end up being at McMurdo Station. It will take some working up to. [Then 2012 : in orbit? There was something about a sub-orbital bid. And depending on what the next World Age brings -- Revelation... Apokemon... Xists -- 2013 may be something completely different.]
-- sj
What on earth did I deserve such an answer for.
Waerth/Walter
Walter van Kalken wrote:
SJ wrote:
And I suppose Wikimania 2011 will end up being at McMurdo Station. It will take some working up to. [Then 2012 : in orbit? There was something about a sub-orbital bid. And depending on what the next World Age brings -- Revelation... Apokemon... Xists -- 2013 may be something completely different.]
-- sj
What on earth did I deserve such an answer for.
Shouldn't you mean "What NOT on earth ..." :-)
Ec
Ray Saintonge wrote:
Walter van Kalken wrote:
SJ wrote:
And I suppose Wikimania 2011 will end up being at McMurdo Station. It will take some working up to. [Then 2012 : in orbit? There was something about a sub-orbital bid. And depending on what the next World Age brings -- Revelation... Apokemon... Xists -- 2013 may be something completely different.]
-- sj
What on earth did I deserve such an answer for.
Shouldn't you mean "What NOT on earth ..." :-)
Ec
No in response to a suggestion by you to make Africa the predestined continent I already put up a bid for bangkok. I treated you with respect I like to be treated back with respect it could be my lack of sleep but I am pretty pissed at SJ's answer especially in the light of him being at the current wikimania organising committee I find him ridiculing someone else's idea totally inappropriate and uncalled for.
Waerth/Walter
Walter van Kalken wrote:
Ray Saintonge wrote:
Walter van Kalken wrote:
SJ wrote:
And I suppose Wikimania 2011 will end up being at McMurdo Station. It will take some working up to. [Then 2012 : in orbit? There was something about a sub-orbital bid. And depending on what the next World Age brings -- Revelation... Apokemon... Xists -- 2013 may be something completely different.]
-- sj
What on earth did I deserve such an answer for.
Shouldn't you mean "What NOT on earth ..." :-)
Ec
No in response to a suggestion by you to make Africa the predestined continent I already put up a bid for bangkok. I treated you with respect I like to be treated back with respect it could be my lack of sleep but I am pretty pissed at SJ's answer especially in the light of him being at the current wikimania organising committee I find him ridiculing someone else's idea totally inappropriate and uncalled for.
Waerth/Walter
Hello
Three little points here.
First, I agree with Waerth that, Samuel, your comments appear quite offending. It may be that you did not mean them to be and that it was humor, but I fear it will not appear that way to many readers of the list.
Second and possibly more important point. There is currently no organising committee per se. There is a group of interested individuals, more or less involved in organising Wikimania 2006. Organisation, and in particular leadership, will probably be clarified in a couple of days.
Third point. Sj being part of the "current" most involved individuals will not necessarily mean he will be in 2007. Nor any of the current "organisers". I'd say, go your way and prepare a good bid for 2007 if you think it is doable.
Hello
Three little points here.
First, I agree with Waerth that, Samuel, your comments appear quite offending. It may be that you did not mean them to be and that it was humor, but I fear it will not appear that way to many readers of the list.
Second and possibly more important point. There is currently no organising committee per se. There is a group of interested individuals, more or less involved in organising Wikimania 2006. Organisation, and in particular leadership, will probably be clarified in a couple of days.
Third point. Sj being part of the "current" most involved individuals will not necessarily mean he will be in 2007. Nor any of the current "organisers". I'd say, go your way and prepare a good bid for 2007 if you think it is doable.
And fourth, you forgot Poland! We also are preparing a bid, you know. At least we plan to, since we have the facilities, and the people interested in organizing a conference.
-- Pozdrawiam, Datrio
Dariusz Siedlecki wrote:
And fourth, you forgot Poland! We also are preparing a bid, you know. At least we plan to, since we have the facilities, and the people interested in organizing a conference.
-- Pozdrawiam, Datrio
Welllll, okay :-) I suddenly have a memory hole... is that the polish or the serbian-montenegro chapter which has an event organiser in the board ?
Ant
And fourth, you forgot Poland! We also are preparing a bid, you know. At least we plan to, since we have the facilities, and the people interested in organizing a conference.
-- Pozdrawiam,
Ouch Poland tough competition great country I think and in Europe. May the best bid win Datrio :)
Waerth/Walter
Walter van Kalken wrote:
And fourth, you forgot Poland! We also are preparing a bid, you know. At least we plan to, since we have the facilities, and the people interested in organizing a conference.
-- Pozdrawiam,
Ouch Poland tough competition great country I think and in Europe. May the best bid win Datrio :)
Waerth/Walter
Hoi, I am aware that there may be another bid.. This would have the added charm of being hosted from a world heritage site .. No I am not going to say where.. But to call it a nice and interesting place is an understatement.. Thanks, GerardM
Dariusz Siedlecki wrote:
And fourth, you forgot Poland!
LOL!
http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Poland - current featured article!
- d.
On 12/16/05, Anthere Anthere9@yahoo.com wrote:
Walter van Kalken wrote:
First, I agree with Waerth that, Samuel, your comments appear quite offending. It may be that you did not mean them to be and that it was humor, but I fear it will not appear that way to many readers of the list.
Well, to be clear : I thought Waerth's proposal, and the discussion of other continents, was bold and great. There was no offense meant; Ray caught it in precisely the spirit intended. As a member of the community, and not as a "Wikimania organiser", I would love to see more event planning in Thailand, and in Asia and Africa in general, and think that Ec and Walter talking about this well in advance was pretty neat.
The discussion of whether to rotate Wikimanias across continents has been proposed before; and it was noted then too that we would run out of continents just before the next Mayan World Age...
Dariusz : If you do something in Poland, I'll have to finish learning Polish by then ;-)
Pozdrawiam, SJ
On 12/16/05, Walter van Kalken walter@vankalken.net wrote:
No in response to a suggestion by you to make Africa the predestined continent I already put up a bid for bangkok. I treated you with respect I like to be treated back with respect it could be my lack of sleep but I am pretty pissed at SJ's answer....
Wow wow wow... please.
I think things have gotten a little out of hand here. But let me try and explain. I believe Sj was rather amazed and excited than critical at your proposal. And he adopted an artistic and "lunar" way of saying it. Which got, apparently, completely lost in translation. And he didn't realize how wrong you could take it. And you didn't realize that he didn't realize.
The never ending problem of not speaking the same language in the first place. Being a non-native myself, I think I understood where you could take it wrong. But I am sure it wasn't meant that way.
What you think, what you say, what I hear and what I understand... between what you think and what I understand, there can be so many interferences. Assume good faith is a good one in this case. Let the anger fly at first, and answer "huh????". Because, indeed, Sj's post was... "huh?" ;-). And Sj, for any lunar interventions, remember that some of us live on this earth and speak another tongue ;-)
Best,
Delphine PS. This said. Bangkok? WOHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !!! :DDDD -- ~notafish
On 12/16/05, Delphine Ménard notafishz@gmail.com wrote:
And Sj, for any lunar interventions, remember that some of us live on this earth and speak another tongue ;-)
Ahh, this could be a problem. But in a few years, perhaps the Googlefish translation engine will handle even alien languages... didn't they start a moon base recently?
PS. This said. Bangkok? WOHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !!! :DDDD
Some sentiments need no translation. (-:
++SJ
SJ wrote:
On 12/16/05, Delphine Ménard notafishz@gmail.com wrote:
And Sj, for any lunar interventions, remember that some of us live on this earth and speak another tongue ;-)
Ahh, this could be a problem. But in a few years, perhaps the Googlefish translation engine will handle even alien languages... didn't they start a moon base recently?
PS. This said. Bangkok? WOHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !!! :DDDD
Some sentiments need no translation. (-:
++SJ ______________________________
I am sorry SJ for misunderstanding your text. I was and still am very tired as I ahev barely slept since last week. Angela can confirm that she knows how tired I was when I met her .... haven't had mucht sleep since. I clearly misunderstood your post sorry ......
Need sleep .... Waerth/Walter
Walter van Kalken wrote:
No in response to a suggestion by you to make Africa the predestined continent I already put up a bid for bangkok. I treated you with respect I like to be treated back with respect it could be my lack of sleep but I am pretty pissed at SJ's answer especially in the light of him being at the current wikimania organising committee I find him ridiculing someone else's idea totally inappropriate and uncalled for.
This may be a cross-lingual issue, but to me it was pretty obviously a light and silly joke, not an attack. Please assume better faith.
- d.
Walter van Kalken wrote:
Ray Saintonge wrote:
Walter van Kalken wrote:
SJ wrote:
And I suppose Wikimania 2011 will end up being at McMurdo Station. It will take some working up to. [Then 2012 : in orbit? There was something about a sub-orbital bid. And depending on what the next World Age brings -- Revelation... Apokemon... Xists -- 2013 may be something completely different.]
-- sj
What on earth did I deserve such an answer for.
Shouldn't you mean "What NOT on earth ..." :-)
Ec
No in response to a suggestion by you to make Africa the predestined continent I already put up a bid for bangkok. I treated you with respect I like to be treated back with respect it could be my lack of sleep but I am pretty pissed at SJ's answer especially in the light of him being at the current wikimania organising committee I find him ridiculing someone else's idea totally inappropriate and uncalled for.
In making a reference to Africa, I was certainly not aware that you had already put in a bid for Bangkok. But even if I had known it would not have prevented me from saying that in this very preliminary stage. Even when I first raised such a possibility in Frankfort I had already conceived of the possibility of an East Asian or Australian bid for 2007. Bangkok did not come to mind, but I have no objection to going there in 2007.
I took SJ's comments in jest, and responded accordingly. No disrespect was intended.
Ec
On 12/16/05, Walter van Kalken walter@vankalken.net wrote:
What on earth did I deserve such an answer for.
Hm? Just thinking ahead to what happens when you run out of continents... no ridicule here. A Thai bid would be exciting. There really was already discussion of having Wikimania in sub-orbit.
No in response to a suggestion by you to make Africa the predestined continent I already put up a bid for bangkok.
I think you're taking Ec the wrong way... it sounded to me as though he wanted to encourage a serious Africa bid, though maybe not in a position to make one himself.
But Ec wrote:
Could we book early for someone like Eric Idle or John Cleese to be a guest speaker? :-)
If we have /really/ out of this world contacts by then, maybe we could book Douglas Adams...
++SJ
SJ wrote:
On 12/16/05, Walter van Kalken walter@vankalken.net wrote:
What on earth did I deserve such an answer for.
Hm? Just thinking ahead to what happens when you run out of continents... no ridicule here. A Thai bid would be exciting. There really was already discussion of having Wikimania in sub-orbit.
My reaction to your comments were to view them as raucus humour, not ridicule. They did have a tone reminiscent of Howard Dean, who also got taken the wrong way.
No in response to a suggestion by you to make Africa the predestined continent I already put up a bid for bangkok.
I think you're taking Ec the wrong way... it sounded to me as though he wanted to encourage a serious Africa bid, though maybe not in a position to make one himself.
That's pretty well what I had in mind. My rationale was based on the concept that if we are ever going to have a presence in the developing world it would be a good idea to have a Wikimania there to give Wikipedians a dramatic grasp of what the problems are. In any case, there can be no valid African bid without Africans being involved in a significant way.
But Ec wrote:
Could we book early for someone like Eric Idle or John Cleese to be a guest speaker? :-)
If we have /really/ out of this world contacts by then, maybe we could book Douglas Adams...
Now that you put it that way maybe my invitation list for "something completely different" should have included Graham Chapman.
Always look on the bright side of life.
Ec
SJ wrote:
And I suppose Wikimania 2011 will end up being at McMurdo Station. It will take some working up to. [Then 2012 : in orbit?
That's out of this world!
There was something about a sub-orbital bid. And depending on what the next World Age brings -- Revelation... Apokemon... Xists -- 2013 may be something completely different.]
Could we book early for someone like Eric Idle or John Cleese to be a guest speaker? :-)
Ec
At 08:23 +0700 16/12/05, Walter van Kalken wrote:
Can I start pushing the POV that Wikimania 2007 should be in Africa?
Ec
Ermmmmm Bangkok is already busy launching a bid for 2007 ;)
Good. We are working for a UK 2007 bid (based on the 2006 proposal).
NPR picked up the Wikipedia/Britannica story today:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5055388
Ray Saintonge wrote:
Sentiment makes me agree with you, and this noble idea. I wonder if Britannica can even survive. That's sad for an institution that's been around for 250 years. They were built on the model of a bulky multi-volume set of books. Who's going to buy that if one can find so much more information at no cost? At present Wikipedia is well ahead of Britannica in quantity, and almost equal in quality. Recent events have forced us to look at quality, and there is certainly incentive to do something about it. Where does that leave them when the only asset they have left is an established name?
Brockhaus is pretty much the German equivalent of Britannica in quality and respectability. They don't seem to be panicking at Wikipedia's popularity and de:'s market-ready level of quality.
If one can depend on Alexa ratings they show that we are at that part of the pyramid where the air is thin. How we managed to get there has probably left most of us puzzled. When you're that big it's hard to roll over in bed without crushing the one beside you. What are the ethical implications of being where we are? Maybe as a group we need to address some of these issues in Boston.
It is extremely important that we NOT be spooked by our silly levels of popularity. They indicate that we fill a real need, even if those of us inside the project are painfully aware of its defects.
I think being honest about what we are and where we are will be enough. "It's not a finished product, it's the raw materials for one. But an outside company helped polish up the German one and released it on a DVD for a few Euros, and we're working on getting the others up to that standard. It's a work in progress."
Can I start pushing the POV that Wikimania 2007 should be in Africa?
You're going to move there and become a local organiser? :-D
- d.
Brockhaus is pretty much the German equivalent of Britannica in quality and respectability. They don't seem to be panicking at Wikipedia's popularity and de:'s market-ready level of quality.
Same with PWN in Poland. They made very positive comments about Wikipedia this year
Ausir
Has there been contact with PWN since then? sj
On 12/16/05, fallout@lexx.eu.org fallout@lexx.eu.org wrote:
Brockhaus is pretty much the German equivalent of Britannica in quality and respectability. They don't seem to be panicking at Wikipedia's popularity and de:'s market-ready level of quality.
Same with PWN in Poland. They made very positive comments about Wikipedia this year
Ausir
foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
-- ++SJ
2005/12/17, SJ 2.718281828@gmail.com:
Has there been contact with PWN since then? sj
AFAIK, TOR (president of Wikimedia Poland) and some members of our community thanked them for the compliments. We even tried cooperation with them (our article list for their article list), but we didn't succeed in that, since they wanted their list to stay private.
Well, we could work out something, but from what I know, no one tried.
-- Pozdrawiam, Dariusz "Datrio" Siedlecki
2005/12/15, Brian brian0918@gmail.com:
Nature has a special report at http://www.nature.com/news/2005/051212/full/438900a.html , detailing the results of an accuracy comparison between WP and EB. While the Wikipedia articles often contained more inaccuracies than Britannica's, they don't look at the article sizes in each case.
In fact, it seems they did look at the size. If you look carefully at the top of the list of articles reviewed by Nature, you will find the following sentence :
All entries were chosen to be approximately the same length in both encyclopaedias.
It could even be argued that this bias in the selection actually improved Wikipedia's performance by screening out a number of poorer articles.
GL
wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org