I agree a little card can help. But keep in mind that this one is about the Foundation and its local chapters. So, having a card confers a sort of authority to its holder and Jimbo has more than once found himself in the situation where some one he was talking to told him, "Mr X, your representant, told us that blahblahblah". The person thought it real and true, and it was not so easy for Jimbo to convince him otherwise. Now, I think this is essentially a problem when discussion is over legal issue, technical deals, donations negociations etc... which are the concerns of the chapters and foundation proper. This is quite different from being an editor on a project. We already mentionned several times that it would be great for example, to have a press card for some wikinewsies, as it would open them doors. Similarly, setting up cards saying that someone is an editor at wikipedia or wikinews (with Wikipedia logo or Wikinews logo) to help access in some areas, do not seem to be a problem to me. ant Walter Vermeir a écrit:

James D. Forrester a écrit: Nod, European paper, but not the size of precut cards one can buy here :-( If I remember well, yours proposed 4 cards from top to bottom, while pre-cut paper has 5. So I could not print them myself. Unless I use regular paper and cut them myself by other means. If you remember, I wrote to you about this, but you could not answer for a while, and I had to do them again so I could have them for my meeting in time. And since I could not edit your format with the soft I had, I unfortunately had to remake them entirely. But they are of similar type than yours. Now, if people purchase precut cards in France, the only type I found is 5 cards from top to bottom. Two people is better than one. So, when one is missing, the other can help :-) Seriously, the main person likely to need these cards is Ryo. Notafish being his girl friend is more likely to fix quickly translation issues than you :-) I suddenly wonder what is "official"... True. We won't put the template on meta then. This said, when I was looking for you to fix my own cards, the latest thought I had was to ask Jimbo to fix them for me. Oh, I had not thought of looking at this place. I go look... Well, my opinion then First, there is no mention of local chapters at all. I regret this. Second, you suggest that the following positions might get a card * Arbitrator (en) Member, English Wikipedia Arbitration Committee I strongly disagree with this. I do not think being a arbitrator on one project grant in any sense an official position in the Foundation. If there is need of a card, this card should have Wikipedia logo only, and should not mention the Foundation itself. I think there is a big confusion here between being active and trusted on a projet, and having an official position on the Foundation. If any card was distributed to an arbitrator, please ask him not to use it. I think it is embarassing because it would give an authority to a person on Foundation matters, where there is not I think. * MediaWiki Developer Member, MediaWiki Developer Committee Same comment. MediaWiki is different from WikiMedia. And developers are first to say it. The only one who could have one right now is the Developer liaison. Now, if MediaWiki developer need a card, by all means, let's do it, but with the MediaWiki logo on it. * Wikimedia Steward Wikimedia Steward I would tend to say that again, being a wikimedia steward does not in any sense give an authority on Wikimedia matters. Plus, to be honest, no one aside from us, knows what it encompasses :-) I am sorry if what I say above upset any one. I am perfectly aware that a card could help some people get some doors opened, and if we can do something, such as giving an official title, fine. If we can make other types of cards, fine as well. But frankly, our internal kitchen is no one business. Being an arbitrator is internal business. Sure enough, arbitrators are people we generally like and trust. But if we trust them to take some decisions for us, that does not mean they should appear as Wikimedia official people. There is an arbitration committee on en now, elected with certain rules. There will be soon one on fr, elected with other rules. And maybe there is one on de ? And maybe in one year, we will have 100 arbitrators in all projects. Does that grant them the right to appear as officials in negociations, say for hosting servers ? I do not think so. I would hope to say that from now on, I would prefer that only those on board of Foundation and local chapters, plus officials, have a card. I do not know Ang position on this, but I trust that Jimbo agrees. What do you think Ang ?

Anthere wrote: But in a sense, "official" positions mean nothing outside Wikipedia either, except to lawyers. Wikipedia is the project and community, not the legal paperwork. -Mark

On Saturday, March 12, 2005 5:04 PM, Anthere <anthere9(a)yahoo.com> wrote: Sorry, my fault, I shouldn't use such flowery language :-) Well, there are apparently plans to form Arbitration Committees on other language versions of Wikipedia, so it's not en:-centric (or not intended to be). Thus Arbitrator status, and certainly, of course, Stewards, are Wikimedia-project-wide, and the people who will receive these cards will understand that they confer extra 'status' of some kind, as you say. Neither job are particularly easy to do, and a small amount of thanks like this is perhaps not a bad thing. Yours, -- James D. Forrester -- Wikimedia: [[W:en:User:Jdforrester|James F.]] Mail: james(a)jdforrester.org | jon(a)eh.org | csvla(a)dcs.warwick.ac.uk IM : (MSN) jamesdforrester(a)hotmail.com