When he says "The result is what is important" (09:32, 6 May 2006 (UTC)) (see link 1 below), Arnomane seems to be following a philosophy likely to be disrespectful of individuals, risking to condone humiliation as a routine practice. "The principle that the end justifies the means is in individualist ethics regarded as the denial of all morals. In collectivist ethics it becomes necessarily the supreme rule." (Friedrich A. Hayek, link 2 )
On that same Template_talk:Lang-mp page, at 14:43, (UTC), Mormegil uses the worded "forced" (albeit with quotation marks) to express what happened. One shouldn't be forced (with or without quotation marks). I am convinced that a smile is more powerful than Arnomane's stick, because whenever I asked (in Spanish, with a smile) for a translation on the Spanish village pump of Commons, or on the Japanese village pump of the Japanese Wikipedia, or on the Chinese village pump of the Chinese Wikipedia, I found everytime people who provided the needed translations.
I think "notafish"'s idea(3) of "launching a massive translation rally"is a good idea. I am ready to go to every village pump of every concerned Wikipedia, use babelfish or Google language tool when I can, or leave a message in French or English when I can't, and recruit a voluntary translator for the Main Page in each language. It is also possible to use all our connections to people who know someone, who know someone... who knows a given language, as Brianna (4) who says she knows someone who speaks arabic. It is also possible to use the History of the pages in the various languages to find the names of the people who wrote them. I think this is a workable alternative to Arnomane's threats, but I am fearful of implementing it in conditions that would enable Arnomane to think that his threats are showing positive results, and of going to these village pumps as a message bearer of a threat.
Links 1) http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Template_talk:Lang-mp 2) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Road_to_Serfdom 3) http://mail.wikipedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2006-May/006988.html 4) http://mail.wikipedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2006-May/006995.html
On 5/6/06, folengo@netcourrier.com folengo@netcourrier.com wrote:
when I can't, and recruit a voluntary translator for the Main Page in each language. It is also possible to use all our connections to
What parts of the main page are you trying to translate? What are the standards of 'being updated' that are of concern? Many of the small language portals which were removed are, if not direct translations of the 'main' English portal, perfectly useful.
people who know someone, who know someone... who knows a given language, as Brianna (4) who says she knows someone who speaks arabic. It is also possible to use the History of the pages in the various languages to find the names of the people who wrote them.
Sure. I don't believe this is about threats; just about answering 'what information needs to be on a good Commons portal, which languages don't have this, and how can find people who know the appropriate language who can fix that?'
I find the discussion of "uselang=" the most interesting on that page. This would be a crude first step towards giving anonymous readers more of a say in how they browse the site. Perhaps uselang choices could also be pulled from browser settings, and potentially set as a cookie independent of them logging in (for those who never create / don't want accounts).
SJ
Am Samstag, 06. Mai 2006 19:24 schrieb SJ:
I find the discussion of "uselang=" the most interesting on that page. This would be a crude first step towards giving anonymous readers more of a say in how they browse the site. Perhaps uselang choices could also be pulled from browser settings, and potentially set as a cookie independent of them logging in (for those who never create / don't want accounts).
The problem is that many people like me look at different languages on a daily basis in order to work in Wikimedia Commons that's why I personally was reserved on these "uselang" link in the language templates.
But I would really appreciate a cookie based solution that way that anonymous users can choose their interface language or directly set it via browser language settings. There exists even a patch for it but it was rejected due to caching problems:
http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3665
So as there is code existing I don't think a solution hacked into the wiki page code with negative side effects is the best way to go but a clean solution that satisfies all people way better in the MediaWiki software.
Regards, Daniel Arnold / Arnomane
Am Samstag, 06. Mai 2006 18:13 schrieb folengo@netcourrier.com:
On that same Template_talk:Lang-mp page, at 14:43, (UTC), Mormegil uses the worded "forced" (albeit with quotation marks) to express what happened. One shouldn't be forced (with or without quotation marks). I am convinced that a smile is more powerful than Arnomane's stick, because whenever I asked (in Spanish, with a smile) for a translation on the Spanish village pump of Commons, or on the Japanese village pump of the Japanese Wikipedia, or on the Chinese village pump of the Chinese Wikipedia, I found everytime people who provided the needed translations.
Teofilo I have read your "pleasant comments with a smile" at Wikimedia Commons Village pump countless times and I don't know if I must be Budha or something in the like in order to bear your distortion of facts with a smile.
I just remember one comment from you that you refuse to participate at translating of help pages until I do not fully agree with your far fetched unwiki like proposal you provided those days. Shall I go more into details?
I think this is a workable alternative to Arnomane's threats, but I am fearful of implementing it in conditions that would enable Arnomane to think that his threats are showing positive results, and of going to these village pumps as a message bearer of a threat.
Pardon? Well again as remaked above you refuse to do something good because you think that I would count your efforts as my personal success and as proof of everything I do. What a nonsense. By the way can you translate:
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:First_steps
into French? Just in order to start with some real work in order to finally support French in a decent way in Commons... For sure you won't start because you think that I could crow over you. Would be nice if you can proof me wrong that you do not believe that and just start translating this crucial tutorial (Hint: If you translated it it would be your valuable work not mine. You would get the credit not me and I don't care about credit for me).
Regards, Daniel Arnold / Arnomane
wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org