Dear Wikipedians in fundation,
We now in Chinese Wikipedia have some trademark issues that needs your help.
We have found an Chinese had registered "Wiki" and "維基" (in literly it also means "Wiki" in Chinese) as his trademarks at 2005/11/23 in mainland China. Since we now have WP and WN, there might be some trademark issues in mainland China. Do you have any advice or suggestions that we can do?
Best regards, Zh:User:HTChien
___________________________________________________ 最新版 Yahoo!奇摩即時通訊 7.0，免費網路電話任你打！ http://messenger.yahoo.com.tw/
In Chinese, wikipedia=維基百科. If 維基 registered, 維基百科, 維基新闻(wikinews)...., not use.
[[zh:user:shizhao]]
2006/4/21, Hsiang-Tai Chien htchien1225@yahoo.com.tw:
Dear Wikipedians in fundation,
We now in Chinese Wikipedia have some trademark issues that needs your help.
We have found an Chinese had registered "Wiki" and "維基" (in literly it also means "Wiki" in Chinese) as his trademarks at 2005/11/23 in mainland China. Since we now have WP and WN, there might be some trademark issues in mainland China. Do you have any advice or suggestions that we can do?
Best regards, Zh:User:HTChien
___________________________________________________ 最新版 Yahoo!奇摩即時通訊 7.0， 免費網路電話任你打！ http://messenger.yahoo.com.tw/ _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
not use. -> can't use
2006/4/21, shi zhao shizhao@gmail.com:
In Chinese, wikipedia=維基百科. If 維基 registered, 維基百科, 維基新闻(wikinews)...., not use.
[[zh:user:shizhao]]
2006/4/21, Hsiang-Tai Chien htchien1225@yahoo.com.tw:
Dear Wikipedians in fundation,
We now in Chinese Wikipedia have some trademark issues that needs your help.
We have found an Chinese had registered "Wiki" and "維基" (in literly it also means "Wiki" in Chinese) as his trademarks at 2005/11/23 in mainland China. Since we now have WP and WN, there might be some trademark issues in mainland China. Do you have any advice or suggestions that we can do?
Best regards, Zh:User:HTChien
___________________________________________________ 最新版 Yahoo!奇摩即時通訊 7.0，免費網路電話任你打！ http://messenger.yahoo.com.tw/ _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Hi,
We have found an Chinese had registered "Wiki" and "維基" (in literly it also means "Wiki" in Chinese) as his trademarks at 2005/11/23 in mainland China. Since we now have WP and WN, there might be some trademark issues in mainland China. Do you have any advice or suggestions that we can do?
There is Trademark in China? ;-) Alawyer should point the Trademark office to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Wikipedia#Naming and/or other sources (publications) to show that the name 維基 is used since long before 2005. According to the Chinese trademark law (Article 11, paragraph 1 and Chapter V) http://www.chinaiprlaw.com/english/laws/laws11.htm generic names are not allowed so you have to prove that Wiki and 維基 are generic names for special kind of websites that were invented by Ward Cunningham. Wikimedia Foundation does not have Trademark on Wiki or 維基 neither because nobody can have a trademark on this.
But I don't know any chinese lawyer. At least you can find out how to submit a application for adjudication to the Chinese Trademark Review and Adjudication Board. The best way is to find a chinese lawyer who has handled such an application before and who is willing to help for free.
Greetings, Jakob
P.S: In Germany a baker has trademark for "Wiki" for cakes since 1956 but this is ok because Wikis and cakes are different things. Sadly he does not produce the cakes anymore,I would like to taste it :-)
Jakob Voss wrote:
P.S: In Germany a baker has trademark for "Wiki" for cakes since 1956 but this is ok because Wikis and cakes are different things. Sadly he does not produce the cakes anymore,I would like to taste it :-) _______________________________________________
Interesting excellent information regarding Chinese trademark stuff! Thanks for sharing!
Perhaps if you sent some emails regarding the wiki cake to the Wikimania organizers, the board appointees or employees responsible for Wikimedia Foundation funds enhancement, and the baker some wiki cakes might become available in the future at a profit to somebody.
Perhaps it is time for a Wikimedia Foundation store or franchise reachable from a single front portal link rather than the wiki projects themselves. I understand there are entire monastaries scattered around the planet that make money off of special christmas fruitcake or wine .... or expensive choculate assortments available at extremely high prices for next day delivery for forgetful types around valentine's day or parents days or other special days.
Maybe the wiki cake could be frosted with appropriate URLs or a message could be included in a card. Might be a limited market ... I understand there are probably less than a billion people on the internet.
If Wikimedia's non profit status were threatened by accepting franchise or forwarding micropayments I suppose something might be arranged with other non affiliated wiki's or companies.
Personally I have no desire for a wiki cake so you are on your own with this idea. All rights released to the universe via public mailing list.
Regards, Michael R. Irwin, lazyquasar
Hi, There are some things different between Chinese characters and English word. Every Chinese character has its own meaning. When we translate a foriegn language into Chinese, sometimes we do it by meaning, but more often we use characters with similar pronunciation for translation. Wiki is a generic name, so it can't be a trade mark. In Chinese sphere, wiki can be translate in many ways. Such as 維基 (now all the Wikimedia projects in Chinese language, the first one pronunces as "wei", and the second pronunces as "gee"), 圍紀(first "wei", second "gee"), and 維客(first "wei" , second "ke")etc. 維基 is one of translations of the word "wiki", and it was chosen by Chinese Wikipedians to be the only name of Chinese Wikipedia. Before Chinese Wikipedian's choosing 維基 as the name, there was no famous name of wiki technology. The problem is "if we don't register 維基, the Chinese Wikipedia will face the challenge of changing its name (in Chinese)". Wikipedia is one word, but 維基百科 have 4 characters. In Chinese text trade mark, the government protect the usage of charater singly.When someone registers 維基, other people can't use 維基 in their own trade mark. So the situation is not the same. THD
在 2006/4/22，Jakob Voss jakob.voss@nichtich.de 撰寫：
Hi,
We have found an Chinese had registered "Wiki" and "維基" (in literly it also means "Wiki" in Chinese) as his trademarks at 2005/11/23 in
mainland
China. Since we now have WP and WN, there might be some trademark issues
in
mainland China. Do you have any advice or suggestions that we can do?
There is Trademark in China? ;-) Alawyer should point the Trademark office to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Wikipedia#Naming and/or other sources (publications) to show that the name 維基 is used since long before 2005. According to the Chinese trademark law (Article 11, paragraph 1 and Chapter V) http://www.chinaiprlaw.com/english/laws/laws11.htm generic names are not allowed so you have to prove that Wiki and 維基 are generic names for special kind of websites that were invented by Ward Cunningham. Wikimedia Foundation does not have Trademark on Wiki or 維基 neither because nobody can have a trademark on this.
But I don't know any chinese lawyer. At least you can find out how to submit a application for adjudication to the Chinese Trademark Review and Adjudication Board. The best way is to find a chinese lawyer who has handled such an application before and who is willing to help for free.
Greetings, Jakob
P.S: In Germany a baker has trademark for "Wiki" for cakes since 1956 but this is ok because Wikis and cakes are different things. Sadly he does not produce the cakes anymore,I would like to taste it :-) _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
2006/4/23, THD theodoranian@gmail.com:
Hi, There are some things different between Chinese characters and English word. Every Chinese character has its own meaning. When we translate a foriegn language into Chinese, sometimes we do it by meaning, but more often we use characters with similar pronunciation for translation. Wiki is a generic name, so it can't be a trade mark. In Chinese sphere, wiki can be translate in many ways. Such as 維基 (now all the Wikimedia projects in Chinese language, the first one pronunces as "wei", and the second pronunces as "gee"), 圍紀(first "wei", second "gee"), and 維客(first "wei" , second "ke")etc. 維基 is one of translations of the word "wiki", and it was chosen by Chinese Wikipedians to be the only name of Chinese Wikipedia. Before Chinese Wikipedian's choosing 維基 as the name, there was no famous name of wiki technology. The problem is "if we don't register 維基, the Chinese Wikipedia will face the challenge of changing its name (in Chinese)". Wikipedia is one word, but 維基百科 have 4 characters. In Chinese text trade mark, the government protect the usage of charater singly.When someone registers 維基, other people can't use 維基 in their own trade mark. So the situation is not the same. THD
I am not into Chinese trademark law, but in general is it not a defense against a claim of trademark violation that one used the trademark continuously since BEFORE the person claiming violation used it? I know that this is the case here in the Netherlands, there is even the rule that if that other person knew about your previous use of the trademark, their registration is considered mala fide, and can be cancelled on those grounds.
-- Andre Engels, andreengels@gmail.com ICQ: 6260644 -- Skype: a_engels
I'll get in touch with a chinese law firm through our japanese law firm.
Best,
Jean-Baptiste Soufron wikimedia foundation chief legal officer
Le 23 avr. 06 à 19:47, Andre Engels a écrit :
2006/4/23, THD theodoranian@gmail.com:
Hi, There are some things different between Chinese characters and English word. Every Chinese character has its own meaning. When we translate a foriegn language into Chinese, sometimes we do it by meaning, but more often we use characters with similar pronunciation for translation. Wiki is a generic name, so it can't be a trade mark. In Chinese sphere, wiki can be translate in many ways. Such as 維基 (now all the Wikimedia projects in Chinese language, the first one pronunces as "wei", and the second pronunces as "gee"), 圍紀(first "wei", second "gee"), and 維客(first "wei" , second "ke")etc. 維基 is one of translations of the word "wiki", and it was chosen by Chinese Wikipedians to be the only name of Chinese Wikipedia. Before Chinese Wikipedian's choosing 維基 as the name, there was no famous name of wiki technology. The problem is "if we don't register 維基, the Chinese Wikipedia will face the challenge of changing its name (in Chinese)". Wikipedia is one word, but 維基百科 have 4 characters. In Chinese text trade mark, the government protect the usage of charater singly.When someone registers 維基, other people can't use 維基 in their own trade mark. So the situation is not the same. THD
I am not into Chinese trademark law, but in general is it not a defense against a claim of trademark violation that one used the trademark continuously since BEFORE the person claiming violation used it? I know that this is the case here in the Netherlands, there is even the rule that if that other person knew about your previous use of the trademark, their registration is considered mala fide, and can be cancelled on those grounds.
-- Andre Engels, andreengels@gmail.com ICQ: 6260644 -- Skype: a_engels _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
And any update? As for translated trademark issues, I have seen some Japanese company failed to be recognized officially since they left challengers who had tried to registered translation of a certain trademark for years (Crayon Shinchan Issue) and it has therefore been said that the best defence in the PRC market would be registration beforehand even if you have no intention to join that market at that moment. Hopefully it wouldn't be our case but there is no information at any rate.
On 4/24/06, Jean-Baptiste Soufron jbsoufron@gmail.com wrote:
I'll get in touch with a chinese law firm through our japanese law firm.
Best,
Jean-Baptiste Soufron wikimedia foundation chief legal officer
Le 23 avr. 06 �� 19:47, Andre Engels a ��crit :
2006/4/23, THD theodoranian@gmail.com:
Hi, There are some things different between Chinese characters and English word. Every Chinese character has its own meaning. When we translate a foriegn language into Chinese, sometimes we do it by meaning, but more often we use characters with similar pronunciation for translation. Wiki is a generic name, so it can't be a trade mark. In Chinese sphere, wiki can be translate in many ways. Such as �S�� (now all the Wikimedia projects in Chinese language, the first one pronunces as "wei", and the second pronunces as "gee"), ���o(first "wei", second "gee"), and �S��(first "wei" , second "ke")etc. �S�� is one of translations of the word "wiki", and it was chosen by Chinese Wikipedians to be the only name of Chinese Wikipedia. Before Chinese Wikipedian's choosing �S�� as the name, there was no famous name of wiki technology. The problem is "if we don't register �S��, the Chinese Wikipedia will face the challenge of changing its name (in Chinese)". Wikipedia is one word, but �S���ٿ� have 4 characters. In Chinese text trade mark, the government protect the usage of charater singly.When someone registers �S��, other people can't use �S�� in their own trade mark. So the situation is not the same. THD
I am not into Chinese trademark law, but in general is it not a defense against a claim of trademark violation that one used the trademark continuously since BEFORE the person claiming violation used it? I know that this is the case here in the Netherlands, there is even the rule that if that other person knew about your previous use of the trademark, their registration is considered mala fide, and can be cancelled on those grounds.
-- Andre Engels, andreengels@gmail.com ICQ: 6260644 -- Skype: a_engels _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
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