Michael Bimmler writes: I confess I am amused too, which is why I indulge myself. It's a bit as if I were to show up at a programming conference and say something like "You know, that C++ stuff is very complicated -- it requires a knowledge of object-oriented-programming principles, you know." If I were really self-important, I'd repeat this C++ pronunciamento two or three times, ideally in front of a large group. --m