Hello, all.
With the Board’s recent statement, this seems like a good time to launch the quarterly office hours I’ve been wanting to create for people who want to talk to me about issues involving “community resilience and sustainability,” including the work of Trust & Safety, whom I oversee. (after months of wanting to do this I’ve come to realize that I will always be "too busy" to feel like it's the perfect time for this. So I’m going to do it now anyway!)
There’ve been requests to make office hours more personal, so I will host a Zoom hangout where people can join me, but I'll also take questions from Telegram and IRC.[1] I know that finding an hour that works for everybody is not going to happen, and I know from past office hours I’ve been involved in that I may get far more questions than I can answer (or, contrarily, nothing at all :)). Nevertheless, I will do my best to answer questions posed to me in that hour by Wikimedians in good standing (not Foundation or community banned) and to follow up in writing with any I don’t have time for over the next few days or week or so, time allowing. I might aggregate similar questions into a kind of FAQ. We’ll publish notes, anonymizing those who’ve asked questions, after.
I do, however, have the following caveats:
-
I can’t and won’t discuss specific Trust & Safety cases. Instead, I can discuss Trust & Safety protocols and practices and approaches as well as some of the mistakes we’ve made, some of the things I’m proud of, and some of the things we’re hoping to do. -
I will not respond to comments or questions that are disrespectful to me, to my colleagues, or to anyone in our communities. I can talk civilly about our work even if you disagree with me or I disagree with you. I won’t compromise on this.
I’m not sure if I will stick with Zoom as the way I do office hours forever, but I am responding to some requests for spoken interaction while also trying to provide text options for those who prefer. I admit to being a little camera shy myself, so this is a challenge for me! If I embarrass myself too badly, I may retreat to the safety of text in future.
I was hoping to have the Zoom link already, but while that’s being expedited by our office technology team, I don’t have it yet. I wanted to give interested people notice as soon as I knew the time. I’ll follow up with links again at least two hours in advance.
The meeting will be on June 4th at 1800 UTC.
I hope to see you there.
Best,
Maggie
[1] Zoom link; Telegram link: https://t.me/joinchat/DOlGIB1FRLUWqW9iB3qfTQ; directions for participating in IRC: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#How_to_participate
Greetings, Excellent news. A few years ago I got a chance to talk to you in details on some other stuff related to Wikipedia and that discussion was very helpful. I am sure, this call/initiative related to "community resilience and sustainability" will be really helpful. Good wishes.
Thanks User:Titodutta
On Thu, 28 May 2020 at 17:33, Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org wrote:
Hello, all.
With the Board’s recent statement, this seems like a good time to launch the quarterly office hours I’ve been wanting to create for people who want to talk to me about issues involving “community resilience and sustainability,” including the work of Trust & Safety, whom I oversee. (after months of wanting to do this I’ve come to realize that I will always be "too busy" to feel like it's the perfect time for this. So I’m going to do it now anyway!)
There’ve been requests to make office hours more personal, so I will host a Zoom hangout where people can join me, but I'll also take questions from Telegram and IRC.[1] I know that finding an hour that works for everybody is not going to happen, and I know from past office hours I’ve been involved in that I may get far more questions than I can answer (or, contrarily, nothing at all :)). Nevertheless, I will do my best to answer questions posed to me in that hour by Wikimedians in good standing (not Foundation or community banned) and to follow up in writing with any I don’t have time for over the next few days or week or so, time allowing. I might aggregate similar questions into a kind of FAQ. We’ll publish notes, anonymizing those who’ve asked questions, after.
I do, however, have the following caveats:
I can’t and won’t discuss specific Trust & Safety cases. Instead, I can discuss Trust & Safety protocols and practices and approaches as well as some of the mistakes we’ve made, some of the things I’m proud of, and some of the things we’re hoping to do.
I will not respond to comments or questions that are disrespectful to me, to my colleagues, or to anyone in our communities. I can talk civilly about our work even if you disagree with me or I disagree with you. I won’t compromise on this.
I’m not sure if I will stick with Zoom as the way I do office hours forever, but I am responding to some requests for spoken interaction while also trying to provide text options for those who prefer. I admit to being a little camera shy myself, so this is a challenge for me! If I embarrass myself too badly, I may retreat to the safety of text in future.
I was hoping to have the Zoom link already, but while that’s being expedited by our office technology team, I don’t have it yet. I wanted to give interested people notice as soon as I knew the time. I’ll follow up with links again at least two hours in advance.
The meeting will be on June 4th at 1800 UTC.
I hope to see you there.
Best,
Maggie
[1] Zoom link; Telegram link: https://t.me/joinchat/DOlGIB1FRLUWqW9iB3qfTQ ; directions for participating in IRC: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#How_to_participate
-- Maggie Dennis Vice President, Community Resilience & Sustainability Wikimedia Foundation, Inc. _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
This will be very interesting, thank you Maggie. (To check your local time for this office hour: click here https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=Maggie+Dennis+office+hour+%28with+a+twist%29&iso=20200604T18&p1=1440&ah=1)
Vriendelijke groet, Ciell
Op do 28 mei 2020 om 14:03 schreef Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org:
Hello, all.
With the Board’s recent statement, this seems like a good time to launch the quarterly office hours I’ve been wanting to create for people who want to talk to me about issues involving “community resilience and sustainability,” including the work of Trust & Safety, whom I oversee. (after months of wanting to do this I’ve come to realize that I will always be "too busy" to feel like it's the perfect time for this. So I’m going to do it now anyway!)
There’ve been requests to make office hours more personal, so I will host a Zoom hangout where people can join me, but I'll also take questions from Telegram and IRC.[1] I know that finding an hour that works for everybody is not going to happen, and I know from past office hours I’ve been involved in that I may get far more questions than I can answer (or, contrarily, nothing at all :)). Nevertheless, I will do my best to answer questions posed to me in that hour by Wikimedians in good standing (not Foundation or community banned) and to follow up in writing with any I don’t have time for over the next few days or week or so, time allowing. I might aggregate similar questions into a kind of FAQ. We’ll publish notes, anonymizing those who’ve asked questions, after.
I do, however, have the following caveats:
I can’t and won’t discuss specific Trust & Safety cases. Instead, I can discuss Trust & Safety protocols and practices and approaches as well as some of the mistakes we’ve made, some of the things I’m proud of, and some of the things we’re hoping to do.
I will not respond to comments or questions that are disrespectful to me, to my colleagues, or to anyone in our communities. I can talk civilly about our work even if you disagree with me or I disagree with you. I won’t compromise on this.
I’m not sure if I will stick with Zoom as the way I do office hours forever, but I am responding to some requests for spoken interaction while also trying to provide text options for those who prefer. I admit to being a little camera shy myself, so this is a challenge for me! If I embarrass myself too badly, I may retreat to the safety of text in future.
I was hoping to have the Zoom link already, but while that’s being expedited by our office technology team, I don’t have it yet. I wanted to give interested people notice as soon as I knew the time. I’ll follow up with links again at least two hours in advance.
The meeting will be on June 4th at 1800 UTC.
I hope to see you there.
Best,
Maggie
[1] Zoom link; Telegram link: https://t.me/joinchat/DOlGIB1FRLUWqW9iB3qfTQ ; directions for participating in IRC: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#How_to_participate
-- Maggie Dennis Vice President, Community Resilience & Sustainability Wikimedia Foundation, Inc. _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Thanks for the link, Ciell, I easily get confused about time zones. I am looking forward to attend on June 4th, if it is possible for me. Kind regards Ziko
Am Fr., 29. Mai 2020 um 20:20 Uhr schrieb Ciell Wikipedia < ciell.wikipedia@gmail.com>:
This will be very interesting, thank you Maggie. (To check your local time for this office hour: click here < https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=Maggie+Dennis+offi...
)
Vriendelijke groet, Ciell
Op do 28 mei 2020 om 14:03 schreef Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org:
Hello, all.
With the Board’s recent statement, this seems like a good time to launch the quarterly office hours I’ve been wanting to create for people who
want
to talk to me about issues involving “community resilience and sustainability,” including the work of Trust & Safety, whom I oversee. (after months of wanting to do this I’ve come to realize that I will
always
be "too busy" to feel like it's the perfect time for this. So I’m going
to
do it now anyway!)
There’ve been requests to make office hours more personal, so I will
host a
Zoom hangout where people can join me, but I'll also take questions from Telegram and IRC.[1] I know that finding an hour that works for everybody is not going to happen, and I know from past office hours I’ve been involved in that I may get far more questions than I can answer (or, contrarily, nothing at all :)). Nevertheless, I will do my best to answer questions posed to me in that hour by Wikimedians in good standing (not Foundation or community banned) and to follow up in writing with any I don’t have time for over the next few days or week or so, time allowing.
I
might aggregate similar questions into a kind of FAQ. We’ll publish
notes,
anonymizing those who’ve asked questions, after.
I do, however, have the following caveats:
I can’t and won’t discuss specific Trust & Safety cases. Instead, I
can
discuss Trust & Safety protocols and practices and approaches as well
as
some of the mistakes we’ve made, some of the things I’m proud of, and some of the things we’re hoping to do.
I will not respond to comments or questions that are disrespectful to me, to my colleagues, or to anyone in our communities. I can talk civilly about our work even if you disagree with me or I disagree with you. I won’t compromise on this.
I’m not sure if I will stick with Zoom as the way I do office hours forever, but I am responding to some requests for spoken interaction
while
also trying to provide text options for those who prefer. I admit to
being
a little camera shy myself, so this is a challenge for me! If I embarrass myself too badly, I may retreat to the safety of text in future.
I was hoping to have the Zoom link already, but while that’s being expedited by our office technology team, I don’t have it yet. I wanted to give interested people notice as soon as I knew the time. I’ll follow up with links again at least two hours in advance.
The meeting will be on June 4th at 1800 UTC.
I hope to see you there.
Best,
Maggie
[1] Zoom link; Telegram link:
https://t.me/joinchat/DOlGIB1FRLUWqW9iB3qfTQ
; directions for participating in IRC: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#How_to_participate
-- Maggie Dennis Vice President, Community Resilience & Sustainability Wikimedia Foundation, Inc. _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Thank you, Maggie for the kind update, I am looking forward to it.
Best Regards, Rajeeb Dutta. (U: Marajozkee) (Sent from my iPhone pardon the brevity)
On 30-May-2020, at 2:53 PM, Ziko van Dijk zvandijk@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks for the link, Ciell, I easily get confused about time zones. I am looking forward to attend on June 4th, if it is possible for me. Kind regards Ziko
Am Fr., 29. Mai 2020 um 20:20 Uhr schrieb Ciell Wikipedia < ciell.wikipedia@gmail.com>:
This will be very interesting, thank you Maggie. (To check your local time for this office hour: click here < https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=Maggie+Dennis+offi...
)
Vriendelijke groet, Ciell
Op do 28 mei 2020 om 14:03 schreef Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org:
Hello, all.
With the Board’s recent statement, this seems like a good time to launch the quarterly office hours I’ve been wanting to create for people who
want
to talk to me about issues involving “community resilience and sustainability,” including the work of Trust & Safety, whom I oversee. (after months of wanting to do this I’ve come to realize that I will
always
be "too busy" to feel like it's the perfect time for this. So I’m going
to
do it now anyway!)
There’ve been requests to make office hours more personal, so I will
host a
Zoom hangout where people can join me, but I'll also take questions from Telegram and IRC.[1] I know that finding an hour that works for everybody is not going to happen, and I know from past office hours I’ve been involved in that I may get far more questions than I can answer (or, contrarily, nothing at all :)). Nevertheless, I will do my best to answer questions posed to me in that hour by Wikimedians in good standing (not Foundation or community banned) and to follow up in writing with any I don’t have time for over the next few days or week or so, time allowing.
I
might aggregate similar questions into a kind of FAQ. We’ll publish
notes,
anonymizing those who’ve asked questions, after.
I do, however, have the following caveats:
I can’t and won’t discuss specific Trust & Safety cases. Instead, I
can
discuss Trust & Safety protocols and practices and approaches as well
as
some of the mistakes we’ve made, some of the things I’m proud of, and some of the things we’re hoping to do.
I will not respond to comments or questions that are disrespectful to me, to my colleagues, or to anyone in our communities. I can talk civilly about our work even if you disagree with me or I disagree with you. I won’t compromise on this.
I’m not sure if I will stick with Zoom as the way I do office hours forever, but I am responding to some requests for spoken interaction
while
also trying to provide text options for those who prefer. I admit to
being
a little camera shy myself, so this is a challenge for me! If I embarrass myself too badly, I may retreat to the safety of text in future.
I was hoping to have the Zoom link already, but while that’s being expedited by our office technology team, I don’t have it yet. I wanted to give interested people notice as soon as I knew the time. I’ll follow up with links again at least two hours in advance.
The meeting will be on June 4th at 1800 UTC.
I hope to see you there.
Best,
Maggie
[1] Zoom link; Telegram link:
https://t.me/joinchat/DOlGIB1FRLUWqW9iB3qfTQ
; directions for participating in IRC: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#How_to_participate
-- Maggie Dennis Vice President, Community Resilience & Sustainability Wikimedia Foundation, Inc. _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Every time I see the title of this thread, I momentarily wonder why this event is being held 220 years ago.
Newyorkbrad/IBM
On Sat, May 30, 2020 at 5:37 AM Rajeeb Dutta marajozkee@gmail.com wrote:
Thank you, Maggie for the kind update, I am looking forward to it.
Best Regards, Rajeeb Dutta. (U: Marajozkee) (Sent from my iPhone pardon the brevity)
On 30-May-2020, at 2:53 PM, Ziko van Dijk zvandijk@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks for the link, Ciell, I easily get confused about time zones. I am looking forward to attend on June 4th, if it is possible for me. Kind regards Ziko
Am Fr., 29. Mai 2020 um 20:20 Uhr schrieb Ciell Wikipedia < ciell.wikipedia@gmail.com>:
This will be very interesting, thank you Maggie. (To check your local time for this office hour: click here <
https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=Maggie+Dennis+offi...
)
Vriendelijke groet, Ciell
Op do 28 mei 2020 om 14:03 schreef Maggie Dennis <mdennis@wikimedia.org
:
Hello, all.
With the Board’s recent statement, this seems like a good time to
launch
the quarterly office hours I’ve been wanting to create for people who
want
to talk to me about issues involving “community resilience and sustainability,” including the work of Trust & Safety, whom I oversee. (after months of wanting to do this I’ve come to realize that I will
always
be "too busy" to feel like it's the perfect time for this. So I’m going
to
do it now anyway!)
There’ve been requests to make office hours more personal, so I will
host a
Zoom hangout where people can join me, but I'll also take questions
from
Telegram and IRC.[1] I know that finding an hour that works for
everybody
is not going to happen, and I know from past office hours I’ve been involved in that I may get far more questions than I can answer (or, contrarily, nothing at all :)). Nevertheless, I will do my best to
answer
questions posed to me in that hour by Wikimedians in good standing (not Foundation or community banned) and to follow up in writing with any I don’t have time for over the next few days or week or so, time
allowing.
I
might aggregate similar questions into a kind of FAQ. We’ll publish
notes,
anonymizing those who’ve asked questions, after.
I do, however, have the following caveats:
I can’t and won’t discuss specific Trust & Safety cases. Instead, I
can
discuss Trust & Safety protocols and practices and approaches as well
as
some of the mistakes we’ve made, some of the things I’m proud of, and some of the things we’re hoping to do.
I will not respond to comments or questions that are disrespectful to me, to my colleagues, or to anyone in our communities. I can talk civilly about our work even if you disagree with me or I disagree with you. I won’t compromise on this.
I’m not sure if I will stick with Zoom as the way I do office hours forever, but I am responding to some requests for spoken interaction
while
also trying to provide text options for those who prefer. I admit to
being
a little camera shy myself, so this is a challenge for me! If I
embarrass
myself too badly, I may retreat to the safety of text in future.
I was hoping to have the Zoom link already, but while that’s being expedited by our office technology team, I don’t have it yet. I wanted
to
give interested people notice as soon as I knew the time. I’ll follow
up
with links again at least two hours in advance.
The meeting will be on June 4th at 1800 UTC.
I hope to see you there.
Best,
Maggie
[1] Zoom link; Telegram link:
https://t.me/joinchat/DOlGIB1FRLUWqW9iB3qfTQ
; directions for participating in IRC: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#How_to_participate
-- Maggie Dennis Vice President, Community Resilience & Sustainability Wikimedia Foundation, Inc. _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
On Sun, 31 May 2020 at 05:50, Newyorkbrad newyorkbrad@gmail.com wrote:
Every time I see the title of this thread, I momentarily wonder why this event is being held 220 years ago.
Military time :-)
Thank you, Maggie, I am so glad this is coming at the right time. Looking forward to it.
Thanks
Olaniyan Olushola CEO DataAccess Systems Ltd President, Wikimedia Nigeria Member, Affcom ( Wikimedia Foundation) Co-director Wiki Women Radio www.wikimedia.org.ng shola@wikimedia.org.ng olaniyanshola15@gmail.com +2348167352512
On Thu, May 28, 2020, 13:03 Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org wrote:
Hello, all.
With the Board’s recent statement, this seems like a good time to launch the quarterly office hours I’ve been wanting to create for people who want to talk to me about issues involving “community resilience and sustainability,” including the work of Trust & Safety, whom I oversee. (after months of wanting to do this I’ve come to realize that I will always be "too busy" to feel like it's the perfect time for this. So I’m going to do it now anyway!)
There’ve been requests to make office hours more personal, so I will host a Zoom hangout where people can join me, but I'll also take questions from Telegram and IRC.[1] I know that finding an hour that works for everybody is not going to happen, and I know from past office hours I’ve been involved in that I may get far more questions than I can answer (or, contrarily, nothing at all :)). Nevertheless, I will do my best to answer questions posed to me in that hour by Wikimedians in good standing (not Foundation or community banned) and to follow up in writing with any I don’t have time for over the next few days or week or so, time allowing. I might aggregate similar questions into a kind of FAQ. We’ll publish notes, anonymizing those who’ve asked questions, after.
I do, however, have the following caveats:
I can’t and won’t discuss specific Trust & Safety cases. Instead, I can discuss Trust & Safety protocols and practices and approaches as well as some of the mistakes we’ve made, some of the things I’m proud of, and some of the things we’re hoping to do.
I will not respond to comments or questions that are disrespectful to me, to my colleagues, or to anyone in our communities. I can talk civilly about our work even if you disagree with me or I disagree with you. I won’t compromise on this.
I’m not sure if I will stick with Zoom as the way I do office hours forever, but I am responding to some requests for spoken interaction while also trying to provide text options for those who prefer. I admit to being a little camera shy myself, so this is a challenge for me! If I embarrass myself too badly, I may retreat to the safety of text in future.
I was hoping to have the Zoom link already, but while that’s being expedited by our office technology team, I don’t have it yet. I wanted to give interested people notice as soon as I knew the time. I’ll follow up with links again at least two hours in advance.
The meeting will be on June 4th at 1800 UTC.
I hope to see you there.
Best,
Maggie
[1] Zoom link; Telegram link: https://t.me/joinchat/DOlGIB1FRLUWqW9iB3qfTQ ; directions for participating in IRC: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#How_to_participate
-- Maggie Dennis Vice President, Community Resilience & Sustainability Wikimedia Foundation, Inc. _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Hello, all.
First, I’m sorry for not doing a better job introducing myself last time. (I was told I should have done that.) I am Maggie Dennis. Currently I am the Vice President of Community Resilience & Sustainability under the General Counsel of the Foundation. I’ve been with the Foundation for 9 years in various roles, but always connected to the group who now conduct Trust & Safety in one form or another. I am also a volunteer, Moonriddengirl, primarily on English Wikipedia, although I am so much diminished in my volunteering that it embarrasses me to point it out.
This office hour is still scheduled for 18:00 UTC June 4th. I will be on camera, and it will be livestreamed here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGRXVx5EeCk
We will post notes from the meeting, with the identity of question-askers anonymized, afterward. Questions can be submitted on Telegram [1], on IRC [2] or in the YouTube Chat or by email in advance to answers@wikimedia.org (To make sure they are presented during this meeting, please use “Trust & Safety” as the subject line.)
I want to invite people to join me in the Zoom call itself as well. I’d much rather be talking to people than nervously answering anonymous questions. Since I’m told that there are security issues with publishing the link, we’ll be sharing the link with interested individuals as the meeting begins. If you want the link to get in, please ask for it at answers@wikimedia.org, at least an hour in advance of the meeting’s start (again, with “Trust & Safety” as the subject line). The link will be sent out via email during the hour before the meeting.
If you are in Zoom, of course, and on camera or speaking out loud, people who watch the stream will see you, so if you prefer more anonymity Telegram or IRC may be more comfortable for you.
Best,
Maggie [3]
P.S. NewYorkBrad, colon added. :D 18:00. I was typing it the way my dad always said it out loud. That said, I get stagefright and thus wouldn't be at all unhappy to have finished this over 200 years ago. :)
[1] https://t.me/joinchat/DOlGIB1FRLUWqW9iB3qfTQ [2] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#How_to_participate [3] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Mdennis_(WMF)
On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 7:59 AM Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org wrote:
Hello, all.
With the Board’s recent statement, this seems like a good time to launch the quarterly office hours I’ve been wanting to create for people who want to talk to me about issues involving “community resilience and sustainability,” including the work of Trust & Safety, whom I oversee. (after months of wanting to do this I’ve come to realize that I will always be "too busy" to feel like it's the perfect time for this. So I’m going to do it now anyway!)
There’ve been requests to make office hours more personal, so I will host a Zoom hangout where people can join me, but I'll also take questions from Telegram and IRC.[1] I know that finding an hour that works for everybody is not going to happen, and I know from past office hours I’ve been involved in that I may get far more questions than I can answer (or, contrarily, nothing at all :)). Nevertheless, I will do my best to answer questions posed to me in that hour by Wikimedians in good standing (not Foundation or community banned) and to follow up in writing with any I don’t have time for over the next few days or week or so, time allowing. I might aggregate similar questions into a kind of FAQ. We’ll publish notes, anonymizing those who’ve asked questions, after.
I do, however, have the following caveats:
I can’t and won’t discuss specific Trust & Safety cases. Instead, I can discuss Trust & Safety protocols and practices and approaches as well as some of the mistakes we’ve made, some of the things I’m proud of, and some of the things we’re hoping to do.
I will not respond to comments or questions that are disrespectful to me, to my colleagues, or to anyone in our communities. I can talk civilly about our work even if you disagree with me or I disagree with you. I won’t compromise on this.
I’m not sure if I will stick with Zoom as the way I do office hours forever, but I am responding to some requests for spoken interaction while also trying to provide text options for those who prefer. I admit to being a little camera shy myself, so this is a challenge for me! If I embarrass myself too badly, I may retreat to the safety of text in future.
I was hoping to have the Zoom link already, but while that’s being expedited by our office technology team, I don’t have it yet. I wanted to give interested people notice as soon as I knew the time. I’ll follow up with links again at least two hours in advance.
The meeting will be on June 4th at 1800 UTC.
I hope to see you there.
Best,
Maggie
[1] Zoom link; Telegram link: https://t.me/joinchat/DOlGIB1FRLUWqW9iB3qfTQ; directions for participating in IRC: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#How_to_participate
-- Maggie Dennis Vice President, Community Resilience & Sustainability Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.
Where can I find the Zoom link?
On Tue, Jun 2, 2020 at 11:24 PM Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org wrote:
Hello, all.
First, I’m sorry for not doing a better job introducing myself last time. (I was told I should have done that.) I am Maggie Dennis. Currently I am the Vice President of Community Resilience & Sustainability under the General Counsel of the Foundation. I’ve been with the Foundation for 9 years in various roles, but always connected to the group who now conduct Trust & Safety in one form or another. I am also a volunteer, Moonriddengirl, primarily on English Wikipedia, although I am so much diminished in my volunteering that it embarrasses me to point it out.
This office hour is still scheduled for 18:00 UTC June 4th. I will be on camera, and it will be livestreamed here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGRXVx5EeCk
We will post notes from the meeting, with the identity of question-askers anonymized, afterward. Questions can be submitted on Telegram [1], on IRC [2] or in the YouTube Chat or by email in advance to answers@wikimedia.org (To make sure they are presented during this meeting, please use “Trust & Safety” as the subject line.)
I want to invite people to join me in the Zoom call itself as well. I’d much rather be talking to people than nervously answering anonymous questions. Since I’m told that there are security issues with publishing the link, we’ll be sharing the link with interested individuals as the meeting begins. If you want the link to get in, please ask for it at answers@wikimedia.org, at least an hour in advance of the meeting’s start (again, with “Trust & Safety” as the subject line). The link will be sent out via email during the hour before the meeting.
If you are in Zoom, of course, and on camera or speaking out loud, people who watch the stream will see you, so if you prefer more anonymity Telegram or IRC may be more comfortable for you.
Best,
Maggie [3]
P.S. NewYorkBrad, colon added. :D 18:00. I was typing it the way my dad always said it out loud. That said, I get stagefright and thus wouldn't be at all unhappy to have finished this over 200 years ago. :)
[1] https://t.me/joinchat/DOlGIB1FRLUWqW9iB3qfTQ [2] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#How_to_participate [3] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Mdennis_(WMF)
On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 7:59 AM Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org wrote:
Hello, all.
With the Board’s recent statement, this seems like a good time to launch the quarterly office hours I’ve been wanting to create for people who
want
to talk to me about issues involving “community resilience and sustainability,” including the work of Trust & Safety, whom I oversee. (after months of wanting to do this I’ve come to realize that I will
always
be "too busy" to feel like it's the perfect time for this. So I’m going
to
do it now anyway!)
There’ve been requests to make office hours more personal, so I will host a Zoom hangout where people can join me, but I'll also take questions
from
Telegram and IRC.[1] I know that finding an hour that works for everybody is not going to happen, and I know from past office hours I’ve been involved in that I may get far more questions than I can answer (or, contrarily, nothing at all :)). Nevertheless, I will do my best to answer questions posed to me in that hour by Wikimedians in good standing (not Foundation or community banned) and to follow up in writing with any I don’t have time for over the next few days or week or so, time allowing.
I
might aggregate similar questions into a kind of FAQ. We’ll publish
notes,
anonymizing those who’ve asked questions, after.
I do, however, have the following caveats:
I can’t and won’t discuss specific Trust & Safety cases. Instead, I can discuss Trust & Safety protocols and practices and approaches as
well
as some of the mistakes we’ve made, some of the things I’m proud of,
and
some of the things we’re hoping to do.
I will not respond to comments or questions that are disrespectful to me, to my colleagues, or to anyone in our communities. I can talk
civilly
about our work even if you disagree with me or I disagree with you. I
won’t
compromise on this.
I’m not sure if I will stick with Zoom as the way I do office hours forever, but I am responding to some requests for spoken interaction
while
also trying to provide text options for those who prefer. I admit to
being
a little camera shy myself, so this is a challenge for me! If I embarrass myself too badly, I may retreat to the safety of text in future.
I was hoping to have the Zoom link already, but while that’s being expedited by our office technology team, I don’t have it yet. I wanted to give interested people notice as soon as I knew the time. I’ll follow up with links again at least two hours in advance.
The meeting will be on June 4th at 1800 UTC.
I hope to see you there.
Best,
Maggie
[1] Zoom link; Telegram link:
https://t.me/joinchat/DOlGIB1FRLUWqW9iB3qfTQ;
directions for participating in IRC: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#How_to_participate
-- Maggie Dennis Vice President, Community Resilience & Sustainability Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.
-- Maggie Dennis Vice President, Community Resilience & Sustainability Wikimedia Foundation, Inc. _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Hi Ad, We've sent you the zoom link offlist (per Maggie's note in the email below).
Also, the link for the stream is at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGRXVx5EeCk Thanks.
On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 10:55 AM Ad Huikeshoven ad@huikeshoven.org wrote:
Where can I find the Zoom link?
On Tue, Jun 2, 2020 at 11:24 PM Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org wrote:
Hello, all.
First, I’m sorry for not doing a better job introducing myself last time. (I was told I should have done that.) I am Maggie Dennis. Currently I am the Vice President of Community Resilience & Sustainability under the General Counsel of the Foundation. I’ve been with the Foundation for 9 years in various roles, but always connected to the group who now conduct Trust & Safety in one form or another. I am also a volunteer, Moonriddengirl, primarily on English Wikipedia, although I am so much diminished in my volunteering that it embarrasses me to point it out.
This office hour is still scheduled for 18:00 UTC June 4th. I will be on camera, and it will be livestreamed here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGRXVx5EeCk
We will post notes from the meeting, with the identity of question-askers anonymized, afterward. Questions can be submitted on Telegram [1], on IRC [2] or in the YouTube Chat or by email in advance to
answers@wikimedia.org
(To make sure they are presented during this meeting, please use “Trust & Safety” as the subject line.)
I want to invite people to join me in the Zoom call itself as well. I’d much rather be talking to people than nervously answering anonymous questions. Since I’m told that there are security issues with publishing the link, we’ll be sharing the link with interested individuals as the meeting begins. If you want the link to get in, please ask for it at answers@wikimedia.org, at least an hour in advance of the meeting’s
start
(again, with “Trust & Safety” as the subject line). The link will be sent out via email during the hour before the meeting.
If you are in Zoom, of course, and on camera or speaking out loud, people who watch the stream will see you, so if you prefer more anonymity
Telegram
or IRC may be more comfortable for you.
Best,
Maggie [3]
P.S. NewYorkBrad, colon added. :D 18:00. I was typing it the way my dad always said it out loud. That said, I get stagefright and thus wouldn't
be
at all unhappy to have finished this over 200 years ago. :)
[1] https://t.me/joinchat/DOlGIB1FRLUWqW9iB3qfTQ [2] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#How_to_participate [3] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Mdennis_(WMF)
On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 7:59 AM Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org wrote:
Hello, all.
With the Board’s recent statement, this seems like a good time to
launch
the quarterly office hours I’ve been wanting to create for people who
want
to talk to me about issues involving “community resilience and sustainability,” including the work of Trust & Safety, whom I oversee. (after months of wanting to do this I’ve come to realize that I will
always
be "too busy" to feel like it's the perfect time for this. So I’m going
to
do it now anyway!)
There’ve been requests to make office hours more personal, so I will
host
a Zoom hangout where people can join me, but I'll also take questions
from
Telegram and IRC.[1] I know that finding an hour that works for
everybody
is not going to happen, and I know from past office hours I’ve been involved in that I may get far more questions than I can answer (or, contrarily, nothing at all :)). Nevertheless, I will do my best to
answer
questions posed to me in that hour by Wikimedians in good standing (not Foundation or community banned) and to follow up in writing with any I don’t have time for over the next few days or week or so, time
allowing.
I
might aggregate similar questions into a kind of FAQ. We’ll publish
notes,
anonymizing those who’ve asked questions, after.
I do, however, have the following caveats:
I can’t and won’t discuss specific Trust & Safety cases. Instead, I can discuss Trust & Safety protocols and practices and approaches as
well
as some of the mistakes we’ve made, some of the things I’m proud of,
and
some of the things we’re hoping to do.
I will not respond to comments or questions that are disrespectful
to
me, to my colleagues, or to anyone in our communities. I can talk
civilly
about our work even if you disagree with me or I disagree with you.
I
won’t
compromise on this.
I’m not sure if I will stick with Zoom as the way I do office hours forever, but I am responding to some requests for spoken interaction
while
also trying to provide text options for those who prefer. I admit to
being
a little camera shy myself, so this is a challenge for me! If I
embarrass
myself too badly, I may retreat to the safety of text in future.
I was hoping to have the Zoom link already, but while that’s being expedited by our office technology team, I don’t have it yet. I wanted
to
give interested people notice as soon as I knew the time. I’ll follow
up
with links again at least two hours in advance.
The meeting will be on June 4th at 1800 UTC.
I hope to see you there.
Best,
Maggie
[1] Zoom link; Telegram link:
https://t.me/joinchat/DOlGIB1FRLUWqW9iB3qfTQ;
directions for participating in IRC: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#How_to_participate
-- Maggie Dennis Vice President, Community Resilience & Sustainability Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.
-- Maggie Dennis Vice President, Community Resilience & Sustainability Wikimedia Foundation, Inc. _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Thank you, Maggie, Elena and Nick for this meeting!
The event was very well organized on the first try, focused and informative. Special thanks to Maggie for tirelessly answering all the questions and giving insight to the wide spectrum of challenges.
It was great to hear that transparency will be an important part of the processes to be developed and that the communities will be involved in working out the details. I think this is going in the right direction to establish trust and cooperation with the communities and a mutually agreeable outcome.
Thank you to all participants and I hope there will be more meetings as this project progresses!
Aron
On Tue, 2 Jun 2020 at 23:24, Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org wrote:
We will post notes from the meeting, with the identity of question-askers anonymized, afterward. Questions can be submitted on Telegram [1], on IRC [2] or in the YouTube Chat or by email in advance to answers@wikimedia.org (To make sure they are presented during this meeting, please use “Trust & Safety” as the subject line.)
True, (because of connectivity issues I was disconnected for some time). Thanks Maggie for answering the questions and clarifying things. All the best and good wishes.
Thanks Tito Dutta Note: If I don't reply to your email in 2 days, please feel free to remind me over email or phone call.
On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 01:17, Aron Manning aronmanning5@gmail.com wrote:
Thank you, Maggie, Elena and Nick for this meeting!
The event was very well organized on the first try, focused and informative. Special thanks to Maggie for tirelessly answering all the questions and giving insight to the wide spectrum of challenges.
It was great to hear that transparency will be an important part of the processes to be developed and that the communities will be involved in working out the details. I think this is going in the right direction to establish trust and cooperation with the communities and a mutually agreeable outcome.
Thank you to all participants and I hope there will be more meetings as this project progresses!
Aron
On Tue, 2 Jun 2020 at 23:24, Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org wrote:
We will post notes from the meeting, with the identity of question-askers anonymized, afterward. Questions can be submitted on Telegram [1], on IRC [2] or in the YouTube Chat or by email in advance to
answers@wikimedia.org
(To make sure they are presented during this meeting, please use “Trust & Safety” as the subject line.)
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Yes thank you very much. I really liked the sincerity and the straight to the point amswers. It feels great to be listened at and given sincere answers.
Make this call a best practice, it rocked.
Warm regards,
Nattes à chat
Envoyé de mon iPhone
Le 4 juin 2020 à 22:16, Tito Dutta trulytito@gmail.com a écrit :
True, (because of connectivity issues I was disconnected for some time). Thanks Maggie for answering the questions and clarifying things. All the best and good wishes.
Thanks Tito Dutta Note: If I don't reply to your email in 2 days, please feel free to remind me over email or phone call.
On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 01:17, Aron Manning aronmanning5@gmail.com wrote:
Thank you, Maggie, Elena and Nick for this meeting!
The event was very well organized on the first try, focused and informative. Special thanks to Maggie for tirelessly answering all the questions and giving insight to the wide spectrum of challenges.
It was great to hear that transparency will be an important part of the processes to be developed and that the communities will be involved in working out the details. I think this is going in the right direction to establish trust and cooperation with the communities and a mutually agreeable outcome.
Thank you to all participants and I hope there will be more meetings as this project progresses!
Aron
On Tue, 2 Jun 2020 at 23:24, Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org wrote:
We will post notes from the meeting, with the identity of question-askers anonymized, afterward. Questions can be submitted on Telegram [1], on IRC [2] or in the YouTube Chat or by email in advance to
answers@wikimedia.org
(To make sure they are presented during this meeting, please use “Trust & Safety” as the subject line.)
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Agreed that office hours are a nice idea, although
1. For privacy reasons,I don't think that they need to be on video. Sue had them on IRC. In the Wikimedia Cafe several of us use audio only.
2. I'm digesting what Maggie said about the incidents of last July. I'm not sure that the version of events that was communicated to her captures how I would describe the multiple bad decisions that happened, and I'm not inclined to believe that the problems can be summed up as poor communications. I don't mean to put words in Maggie's mouth, and I don't think that she was trying to provide a comprehensive view of her briefing, but I also have concerns regarding what I heard in her summary, and I would encourage Maggie to probe extensively into what happened while she was on leave.
I don't know what all was going on inside of WMF, but I would have wanted an outsider -- that is, not someone inside of WMF -- to review the actions of the staff, similar to how police departments are sometimes reviewed by outside agencies after high profile incidents, and I would want the report from that review to be public. Given my perspective on what happened, I think that at least one WMF staff person probably should have been demoted or fired, and perhaps more than one, up to and including Katherine. However, I don't have enough information to decide what accountability measures should have been taken. I would have more faith in the integrity of WMF if there had been an outside review as I describe here, including public accountability for the actions of individual staff, much as we do on English Wikipedia for administrators and functionaries.
Pine ( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )
On Fri, Jun 5, 2020 at 6:30 AM Natacha Rault via Wikimedia-l wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org wrote:
Yes thank you very much. I really liked the sincerity and the straight to the point amswers. It feels great to be listened at and given sincere answers.
Make this call a best practice, it rocked.
Warm regards,
Nattes à chat
Envoyé de mon iPhone
Le 4 juin 2020 à 22:16, Tito Dutta trulytito@gmail.com a écrit :
True, (because of connectivity issues I was disconnected for some time). Thanks Maggie for answering the questions and clarifying things. All the best and good wishes.
Thanks Tito Dutta Note: If I don't reply to your email in 2 days, please feel free to remind me over email or phone call.
On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 01:17, Aron Manning aronmanning5@gmail.com wrote:
Thank you, Maggie, Elena and Nick for this meeting!
The event was very well organized on the first try, focused and informative. Special thanks to Maggie for tirelessly answering all the questions and giving insight to the wide spectrum of challenges.
It was great to hear that transparency will be an important part of the processes to be developed and that the communities will be involved in working out the details. I think this is going in the right direction to establish trust and cooperation with the communities and a mutually agreeable outcome.
Thank you to all participants and I hope there will be more meetings as this project progresses!
Aron
On Tue, 2 Jun 2020 at 23:24, Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org wrote:
We will post notes from the meeting, with the identity of question-askers anonymized, afterward. Questions can be submitted on Telegram [1], on IRC [2] or in the YouTube Chat or by email in advance to
answers@wikimedia.org
(To make sure they are presented during this meeting, please use “Trust & Safety” as the subject line.)
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Thanks for offering to answer questions. I asked one but couldn't log onto Zoom due to being busy.
Do we know when notes of the hour will be out?
Samuel/RhinosF1
On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 08:30, Pine W wiki.pine@gmail.com wrote:
Agreed that office hours are a nice idea, although
- For privacy reasons,I don't think that they need to be on video.
Sue had them on IRC. In the Wikimedia Cafe several of us use audio only.
- I'm digesting what Maggie said about the incidents of last July.
I'm not sure that the version of events that was communicated to her captures how I would describe the multiple bad decisions that happened, and I'm not inclined to believe that the problems can be summed up as poor communications. I don't mean to put words in Maggie's mouth, and I don't think that she was trying to provide a comprehensive view of her briefing, but I also have concerns regarding what I heard in her summary, and I would encourage Maggie to probe extensively into what happened while she was on leave.
I don't know what all was going on inside of WMF, but I would have wanted an outsider -- that is, not someone inside of WMF -- to review the actions of the staff, similar to how police departments are sometimes reviewed by outside agencies after high profile incidents, and I would want the report from that review to be public. Given my perspective on what happened, I think that at least one WMF staff person probably should have been demoted or fired, and perhaps more than one, up to and including Katherine. However, I don't have enough information to decide what accountability measures should have been taken. I would have more faith in the integrity of WMF if there had been an outside review as I describe here, including public accountability for the actions of individual staff, much as we do on English Wikipedia for administrators and functionaries.
Pine ( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )
On Fri, Jun 5, 2020 at 6:30 AM Natacha Rault via Wikimedia-l wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org wrote:
Yes thank you very much. I really liked the sincerity and the straight
to the point amswers. It feels great to be listened at and given sincere answers.
Make this call a best practice, it rocked.
Warm regards,
Nattes à chat
Envoyé de mon iPhone
Le 4 juin 2020 à 22:16, Tito Dutta trulytito@gmail.com a écrit :
True, (because of connectivity issues I was disconnected for some
time).
Thanks Maggie for answering the questions and clarifying things. All
the
best and good wishes.
Thanks Tito Dutta Note: If I don't reply to your email in 2 days, please feel free to
remind
me over email or phone call.
On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 01:17, Aron Manning aronmanning5@gmail.com
wrote:
Thank you, Maggie, Elena and Nick for this meeting!
The event was very well organized on the first try, focused and informative. Special thanks to Maggie for tirelessly answering all the questions
and
giving insight to the wide spectrum of challenges.
It was great to hear that transparency will be an important part of
the
processes to be developed and that the communities will be involved in working out the details. I think this is going in the right direction
to
establish trust and cooperation with the communities and a mutually agreeable outcome.
Thank you to all participants and I hope there will be more meetings
as
this project progresses!
Aron
On Tue, 2 Jun 2020 at 23:24, Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org
wrote:
We will post notes from the meeting, with the identity of
question-askers
anonymized, afterward. Questions can be submitted on Telegram [1],
on IRC
[2] or in the YouTube Chat or by email in advance to
answers@wikimedia.org
(To make sure they are presented during this meeting, please use
“Trust &
Safety” as the subject line.)
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
,
mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Hello, all!
The notes of the hour are out now! Apologies for the delay; I wanted to get answers to a few questions that came in after the session and where I wasn't able to answer at the time before reading a link. They have been marked for translation. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours/Office_hours_2020-06-04
Thanks to Ad for saving me from myself and moving them from July to June. :)
I also thank those of you who said kind things about the hour...and who asked even hard questions in kind ways. I plan to do this again in a few months, with more notice this time.
Warm regards, Maggie
On Fri, Jun 5, 2020 at 3:37 AM RhinosF1 - rhinosf1@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks for offering to answer questions. I asked one but couldn't log onto Zoom due to being busy.
Do we know when notes of the hour will be out?
Samuel/RhinosF1
On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 08:30, Pine W wiki.pine@gmail.com wrote:
Agreed that office hours are a nice idea, although
- For privacy reasons,I don't think that they need to be on video.
Sue had them on IRC. In the Wikimedia Cafe several of us use audio only.
- I'm digesting what Maggie said about the incidents of last July.
I'm not sure that the version of events that was communicated to her captures how I would describe the multiple bad decisions that happened, and I'm not inclined to believe that the problems can be summed up as poor communications. I don't mean to put words in Maggie's mouth, and I don't think that she was trying to provide a comprehensive view of her briefing, but I also have concerns regarding what I heard in her summary, and I would encourage Maggie to probe extensively into what happened while she was on leave.
I don't know what all was going on inside of WMF, but I would have wanted an outsider -- that is, not someone inside of WMF -- to review the actions of the staff, similar to how police departments are sometimes reviewed by outside agencies after high profile incidents, and I would want the report from that review to be public. Given my perspective on what happened, I think that at least one WMF staff person probably should have been demoted or fired, and perhaps more than one, up to and including Katherine. However, I don't have enough information to decide what accountability measures should have been taken. I would have more faith in the integrity of WMF if there had been an outside review as I describe here, including public accountability for the actions of individual staff, much as we do on English Wikipedia for administrators and functionaries.
Pine ( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )
On Fri, Jun 5, 2020 at 6:30 AM Natacha Rault via Wikimedia-l wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org wrote:
Yes thank you very much. I really liked the sincerity and the straight
to the point amswers. It feels great to be listened at and given sincere answers.
Make this call a best practice, it rocked.
Warm regards,
Nattes à chat
Envoyé de mon iPhone
Le 4 juin 2020 à 22:16, Tito Dutta trulytito@gmail.com a écrit :
True, (because of connectivity issues I was disconnected for some
time).
Thanks Maggie for answering the questions and clarifying things. All
the
best and good wishes.
Thanks Tito Dutta Note: If I don't reply to your email in 2 days, please feel free to
remind
me over email or phone call.
On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 01:17, Aron Manning aronmanning5@gmail.com
wrote:
Thank you, Maggie, Elena and Nick for this meeting!
The event was very well organized on the first try, focused and informative. Special thanks to Maggie for tirelessly answering all the questions
and
giving insight to the wide spectrum of challenges.
It was great to hear that transparency will be an important part of
the
processes to be developed and that the communities will be involved
in
working out the details. I think this is going in the right
direction to
establish trust and cooperation with the communities and a mutually agreeable outcome.
Thank you to all participants and I hope there will be more meetings
as
this project progresses!
Aron
On Tue, 2 Jun 2020 at 23:24, Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org
wrote:
We will post notes from the meeting, with the identity of
question-askers
anonymized, afterward. Questions can be submitted on Telegram [1],
on IRC
[2] or in the YouTube Chat or by email in advance to
answers@wikimedia.org
(To make sure they are presented during this meeting, please use
“Trust &
Safety” as the subject line.)
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe:
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-- Thanks, Samuel
Hi Pine,
1) For me, as non-native speaker, it really helps to see someone speak while I am hearing them. I applaud Maggie for doing this on screen. There is no need for recording, but the streaming really adds to my understanding of what is being said.
2) Though I realise that it may be a case that is still really clear to you, if she was not the person in charge at the time (Maggie was on leave as she pointed out) and it's been 11 months, it is not strange that she cannot recall all the details. I think her answer would have been more specific when she would have had the time to research the question. And with the new UCoC, an Ombudsman/audit would also be introduced for the T&S cases. Imho this would be a good way to learn and develop from. For staff, and for all Wikimedia users involved.
I am really interested in the "outside review for English administrators and functionaries". Could you please share with me (on or off list) a link to how that is formed, implemented and carried out?
Ciell (she/her)
Op vr 5 jun. 2020 09:30 schreef Pine W wiki.pine@gmail.com:
Agreed that office hours are a nice idea, although
- For privacy reasons,I don't think that they need to be on video.
Sue had them on IRC. In the Wikimedia Cafe several of us use audio only.
- I'm digesting what Maggie said about the incidents of last July.
I'm not sure that the version of events that was communicated to her captures how I would describe the multiple bad decisions that happened, and I'm not inclined to believe that the problems can be summed up as poor communications. I don't mean to put words in Maggie's mouth, and I don't think that she was trying to provide a comprehensive view of her briefing, but I also have concerns regarding what I heard in her summary, and I would encourage Maggie to probe extensively into what happened while she was on leave.
I don't know what all was going on inside of WMF, but I would have wanted an outsider -- that is, not someone inside of WMF -- to review the actions of the staff, similar to how police departments are sometimes reviewed by outside agencies after high profile incidents, and I would want the report from that review to be public. Given my perspective on what happened, I think that at least one WMF staff person probably should have been demoted or fired, and perhaps more than one, up to and including Katherine. However, I don't have enough information to decide what accountability measures should have been taken. I would have more faith in the integrity of WMF if there had been an outside review as I describe here, including public accountability for the actions of individual staff, much as we do on English Wikipedia for administrators and functionaries.
Pine ( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )
On Fri, Jun 5, 2020 at 6:30 AM Natacha Rault via Wikimedia-l wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org wrote:
Yes thank you very much. I really liked the sincerity and the straight
to the point amswers. It feels great to be listened at and given sincere answers.
Make this call a best practice, it rocked.
Warm regards,
Nattes à chat
Envoyé de mon iPhone
Le 4 juin 2020 à 22:16, Tito Dutta trulytito@gmail.com a écrit :
True, (because of connectivity issues I was disconnected for some
time).
Thanks Maggie for answering the questions and clarifying things. All
the
best and good wishes.
Thanks Tito Dutta Note: If I don't reply to your email in 2 days, please feel free to
remind
me over email or phone call.
On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 01:17, Aron Manning aronmanning5@gmail.com
wrote:
Thank you, Maggie, Elena and Nick for this meeting!
The event was very well organized on the first try, focused and informative. Special thanks to Maggie for tirelessly answering all the questions
and
giving insight to the wide spectrum of challenges.
It was great to hear that transparency will be an important part of
the
processes to be developed and that the communities will be involved in working out the details. I think this is going in the right direction
to
establish trust and cooperation with the communities and a mutually agreeable outcome.
Thank you to all participants and I hope there will be more meetings
as
this project progresses!
Aron
On Tue, 2 Jun 2020 at 23:24, Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org
wrote:
We will post notes from the meeting, with the identity of
question-askers
anonymized, afterward. Questions can be submitted on Telegram [1],
on IRC
[2] or in the YouTube Chat or by email in advance to
answers@wikimedia.org
(To make sure they are presented during this meeting, please use
“Trust &
Safety” as the subject line.)
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
,
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New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
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I agree. youtube (+zoom) and chat worked very well. I still had problem follow all that being said, and would like the "black" notice to have been used more and show (just a few seconds) the question being discussed. And besides applauds for Maggie being straight forward, I also want to applaud (elene?) for coordinating the questions, and forwarding her own - how does it fell for you to be in such a hot spot as T&S has become .
I see this as best practice and hope it will be used for many more info/discussion meetups.
Anders
Den 2020-06-05 kl. 09:48, skrev Ciell Wikipedia:
Hi Pine,
- For me, as non-native speaker, it really helps to see someone speak
while I am hearing them. I applaud Maggie for doing this on screen. There is no need for recording, but the streaming really adds to my understanding of what is being said.
- Though I realise that it may be a case that is still really clear to
you, if she was not the person in charge at the time (Maggie was on leave as she pointed out) and it's been 11 months, it is not strange that she cannot recall all the details. I think her answer would have been more specific when she would have had the time to research the question. And with the new UCoC, an Ombudsman/audit would also be introduced for the T&S cases. Imho this would be a good way to learn and develop from. For staff, and for all Wikimedia users involved.
I am really interested in the "outside review for English administrators and functionaries". Could you please share with me (on or off list) a link to how that is formed, implemented and carried out?
Ciell (she/her)
Op vr 5 jun. 2020 09:30 schreef Pine W wiki.pine@gmail.com:
Agreed that office hours are a nice idea, although
- For privacy reasons,I don't think that they need to be on video.
Sue had them on IRC. In the Wikimedia Cafe several of us use audio only.
- I'm digesting what Maggie said about the incidents of last July.
I'm not sure that the version of events that was communicated to her captures how I would describe the multiple bad decisions that happened, and I'm not inclined to believe that the problems can be summed up as poor communications. I don't mean to put words in Maggie's mouth, and I don't think that she was trying to provide a comprehensive view of her briefing, but I also have concerns regarding what I heard in her summary, and I would encourage Maggie to probe extensively into what happened while she was on leave.
I don't know what all was going on inside of WMF, but I would have wanted an outsider -- that is, not someone inside of WMF -- to review the actions of the staff, similar to how police departments are sometimes reviewed by outside agencies after high profile incidents, and I would want the report from that review to be public. Given my perspective on what happened, I think that at least one WMF staff person probably should have been demoted or fired, and perhaps more than one, up to and including Katherine. However, I don't have enough information to decide what accountability measures should have been taken. I would have more faith in the integrity of WMF if there had been an outside review as I describe here, including public accountability for the actions of individual staff, much as we do on English Wikipedia for administrators and functionaries.
Pine ( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )
On Fri, Jun 5, 2020 at 6:30 AM Natacha Rault via Wikimedia-l wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org wrote:
Yes thank you very much. I really liked the sincerity and the straight
to the point amswers. It feels great to be listened at and given sincere answers.
Make this call a best practice, it rocked.
Warm regards,
Nattes à chat
Envoyé de mon iPhone
Le 4 juin 2020 à 22:16, Tito Dutta trulytito@gmail.com a écrit :
True, (because of connectivity issues I was disconnected for some
time).
Thanks Maggie for answering the questions and clarifying things. All
the
best and good wishes.
Thanks Tito Dutta Note: If I don't reply to your email in 2 days, please feel free to
remind
me over email or phone call.
On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 01:17, Aron Manning aronmanning5@gmail.com
wrote:
Thank you, Maggie, Elena and Nick for this meeting!
The event was very well organized on the first try, focused and informative. Special thanks to Maggie for tirelessly answering all the questions
and
giving insight to the wide spectrum of challenges.
It was great to hear that transparency will be an important part of
the
processes to be developed and that the communities will be involved in working out the details. I think this is going in the right direction
to
establish trust and cooperation with the communities and a mutually agreeable outcome.
Thank you to all participants and I hope there will be more meetings
as
this project progresses!
Aron
On Tue, 2 Jun 2020 at 23:24, Maggie Dennis mdennis@wikimedia.org
wrote:
We will post notes from the meeting, with the identity of
question-askers
anonymized, afterward. Questions can be submitted on Telegram [1],
on IRC
[2] or in the YouTube Chat or by email in advance to
answers@wikimedia.org
(To make sure they are presented during this meeting, please use
“Trust &
Safety” as the subject line.)
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
,
mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
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On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 09:30, Pine W wiki.pine@gmail.com wrote:
- For privacy reasons,I don't think that they need to be on video.
Sue had them on IRC. In the Wikimedia Cafe several of us use audio only.
It was great to have it in person. Conferencing is a great opportunity to have a more humane experience in this binary environment. Also there was an IRC channel. IRC however shares one's IP - unless a cloak is set up, which is not trivial -, so how is that "privacy"? I don't understand why some imaginary "privacy reasons" have to trump good things, such as the openness of this meeting. In any way, being on video was optional and questions on both IRC and Youtube chats were answered. It was really well organized, professional, I would say.
2. I'm digesting what Maggie said about the incidents of last July.
I'm not sure that the version of events that was communicated to her captures how I would describe the multiple bad decisions that happened, and I'm not inclined to believe that the problems can be summed up as poor communications. I don't mean to put words in Maggie's mouth, and I don't think that she was trying to provide a comprehensive view of her briefing, but I also have concerns regarding what I heard in her summary, and I would encourage Maggie to probe extensively into what happened while she was on leave.
I don't think we can expect the WMF to admit the SANFRANBAN was motivated by staff members' needs, not by the intent to protect the community and address hostility in the admin ranks. Nor do I care, that's in the past and the focus now is to create in collaboration with the communities better, transparent and accountable processes instead of the secretive office actions.
I would have more faith in the integrity of WMF if there had been an outside review as I describe here, including public
It doesn't answer any of your questions, but I've just stumbled upon this and thought you might be interested: 2019 Governance Review https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Board_Veritas_Governance_Recommendations_Final_Public_Copy.pdf
an outside review as I describe here, including public
accountability for the actions of individual staff,
*much as we do on English Wikipedia for administrators and functionaries*.
Emphasis mine. What kind of public review is there on enwiki? WP:DESYSOP2019 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_comment/2019_community_sentiment_on_binding_desysop_procedure ? I recall a few admins alleged it would be "abused", so better not have it (aka. no consensus).
In practice not even policy violations can be reported, unless you are a well-known admin or established editor, or want to get banned.
Regarding functionaries: the Ombudsman Commission had *9 cases older than one year *at the end of March (ref https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Ombudsman_commission/2020/Report_Jan-Mar) and *24 unsolved cases* altogether. This trend has been ongoing for years, in 2018 first half there were 2 cases closed (in 6 months!) and 12 open... Besides, the OC only reports the number of cases, nothing else in public. What kind of "public accountability" is there for functionaries?
As I see both sides need to improve accountability and the capability for self-review. Holding people accountable does not mean, however, that heads need to fall, admins be desysoped and employees fired. That approach creates a battlefield environment: fight for yourself till the last breath, then be gone. That's not healthy. Accountability means to recognize that the results of our actions (not just mistakes) could be better and to learn from it, improve and (on an advanced level) fix the mistakes. That last part seldom happens, but the first step is to recognize the mistakes and that's the step we are at now.
I appreciate that Maggie has shown a much more open and transparent approach than we've experienced in the office actions consultation https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Office_actions/Community_consultation_on_partial_and_temporary_office_actions/09_2019. This gives me more faith that the implementation of these recommendations will be more for the benefit of the whole community than one small group.
Aron Manning (Demian)
On Fri, Jun 5, 2020 at 11:17 AM Aron Manning aronmanning5@gmail.com wrote:
It doesn't answer any of your questions, but I've just stumbled upon this and thought you might be interested: 2019 Governance Review < https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Board_Veritas_Governance_Recommen...
Thanks for the link. That is an interesting read. On page 11:
*"4. Commission a stakeholder analysis to expose and address instances where goals and priorities of the community and the Foundation may be at odds"*
I am interested to read a stakeholder analysis. So far, I haven't found one in the Wikimedia Movement 2030 strategy process, but I might have overlooked it. Who are our stakeholders? What are their needs? What needs are unmet? How important are those stakeholders for the movement, how important are we for those stakeholders? How powerful are those stakeholders?
Veritas recommended; "The Foundation should commission a task force or third party to conduct a thorough Stakeholder Analysis " Has a task force of third been commissioned to conduct a thorough stakeholder analysis?
Veritas recommended as the first priority next step on page 19: Commission a stakeholder analysis and/or utilize a task force to gain a full understanding of instances where goals and priorities of the Movement/community and the Foundation may vary or be at odds, so that these can be properly addressed by the board and CEO in partnership, utilizing community input.
So please, I would like to know what step the board or CEO has taken regarding stakeholder analysis.
Regards,
Ad
Hi Pine,
On 2020-06-05 00:29, Pine W wrote:
I don't know what all was going on inside of WMF, but I would have wanted an outsider -- that is, not someone inside of WMF -- to review the actions of the staff, similar to how police departments are sometimes reviewed by outside agencies after high profile incidents, and I would want the report from that review to be public. Given my perspective on what happened, I think that at least one WMF staff person probably should have been demoted or fired, and perhaps more than one, up to and including Katherine. However, I don't have enough information to decide what accountability measures should have been taken.
So by your own account, you don't have enough information, yet you're still calling for people to be fired. We went over this in January - stop it.
https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2020-January/094131.html
https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2020-January/094130.html
-- Legoktm
(I won't make this personal and this is *not* to *anyone* or about any past incident in specific.) But I second Legoktm on this. That was surprising to me as well. We have pages and essays on Wikipedia such as * IPs are human too ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPs_are_human_too), * Arbs are people too ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Arbs_are_people_too), * Admins are people too ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Admins_are_people_too) We may need to have a similar essay/writing "WMF staff are people too" or something similar (unless we have it already, a quick search on Wikipedia, and Google showed nothing)
Thanks and regards User:Titodutta
On Sat, 6 Jun 2020 at 04:39, Kunal Mehta legoktm@member.fsf.org wrote:
Hi Pine,
On 2020-06-05 00:29, Pine W wrote:
I don't know what all was going on inside of WMF, but I would have wanted an outsider -- that is, not someone inside of WMF -- to review the actions of the staff, similar to how police departments are sometimes reviewed by outside agencies after high profile incidents, and I would want the report from that review to be public. Given my perspective on what happened, I think that at least one WMF staff person probably should have been demoted or fired, and perhaps more than one, up to and including Katherine. However, I don't have enough information to decide what accountability measures should have been taken.
So by your own account, you don't have enough information, yet you're still calling for people to be fired. We went over this in January - stop it.
https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2020-January/094131.html
https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2020-January/094130.html
-- Legoktm
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Hello,
I'm trying to respond to this calmly here.
I request we think about the issues from some more angles.
I feel somewhat defensive, but not combative. I hope that this makes sense.
English Wikipedia took an enormous amount of volunteer effort to build, and volunteers are people too. Some of us, like WMF staff, are aware of risks to ourselves from our participation.
When people cause problems on wiki, such as with undisclosed paid editing, we have a range of ways that we respond to that, including blocking people. English Wikipedia is like a country, and as with any county we need to deal with people who create problems, ranging from minor issues to major issues. Maggie discussed some of the major issues in her office hour, and I appreciate her and WMF trying to address them.
We don't accept citizens and government employees doing whatever they want. For example, if an administrator on English Wikipedia uses their administrative permissions to lock a page from being edited when they are involved in the content dispute, that lock will probably be overruled. Depending on the administrator's past conduct, they may be given anything from a reminder to a removal of their administrative permissions.
One of the important concerns regarding the activities in the wiki is that people aren't getting the support that they need when they are feeling attacked.
I don't have answers to many problems in our world and on wiki, and I think that none of us are claiming to. However, I'm certain that in some circumstances, removing people is the right thing to do.
If this comes across as "Pine thinks that he has all the answers" or something like that, please, please contact me off list, and let's find a time to have a voice conversation.
Thanks,
wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org