De-Recognition of Affiliates with Long-standing Non-Compliance

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February 2: Update on Wikimedia...

Maor Malul

5 Feb 2017 5 Feb '17

7:06 a.m.

Dear all, Recognition as a Wikimedia affiliate - a chapter, thematic organization, or user group - is a privilege that allows an independent group to officially use the Wikimedia name to further the Wikimedia mission. While most Wikimedia affiliates adhere to the basic compliance standards set forth in their agreements with the Wikimedia Foundation, a protocol has been developed to address the exceptional cases when a Wikimedia affiliate does not meet basic compliance standards and their continued recognition as a Wikimedia affiliate presents a risk to the Wikimedia movement. This protocol is outlined at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_movement_affiliates/Protocol_for_… In the past year, the Affiliations Committee - with support from Wikimedia Foundation staff - has made a concerted effort to address a handful of chapters with long-standing issues of non-compliance. As a result, in the coming days and months, a small number of chapters that have been unable to return to compliance through their efforts in the past year will not have their chapter agreements renewed. As a consequence, these organizations will no longer have the additional rights to use the Wikimedia trademarks, including the Wikimedia name, that had been granted under those agreements. For a list of affiliates and their compliance status, please consult the reports page on Meta; there is also a page that lists formerly active affiliates. If you have questions about what this means for community members in the affected affiliates’ geographic area or language scope, we have put together a very basic FAQ, which may be found at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_movement_affiliates/Affiliate_der… Regards, M. -- "*Jülüjain wane mmakat* ein kapülain tü alijunakalirua jee wayuukanairua junain ekerolaa alümüin supüshuwayale etijaanaka. Ayatashi waya junain." Maor Malul Socio, A.C. Wikimedia Venezuela | RIF J-40129321-2 | www.wikimedia.org.ve <http://wikimedia.org.ve> Member, Wikimedia Israel | www.wikimedia.org.il <http://wikimedia.org.il> Chair, Wikimedia Foundation Affiliations Committee Phone: +972-52-4869915 Twitter: @maor_x

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Joseph Fox

5 Feb 5 Feb

7:50 a.m.

It looks like the page Maor refers to near the end there is this one: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Reports Joe On Sat, 4 Feb 2017 at 15:06 Maor Malul <maor_x(a)zoho.com> wrote:

...

Nathan

1:45 p.m.

It looks like there are many chapters and orgs at risk of being denied a renewal. I'm curious about how you decided who to label non-compliant and who you did not. I notice that WM Armenia appears to have had no reports or activity (other than 2015 wrap up information) in 2016. Are they considered up to date because they provided a report for activities the year before last? Not to pick on Amernia, it's just the first example I encountered. The chapter provided consistent monthly reports from 2013 to 2015, but not one since. They also posted a financial statement and an auditor's report for 2015, which link to the same 3 page PDF. The brief financial statement, which is not finely detailed, suggests that travel expenses account for nearly all expenditures. Maor, if you have a link to a document or page which explains the standards being applied to chapters and orgs, and which might illuminate why WM AM is in compliance but others are not, I would appreciate it! Thanks, Nathan

Maor Malul

6:55 p.m.

New subject: De-Recognition of Affiliates with Long-standing Non-Compliance

Hi Nathan, The AffCom and the WMF have been in touch for many months with groups that are not-compliant in different areas, especially their activities [or lack of them]. So, a group that has been inactive for a long period of time has been contacted in regards to this. Some of these groups have not responded to multiple attempts to contact them by both the AffCom and the WMF, or have failed to provide reports of any activity whatsoever. Other situations that have caught our attention is engaging in activities that are against what is stated in the chapter agreement. Most of the groups contacted have responded in a timely manner and provided the information required or a plan to correct the situation. M. El 05/02/2017 a las 07:45 a.m., Nathan escribió:

...

-- "*Jülüjain wane mmakat* ein kapülain tü alijunakalirua jee wayuukanairua junain ekerolaa alümüin supüshuwayale etijaanaka. Ayatashi waya junain." Maor Malul Socio, A.C. Wikimedia Venezuela | RIF J-40129321-2 | www.wikimedia.org.ve <http://wikimedia.org.ve> Member, Wikimedia Israel | www.wikimedia.org.il <http://wikimedia.org.il> Chair, Wikimedia Foundation Affiliations Committee Phone: +972-52-4869915 Twitter: @maor_x

Gerard Meijssen

5:22 p.m.

Hoi, I fail to see who you are targeting and on what basis. My impression is that it only has to do with money.. I understand this. For other parts like the language committee there are no reports except for the activity on its mailing list. I fail to see why it has to report to anyone. It is not the task the committee seeks and it does its activity on behalf of the Wikimedia board. Thanks, GerardM On 5 February 2017 at 00:06, Maor Malul <maor_x(a)zoho.com> wrote:

...

Dear all, Recognition as a Wikimedia affiliate - a chapter, thematic organization, or user group - is a privilege that allows an independent group to officially use the Wikimedia name to further the Wikimedia mission. While most Wikimedia affiliates adhere to the basic compliance standards set forth in their agreements with the Wikimedia Foundation, a protocol has been developed to address the exceptional cases when a Wikimedia affiliate does not meet basic compliance standards and their continued recognition as a Wikimedia affiliate presents a risk to the Wikimedia movement. This protocol is outlined at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik i/Wikimedia_movement_affiliates/Protocol_for_noncompliant_ Wikimedia_movement_affiliates In the past year, the Affiliations Committee - with support from Wikimedia Foundation staff - has made a concerted effort to address a handful of chapters with long-standing issues of non-compliance. As a result, in the coming days and months, a small number of chapters that have been unable to return to compliance through their efforts in the past year will not have their chapter agreements renewed. As a consequence, these organizations will no longer have the additional rights to use the Wikimedia trademarks, including the Wikimedia name, that had been granted under those agreements. For a list of affiliates and their compliance status, please consult the reports page on Meta; there is also a page that lists formerly active affiliates. If you have questions about what this means for community members in the affected affiliates’ geographic area or language scope, we have put together a very basic FAQ, which may be found at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_movement_affiliate s/Affiliate_derecognition_FAQ Regards, M. -- "*Jülüjain wane mmakat* ein kapülain tü alijunakalirua jee wayuukanairua junain ekerolaa alümüin supüshuwayale etijaanaka. Ayatashi waya junain." Maor Malul Socio, A.C. Wikimedia Venezuela | RIF J-40129321-2 | www.wikimedia.org.ve <http://wikimedia.org.ve> Member, Wikimedia Israel | www.wikimedia.org.il <http://wikimedia.org.il> Chair, Wikimedia Foundation Affiliations Committee Phone: +972-52-4869915 Twitter: @maor_x _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Lodewijk

5:39 p.m.

Hi Gerard, I don't believe that the Language Committee is an affiliated organization - so I'm not sure why affiliate requirements would apply. Or did I miss something there? Lodewijk 2017-02-05 10:22 GMT+01:00 Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com>om>:

...

affiliate

does not meet basic compliance standards and their continued recognition

a Wikimedia affiliate presents a risk to the Wikimedia movement. This protocol is outlined at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik i/Wikimedia_movement_affiliates/Protocol_for_noncompliant_ Wikimedia_movement_affiliates In the past year, the Affiliations Committee - with support from

Wikimedia

Foundation staff - has made a concerted effort to address a handful of chapters with long-standing issues of non-compliance. As a result, in the coming days and months, a small number of chapters that have been unable

return to compliance through their efforts in the past year will not have their chapter agreements renewed. As a consequence, these organizations will no longer have the additional rights to use the Wikimedia

trademarks,

including the Wikimedia name, that had been granted under those

agreements.

For a list of affiliates and their compliance status, please consult the reports page on Meta; there is also a page that lists formerly active affiliates. If you have questions about what this means for community members in the affected affiliates’ geographic area or language scope, we have put together a very basic FAQ, which may be found at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_movement_affiliate s/Affiliate_derecognition_FAQ Regards, M. -- "*Jülüjain wane mmakat* ein kapülain tü alijunakalirua jee wayuukanairua junain ekerolaa alümüin supüshuwayale etijaanaka. Ayatashi waya junain." Maor Malul Socio, A.C. Wikimedia Venezuela | RIF J-40129321-2 |

www.wikimedia.org.ve

<http://wikimedia.org.ve> Member, Wikimedia Israel | www.wikimedia.org.il <http://wikimedia.org.il Chair, Wikimedia Foundation Affiliations Committee Phone: +972-52-4869915 Twitter: @maor_x _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/

wiki/Wikimedia-l

New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

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Gerard Meijssen

5:48 p.m.

Hoi, It is in this same list. Thanks, GerardM On 5 February 2017 at 10:39, Lodewijk <lodewijk(a)effeietsanders.org> wrote:

...

Hoi, I fail to see who you are targeting and on what basis. My impression is that it only has to do with money.. I understand this. For other parts

the language committee there are no reports except for the activity on

its

mailing list. I fail to see why it has to report to anyone. It is not the task the committee seeks and it does its activity on behalf of the Wikimedia board. Thanks, GerardM On 5 February 2017 at 00:06, Maor Malul <maor_x(a)zoho.com> wrote: > Dear all, > > Recognition as a Wikimedia affiliate - a chapter, thematic

organization,

> or user group - is a privilege that allows an independent group to > officially use the Wikimedia name to further the Wikimedia mission.

While

most Wikimedia affiliates adhere to the basic compliance standards set forth in their agreements with the Wikimedia Foundation, a protocol has been developed to address the exceptional cases when a Wikimedia

affiliate > does not meet basic compliance standards and their continued

recognition

Wikimedia > Foundation staff - has made a concerted effort to address a handful of > chapters with long-standing issues of non-compliance. As a result, in

the

> coming days and months, a small number of chapters that have been

unable

to > return to compliance through their efforts in the past year will not

have

their chapter agreements renewed. As a consequence, these organizations will no longer have the additional rights to use the Wikimedia

trademarks,

including the Wikimedia name, that had been granted under those

agreements. > > For a list of affiliates and their compliance status, please consult

the

> reports page on Meta; there is also a page that lists formerly active > affiliates. If you have questions about what this means for community > members in the affected affiliates’ geographic area or language scope,

> have put together a very basic FAQ, which may be found at > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_movement_affiliate > s/Affiliate_derecognition_FAQ > > Regards, > M. > > -- > "*Jülüjain wane mmakat* ein kapülain tü alijunakalirua jee

wayuukanairua

> junain ekerolaa alümüin supüshuwayale etijaanaka. Ayatashi waya

junain."

Maor Malul Socio, A.C. Wikimedia Venezuela | RIF J-40129321-2 |

www.wikimedia.org.ve > <http://wikimedia.org.ve> > Member, Wikimedia Israel | www.wikimedia.org.il <

http://wikimedia.org.il

> > Chair, Wikimedia Foundation Affiliations Committee > Phone: +972-52-4869915 > Twitter: @maor_x > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik

i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/

wiki/Wikimedia-l

New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Ting Chen

6:05 p.m.

New subject: De-Recognition of Affiliates with Long-standing Non-Compliance

Hello Gerard, the chapters and thematic organizations are entrusted with certain functions and authorities. For example a chapter enjoys regional (or country wide) exclusivity in their operating region. They are perceived in the public as if they are official representatives of our movement in that region. The same function fulfills the Thematic Organizations for their thematic area. This is why we lay a much higher standard of requirements for these affiliates. Some chapters do not request funds by the FDC. We also have user groups who request funds, and they need to provide the same reports as needed by the funds. For the AffCom money is not the topic here. Take the example of chapters if a chapter is not working, there is no activity at all, it still blocks other affiliate grow up and take their place as long as they are there and occupies the regional exclusity. This is just one of the problematics here. And the AffCom do also require the User Groups to report their activity, although in a very easy to do manner. I hope this clarifies your concern. Greetings Ting Am 05.02.2017 um 10:22 schrieb Gerard Meijssen:

...

Dear all, Recognition as a Wikimedia affiliate - a chapter, thematic organization, or user group - is a privilege that allows an independent group to officially use the Wikimedia name to further the Wikimedia mission. While most Wikimedia affiliates adhere to the basic compliance standards set forth in their agreements with the Wikimedia Foundation, a protocol has been developed to address the exceptional cases when a Wikimedia affiliate does not meet basic compliance standards and their continued recognition as a Wikimedia affiliate presents a risk to the Wikimedia movement. This protocol is outlined at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik i/Wikimedia_movement_affiliates/Protocol_for_noncompliant_ Wikimedia_movement_affiliates In the past year, the Affiliations Committee - with support from Wikimedia Foundation staff - has made a concerted effort to address a handful of chapters with long-standing issues of non-compliance. As a result, in the coming days and months, a small number of chapters that have been unable to return to compliance through their efforts in the past year will not have their chapter agreements renewed. As a consequence, these organizations will no longer have the additional rights to use the Wikimedia trademarks, including the Wikimedia name, that had been granted under those agreements. For a list of affiliates and their compliance status, please consult the reports page on Meta; there is also a page that lists formerly active affiliates. If you have questions about what this means for community members in the affected affiliates’ geographic area or language scope, we have put together a very basic FAQ, which may be found at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_movement_affiliate s/Affiliate_derecognition_FAQ Regards, M. -- "*Jülüjain wane mmakat* ein kapülain tü alijunakalirua jee wayuukanairua junain ekerolaa alümüin supüshuwayale etijaanaka. Ayatashi waya junain." Maor Malul Socio, A.C. Wikimedia Venezuela | RIF J-40129321-2 | www.wikimedia.org.ve <http://wikimedia.org.ve> Member, Wikimedia Israel | www.wikimedia.org.il <http://wikimedia.org.il> Chair, Wikimedia Foundation Affiliations Committee Phone: +972-52-4869915 Twitter: @maor_x _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

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Gerard Meijssen

6 Feb 6 Feb

1:48 a.m.

Hoi, The Dutch chapter is well respected and it is why I can use it as an example. The Dutch chapter does not represent Wikipedia or any of the other projects. It cannot do this because the Wikimedia Foundation has this exclusive right. So when a chapter is said to represent the Wikimedia movement and its projects in a country, it is important that this is in line with reality. The reality is that the Dutch chapter is in principle a society with members; it has as a mission to share the sum of all knowledge and in its activities it supports the Dutch Wikimedia community as much as it can/is allowed to as well. When a chapter exclusively represents the WMF. Let there be trust and given the way things are it does not show when you analyse things. Thanks, GerardM On 5 February 2017 at 11:05, Ting Chen <wing.philopp(a)gmx.de> wrote:

...

Recognition as a Wikimedia affiliate - a chapter, thematic organization, or user group - is a privilege that allows an independent group to officially use the Wikimedia name to further the Wikimedia mission. While most Wikimedia affiliates adhere to the basic compliance standards set forth in their agreements with the Wikimedia Foundation, a protocol has been developed to address the exceptional cases when a Wikimedia affiliate does not meet basic compliance standards and their continued recognition as a Wikimedia affiliate presents a risk to the Wikimedia movement. This protocol is outlined at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik i/Wikimedia_movement_affiliates/Protocol_for_noncompliant_ Wikimedia_movement_affiliates In the past year, the Affiliations Committee - with support from Wikimedia Foundation staff - has made a concerted effort to address a handful of chapters with long-standing issues of non-compliance. As a result, in the coming days and months, a small number of chapters that have been unable to return to compliance through their efforts in the past year will not have their chapter agreements renewed. As a consequence, these organizations will no longer have the additional rights to use the Wikimedia trademarks, including the Wikimedia name, that had been granted under those agreements. For a list of affiliates and their compliance status, please consult the reports page on Meta; there is also a page that lists formerly active affiliates. If you have questions about what this means for community members in the affected affiliates’ geographic area or language scope, we have put together a very basic FAQ, which may be found at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_movement_affiliate s/Affiliate_derecognition_FAQ Regards, M. -- "*Jülüjain wane mmakat* ein kapülain tü alijunakalirua jee wayuukanairua junain ekerolaa alümüin supüshuwayale etijaanaka. Ayatashi waya junain." Maor Malul Socio, A.C. Wikimedia Venezuela | RIF J-40129321-2 | www.wikimedia.org.ve <http://wikimedia.org.ve> Member, Wikimedia Israel | www.wikimedia.org.il <http://wikimedia.org.il

Chair, Wikimedia Foundation Affiliations Committee Phone: +972-52-4869915 Twitter: @maor_x _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik i/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

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Ting Chen

2:18 a.m.

New subject: De-Recognition of Affiliates with Long-standing Non-Compliance

Hello Gerard, I didn't say that a chapter represent a project or the Foundation. I said it is perceived as a representative of the movement. For example, if the EU asks for opinion of the revision of the copy right law. The answers by the european chapters are perceived as the answer of this movement, it is not perceived as any casual organization. The media will at first contact the chapters of their region or country if there is anything to be commented about the movement. As you said yourself. Chapters support the community, and from a very unique position that differs them from user groups, because there is only one chapter for the Netherlands, or Germany, etc. And this is the reason why there is a higher requirement of reports and activity for the chapters. Greetings Ting Am 05.02.2017 um 18:48 schrieb Gerard Meijssen:

...

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James Heilman

8:35 a.m.

The second part of this IMO is not accurate "The Dutch chapter does not represent Wikipedia or any of the other projects. It cannot do this because the Wikimedia Foundation has this exclusive right." The Wikimedia movement which is a combination of the WMF, chapters and thorgs, along with the communities represent Wikipedia. The WMF only exclusively represents the WMF. James On Mon, Feb 6, 2017 at 2:18 AM, Ting Chen <wing.philopp(a)gmx.de> wrote:

...

the chapters and thematic organizations are entrusted with certain functions and authorities. For example a chapter enjoys regional (or country wide) exclusivity in their operating region. They are perceived in the public as if they are official representatives of our movement in that region. The same function fulfills the Thematic Organizations for their thematic area. This is why we lay a much higher standard of requirements for these affiliates. Some chapters do not request funds by the FDC. We also have user groups who request funds, and they need to provide the same reports as needed by the funds. For the AffCom money is not the topic here. Take the example of chapters if a chapter is not working, there is no activity at all, it still blocks other affiliate grow up and take their place as long as they are there and occupies the regional exclusity. This is just one of the problematics here. And the AffCom do also require the User Groups to report their activity, although in a very easy to do manner. I hope this clarifies your concern. Greetings Ting Am 05.02.2017 um 10:22 schrieb Gerard Meijssen: Hoi,

I fail to see who you are targeting and on what basis. My impression is that it only has to do with money.. I understand this. For other parts like the language committee there are no reports except for the activity on its mailing list. I fail to see why it has to report to anyone. It is not the task the committee seeks and it does its activity on behalf of the Wikimedia board. Thanks, GerardM On 5 February 2017 at 00:06, Maor Malul <maor_x(a)zoho.com> wrote: Dear all, > Recognition as a Wikimedia affiliate - a chapter, thematic > organization, > or user group - is a privilege that allows an independent group to > officially use the Wikimedia name to further the Wikimedia mission. > While > most Wikimedia affiliates adhere to the basic compliance standards set > forth in their agreements with the Wikimedia Foundation, a protocol has > been developed to address the exceptional cases when a Wikimedia > affiliate > does not meet basic compliance standards and their continued > recognition > as > a Wikimedia affiliate presents a risk to the Wikimedia movement. This > protocol is outlined at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik > i/Wikimedia_movement_affiliates/Protocol_for_noncompliant_ > Wikimedia_movement_affiliates > > In the past year, the Affiliations Committee - with support from > Wikimedia > Foundation staff - has made a concerted effort to address a handful of > chapters with long-standing issues of non-compliance. As a result, in > the > coming days and months, a small number of chapters that have been > unable > to > return to compliance through their efforts in the past year will not > have > their chapter agreements renewed. As a consequence, these organizations > will no longer have the additional rights to use the Wikimedia > trademarks, > including the Wikimedia name, that had been granted under those > agreements. > > For a list of affiliates and their compliance status, please consult > the > reports page on Meta; there is also a page that lists formerly active > affiliates. If you have questions about what this means for community > members in the affected affiliates’ geographic area or language scope, > we > have put together a very basic FAQ, which may be found at > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_movement_affiliate > s/Affiliate_derecognition_FAQ > > Regards, > M. > > -- > "*Jülüjain wane mmakat* ein kapülain tü alijunakalirua jee > wayuukanairua > junain ekerolaa alümüin supüshuwayale etijaanaka. Ayatashi waya > junain." > Maor Malul > Socio, A.C. Wikimedia Venezuela | RIF J-40129321-2 | > www.wikimedia.org.ve > <http://wikimedia.org.ve> > Member, Wikimedia Israel | www.wikimedia.org.il < > http://wikimedia.org.il > Chair, Wikimedia Foundation Affiliations Committee > Phone: +972-52-4869915 > Twitter: @maor_x > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik > i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik > i/Wikimedia-l > New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> > > _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik i/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

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-- James Heilman MD, CCFP-EM, Wikipedian The Wikipedia Open Textbook of Medicine

Pine W

11:53 a.m.

Hi James, I'd like to agree with you, but in practice because WMF controls both the trademark agreements and affiliate agreements, in practice WMF has wide latitude in determining who other than them an claim to "represent Wikipedia". There are some good things about this (e.g. we don't want people selling clothing with the Wikipedia globe logo and claiming that the proceeds "go to Wikipedia" when they actually go to someone's private bank account; another example of a problem would be someone who claims to "represent Wikipedia" and then engages in large amounts of copyright violations). However, there is always the prospect that WMF could use the trademark, affiliate, and grant agreements to penalize affiliates whose opinions differ from those of WMF. I'm not sure how we untangle this web of keeping the good while reducing risk of the bad. The current system, imperfect though it is, seems to me to be good enough for the moment. To tie this into one of my other thoughts: I think that WMF should become a membership organization, which would have the effect of increasing my comfort level with the high concentration of risk, money, and legal authority in WMF. We are digressing from the original subject of the thread about de-recognition, so please fork the trademarks discussion to a separate thread if you'd like to respond. Regards, Pine On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 4:35 PM, James Heilman <jmh649(a)gmail.com> wrote:

...

Gerard Meijssen

2:09 p.m.

Hoi, Sorry that is not how it is under Dutch regulations. Thanks, GerardM On 6 February 2017 at 01:35, James Heilman <jmh649(a)gmail.com> wrote:

...

chapters.

Greetings Ting Am 05.02.2017 um 18:48 schrieb Gerard Meijssen: > Hoi, > The Dutch chapter is well respected and it is why I can use it as an > example. The Dutch chapter does not represent Wikipedia or any of the > other > projects. It cannot do this because the Wikimedia Foundation has this > exclusive right. > > So when a chapter is said to represent the Wikimedia movement and its > projects in a country, it is important that this is in line with

reality.

> The reality is that the Dutch chapter is in principle a society with > members; it has as a mission to share the sum of all knowledge and in

its

> activities it supports the Dutch Wikimedia community as much as it

can/is

> allowed to as well. > > When a chapter exclusively represents the WMF. Let there be trust and > given > the way things are it does not show when you analyse things. > Thanks, > GerardM > > On 5 February 2017 at 11:05, Ting Chen <wing.philopp(a)gmx.de> wrote: > > Hello Gerard, >> >> the chapters and thematic organizations are entrusted with certain >> functions and authorities. For example a chapter enjoys regional (or >> country wide) exclusivity in their operating region. They are perceived >> in >> the public as if they are official representatives of our movement in >> that >> region. The same function fulfills the Thematic Organizations for their >> thematic area. This is why we lay a much higher standard of

requirements

>> for these affiliates. Some chapters do not request funds by the FDC. We >> also have user groups who request funds, and they need to provide the >> same >> reports as needed by the funds. For the AffCom money is not the topic >> here. >> >> Take the example of chapters if a chapter is not working, there is no >> activity at all, it still blocks other affiliate grow up and take their >> place as long as they are there and occupies the regional exclusity.

This

>> is just one of the problematics here. >> >> And the AffCom do also require the User Groups to report their

activity,

>> although in a very easy to do manner. >> >> I hope this clarifies your concern. >> >> Greetings >> >> Ting >> >> >> >> Am 05.02.2017 um 10:22 schrieb Gerard Meijssen: >> >> Hoi, >>> I fail to see who you are targeting and on what basis. My impression

>>> that it only has to do with money.. I understand this. For other parts >>> like >>> the language committee there are no reports except for the activity on >>> its >>> mailing list. I fail to see why it has to report to anyone. It is not >>> the >>> task the committee seeks and it does its activity on behalf of the >>> Wikimedia board. >>> Thanks, >>> GerardM >>> >>> On 5 February 2017 at 00:06, Maor Malul <maor_x(a)zoho.com> wrote: >>> >>> Dear all, >>> >>>> Recognition as a Wikimedia affiliate - a chapter, thematic >>>> organization, >>>> or user group - is a privilege that allows an independent group to >>>> officially use the Wikimedia name to further the Wikimedia mission. >>>> While >>>> most Wikimedia affiliates adhere to the basic compliance standards

set

>>>> forth in their agreements with the Wikimedia Foundation, a protocol

has

>>>> been developed to address the exceptional cases when a Wikimedia >>>> affiliate >>>> does not meet basic compliance standards and their continued >>>> recognition >>>> as >>>> a Wikimedia affiliate presents a risk to the Wikimedia movement. This >>>> protocol is outlined at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik >>>> i/Wikimedia_movement_affiliates/Protocol_for_noncompliant_ >>>> Wikimedia_movement_affiliates >>>> >>>> In the past year, the Affiliations Committee - with support from >>>> Wikimedia >>>> Foundation staff - has made a concerted effort to address a handful

>>>> chapters with long-standing issues of non-compliance. As a result, in >>>> the >>>> coming days and months, a small number of chapters that have been >>>> unable >>>> to >>>> return to compliance through their efforts in the past year will not >>>> have >>>> their chapter agreements renewed. As a consequence, these

organizations

>>>> will no longer have the additional rights to use the Wikimedia >>>> trademarks, >>>> including the Wikimedia name, that had been granted under those >>>> agreements. >>>> >>>> For a list of affiliates and their compliance status, please consult >>>> the >>>> reports page on Meta; there is also a page that lists formerly active >>>> affiliates. If you have questions about what this means for community >>>> members in the affected affiliates’ geographic area or language

scope,

>>>> we >>>> have put together a very basic FAQ, which may be found at >>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_movement_affiliate >>>> s/Affiliate_derecognition_FAQ >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> M. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> "*Jülüjain wane mmakat* ein kapülain tü alijunakalirua jee >>>> wayuukanairua >>>> junain ekerolaa alümüin supüshuwayale etijaanaka. Ayatashi waya >>>> junain." >>>> Maor Malul >>>> Socio, A.C. Wikimedia Venezuela | RIF J-40129321-2 | >>>> www.wikimedia.org.ve >>>> <http://wikimedia.org.ve> >>>> Member, Wikimedia Israel | www.wikimedia.org.il < >>>> http://wikimedia.org.il >>>> Chair, Wikimedia Foundation Affiliations Committee >>>> Phone: +972-52-4869915 >>>> Twitter: @maor_x >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: >>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik >>>> i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik >>>> i/Wikimedia-l >>>> New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >>>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/

mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,

>>>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik

>>> i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik >>> i/Wikimedia-l >>> New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l

>>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik

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Gnangarra

3:44 p.m.

In response to James comment

...

The Wikimedia movement which is a combination of the WMF, chapters and thorgs, along with the communities represent Wikipedia.

The Chapters dont represent Wikipedia we support the contributors to Wikipedia and the other projects as well as promote the reuse and sharing of content available through the movement as a whole... Our agreement is clear on that, we also dont have any editorial authority, specific influence over nor responsibility for content... this may be less obvious for some non-english language communities where the line between the language version of Wikipedia and the Chapter is blurred, especially in the smaller languages where there isnt a great expanse of international speakers to draw upon as contributors. On 6 February 2017 at 08:35, James Heilman <jmh649(a)gmail.com> wrote:

...

chapters.

reality.

> The reality is that the Dutch chapter is in principle a society with > members; it has as a mission to share the sum of all knowledge and in

its

> activities it supports the Dutch Wikimedia community as much as it

can/is

requirements

This

>> is just one of the problematics here. >> >> And the AffCom do also require the User Groups to report their

activity,

set

>>>> forth in their agreements with the Wikimedia Foundation, a protocol

has

organizations

scope,

mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,

>>>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik

>>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik

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Nathan

5 Feb 5 Feb

7:33 p.m.

On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 4:22 AM, Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com> wrote:

...

Kirill Lokshin

8:13 p.m.

Hi Nathan, To expand a bit on Maor's reply: the Affiliations Committee and the Wikimedia Foundation continue to view affiliate de-recognition as a last resort for cases where an affiliate is not only in violation of affiliate requirements or agreements with the WMF, but is also unwilling or unable to fix the problem when asked to do so. The underlying issue that causes an affiliate to be "non-compliant" will usually be publicly visible (such as a lack of required reporting, for example). The affiliate's inability or unwillingness to address it will usually not be, as it's reflected in the affiliate's communications with AffCom and the WMF (or lack thereof). Regards, Kirill Lokshin Vice-Chair, Affiliations Committee On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 6:33 AM Nathan <nawrich(a)gmail.com> wrote:

...

On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 4:22 AM, Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com

wrote:

Hoi, I fail to see who you are targeting and on what basis. My impression is that it only has to do with money.. I understand this. For other parts

the language committee there are no reports except for the activity on

its

mailing list. I fail to see why it has to report to anyone. It is not the task the committee seeks and it does its activity on behalf of the Wikimedia board. Thanks, GerardM

You misread - evidently both the original message and my reply. I answer your question in my prior post, and hopefully subsequent posts by others have cleared up any other confusion. Maor - thank you for your explanation. Would it be fair to say that the criteria for considering denying renewal are informal, and that some factors (including communication with AffCom) may not be publicly available for review? _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Michael Peel

8:32 p.m.

New subject: De-Recognition of Affiliates with Long-standing Non-Compliance

Hi Maor/Kirill/AffCom, Which organisations are we talking about here? From the crosses on the reports page on Meta, it looks like it is: - Wikimedia Chile - Wikimedia Hong Kong - Wikimedia India - Wikimedia Macedonia - Wikimedia Macau - Wikimedia Mexico - Wikimedia Philippines - Wikimedia Uruguay - New England Wikimedians - PhilWiki Community - Wikimedia Community User Group Pakistan - Wikimedia Digitization User Group - Wikimedians of Iceland User Group - Wikimedians of Nepal - Wikimedians of Uzbekistan Community Is it all of those or a subset of them? Some of these seem to be active and/or have representatives going to the Wikimedia Conference. Thanks, Mike

...

On 5 Feb 2017, at 10:13, Kirill Lokshin <kirill.lokshin(a)gmail.com> wrote: Hi Nathan, To expand a bit on Maor's reply: the Affiliations Committee and the Wikimedia Foundation continue to view affiliate de-recognition as a last resort for cases where an affiliate is not only in violation of affiliate requirements or agreements with the WMF, but is also unwilling or unable to fix the problem when asked to do so. The underlying issue that causes an affiliate to be "non-compliant" will usually be publicly visible (such as a lack of required reporting, for example). The affiliate's inability or unwillingness to address it will usually not be, as it's reflected in the affiliate's communications with AffCom and the WMF (or lack thereof). Regards, Kirill Lokshin Vice-Chair, Affiliations Committee On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 6:33 AM Nathan <nawrich(a)gmail.com> wrote:

On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 4:22 AM, Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com

wrote:

Hoi, I fail to see who you are targeting and on what basis. My impression is that it only has to do with money.. I understand this. For other parts

the language committee there are no reports except for the activity on

its

mailing list. I fail to see why it has to report to anyone. It is not the task the committee seeks and it does its activity on behalf of the Wikimedia board. Thanks, GerardM

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Kirill Lokshin

9:19 p.m.

Hi Mike, It's certainly not all -- or even most -- of them; as we've mentioned, this affects affiliates that are both non-compliant *and* unwilling or unable to return to compliance. We are, I think, quite forgiving of occasional compliance issues, such as late reports, so long as an affiliate is willing to resolve the issue in some reasonable manner. It's also worth noting, incidentally, that the table on the reports page only tracks compliance with annual activity and financial reporting requirements, and not any other requirements that affiliates may be subject to under their agreements with the WMF. We will be providing more details on the specific affiliates affected by this over the next several months, as the deadlines for them to resolve compliance issues pass. Please note that any affiliates potentially facing non-renewal that do successfully resolve their compliance issues will in fact be renewed, so we can't provide a definitive list at this time. Regards, Kirill Lokshin Vice-Chair, Affiliations Committee On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 7:32 AM Michael Peel <email(a)mikepeel.net> wrote:

...

On 5 Feb 2017, at 10:13, Kirill Lokshin <kirill.lokshin(a)gmail.com>

wrote:

fix the problem when asked to do so. The underlying issue that causes an affiliate to be "non-compliant" will usually be publicly visible (such as a lack of required reporting, for example). The affiliate's inability or unwillingness to address it will usually not be, as it's reflected in the affiliate's communications with AffCom and the WMF (or lack thereof). Regards, Kirill Lokshin Vice-Chair, Affiliations Committee On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 6:33 AM Nathan <nawrich(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 4:22 AM, Gerard Meijssen <

gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com

>> > wrote: > >> Hoi, >> I fail to see who you are targeting and on what basis. My impression is >> that it only has to do with money.. I understand this. For other parts > like >> the language committee there are no reports except for the activity on > its >> mailing list. I fail to see why it has to report to anyone. It is not

the

>> task the committee seeks and it does its activity on behalf of the >> Wikimedia board. >> Thanks, >> GerardM > > > You misread - evidently both the original message and my reply. I answer > your question in my prior post, and hopefully subsequent posts by others > have cleared up any other confusion. > > Maor - thank you for your explanation. Would it be fair to say that the > criteria for considering denying renewal are informal, and that some > factors (including communication with AffCom) may not be publicly

available

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MZMcBride

6 Feb 6 Feb

12:37 a.m.

New subject: De-Recognition of Affiliates with Long-standing Non-Compliance

Kirill Lokshin wrote:

...

It's also worth noting, incidentally, that the table on the reports page only tracks compliance with annual activity and financial reporting requirements, and not any other requirements that affiliates may be subject to under their agreements with the WMF.

For reference, since I was curious, there's an index of (some?) chapter agreements here: <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Chapter_agreements>. This page may be out of date, though. There are a whole lot of chapter/affiliate-related pages on Meta-Wiki and it's a bit difficult to keep track of them. These two templates are decent attempts: <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Template:Affiliates> and <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Template:Affiliations_Committee>. MZMcBride

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12 participants

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participants (12)

Gerard Meijssen
Gnangarra
James Heilman
Joseph Fox
Kirill Lokshin
Lodewijk
Maor Malul
Michael Peel
MZMcBride
Nathan
Pine W
Ting Chen