I do most of my mobile editing on desktop mode. I chose to try the app out of curiousity after talking with other editors about software development challenges. At the time it was a well-known issue that mobile editors faced different issues... to the extent that there were ANI threads where people ended up blocked because they weren't receiving notifications and therefore not communicating with other editors. Almost all of my app feedback was inspired by the logic of: if I try to use this like a normal Wikipedian where will I run into problems? It's hard to understand other people if you haven't been in their shoes. I will say that it's been satisfying to see the app evolve over time and that most of my feedback was actually taken quite seriously. The app grew on me over time even if I don't use it as much as I used to.

On Fri, Jun 28, 2024, 1:49 a.m. Sohom Datta dattasohom1@gmail.com wrote:

@Clovermoss, any reason you tried the app over the mobile web interface with/without the advanced mode?

I think there is still a long way to go for either mobile editing interface to gain feature parity with the desktop experience but (in my experience) the mobile web interface is much much more feature-rich and usable from an editing standpoint than the app. Another one that I've been recommended for mobile editing is Jdlrobson's responsive vector22 user script https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Jdlrobson/responsiveVector2022.js (if you use v22). It allows you to use the default web interface on mobile, and that tends to be my daily driver if I want to do a quick bit of editing during my commute.

Regards, Sohom Datta

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Open-source contributor @Wikimedia

On Wed, Jun 26, 2024 at 1:21 PM Clover Moss clovermosswikipedia@gmail.com wrote:

...

Hi Pavan. Thank you for sharing. I've also written about mobile editing [ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Clovermoss/Mobile_editing]. I agree that mobile editing is important to consider and I appreciate your perspective on this.

On Wed, Jun 26, 2024, 9:33 a.m. Pavan Santhosh via Wikimedia-l < wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org> wrote:

...

Dear Fellow Wikimedians,

I am Pavan Santhosh, an Indian Wikimedian and Program Manager of CIS-A2K. [1] I would like to share my recent article on the Diff titled "A Case for Mobile Editing https://diff.wikimedia.org/2024/06/13/a-case-for-mobile-editing/".

The article discusses the challenges faced by users, particularly in the Global Majority countries, when editing Wikipedia on mobile devices. Despite the increasing number of mobile internet users, the current mobile editing tools are not user-friendly, limiting effective contributions. It emphasizes the need for improving mobile editing features to enhance inclusivity and accessibility.

I believe this is crucial for the advancement of the Wikimedia movement and would love to hear your thoughts and suggestions on the aspects discussed in my article.

Best regards, Pavan Santhosh, Program Manager, CIS-A2K.

[1} https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/CIS-A2K _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l Public archives at https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/... To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-leave@lists.wikimedia.org

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Thanks for sharing the diff, Pavan.

Here are a few observations from our experience of working with probably over a thousand new Wikimedians over the past five years, the majority of whom are mobile phone users

We run annual Wikimedia bootcamps at a high school in Bangladesh, with the number of participants ranging from 150 to 500 each year, the number depends on the circumstances of that year's edition. You can know more about it from this diff: https://diff.wikimedia.org/2024/06/24/ndec-wikimedia-bootcamp-2024-we-did-it...

Around 80% of our participants are mobile phone users. Since this bootcamp is their first entry into the Wikimediaverse, it plays a crucial role in shaping their overall Wikimedia experience. The statistics and other learnings can be found in this diff: https://diff.wikimedia.org/2024/06/27/ndec-wikimedia-bootcamp-2024-the-lesso...

Our audience consists of 16-17-year-old high school students. Every year, the most frequently asked question is whether they can work for the Wikimedia movement using a mobile phone. While we respond positively, we do so with some hesitation. The Wikipedia Adventure https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:The_Wikipedia_Adventure (TWA) is a mandatory assignment for our Wikimedia bootcamp participants each year, as it saves us a considerable amount of work. TWA is not designed for mobile phones, so we suggest participants use the desktop web version from their browsers (TWA was even down during our 2024 edition of the bootcamp). Unfortunately, the small mobile phone screens make it difficult for the desktop version to fit properly, leading to challenges like accurately tapping on specific tool icons, which often results in unintentional bad edits during the bootcamp. We don't suggest the mobile app since very few features are available there.

The participants are just high schoolers and often have to depend on their parents for digital devices. Parents either don't allow them to use a laptop or desktop considering their age, or the families simply can't afford one; the socio-economic context plays a big role here. As a result, mobile phones are the most accessible device for them. Contributing to any Wikimedia project via mobile phone, even using the desktop view, is very challenging. This is one of the major reasons for the low retention rate of our bootcamps. When participants who use mobile phones find that contributing to Wikimedia is complex and time-consuming, it feels like a waste of their time and effort. This is especially problematic given that they have homework, assignments, labs, and exams every week, making it difficult to carve out time for Wikimedia contributions.

I agree with what you said in your diff:

It’s not just about providing alternative means of access; it’s about making sure that the primary mode of access for a majority of users—mobile devices—is as user-friendly and intuitive as possible.

But while working as organizers of such large-scale outreach projects, we neither have the capacity to provide participants with alternatives nor can we make the Wikimedia ecosystem mobile-friendly for them. We are trying to convince a few tech startups in the country to donate some devices, as they produce affordable Linux PCs in the price range of mobile phones (around 50 - 100 USD). Convincing them is tough since we don't have anything to offer them in exchange. We are unable to buy these devices for our contributors because we can't receive grants from Bangladesh. Managing a few PCs for the participants is merely a bandaid solution rather than a sustainable fix, but it's the least we can do for now.

Beyond direct on-wiki editing, there are other indirect bottlenecks too. I lead Project Korikath https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Project_Korikath and Project Shoili https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Project_Shoili. Project Korikath works to bring media files related to local topics to Wikimedia Commons. We have to edit hundreds, sometimes over a thousand images after every photowalk https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Project_Korikath-Photowalk, which is completely impossible without a PC, our volunteers take help from their friends who have PCs. If you look at this cinematography https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Lumen_Sapientiae.webm produced by Project Korikath, you'll see that the color grading has been messed up because we were using an old cheap monitor that didn't display proper colors. Project Shoili helps Wikimedia communities from all over the world with graphic design. Here, PCs are essential for our contributors. We voluntarily design logos, posters, and even brand entire Wikimedia events for any wikimedia group that requests https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Project_Shoili-Community_Requests it. We can't create complex illustrations or 3D models because they crash the PCs of our contributors. Having access to a standard device impacts Wikimedians' capacity both directly and indirectly, and we currently don't have a feasible solution to address this issue.

Best, Rafi

On Sun, Jun 30, 2024 at 4:02 AM Samuel Klein meta.sj@gmail.com wrote:

Yes, a thousand times yes! This is one of our great weaknesses, experienced most by editors who only have phones to access the sites. But it is also quite hard for me, and I regularly put off even small edits until I am at a laptop or desktop.

Thank you for writing this, Pavan. I will share it.

🌍🌏🌎🌑

On Wed, Jun 26, 2024, 8:33 AM Pavan Santhosh via Wikimedia-l < wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org> wrote:

...

Dear Fellow Wikimedians,

I am Pavan Santhosh, an Indian Wikimedian and Program Manager of CIS-A2K. [1] I would like to share my recent article on the Diff titled "A Case for Mobile Editing https://diff.wikimedia.org/2024/06/13/a-case-for-mobile-editing/".

The article discusses the challenges faced by users, particularly in the Global Majority countries, when editing Wikipedia on mobile devices. Despite the increasing number of mobile internet users, the current mobile editing tools are not user-friendly, limiting effective contributions. It emphasizes the need for improving mobile editing features to enhance inclusivity and accessibility.

I believe this is crucial for the advancement of the Wikimedia movement and would love to hear your thoughts and suggestions on the aspects discussed in my article.

Best regards, Pavan Santhosh, Program Manager, CIS-A2K.

[1} https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/CIS-A2K _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l Public archives at https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/... To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-leave@lists.wikimedia.org

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