2008/6/4, Samuel Klein <meta.sj(a)gmail.com>om>:
On Tue, Jun 3, 2008 at 9:33 PM, Lars Aronsson
<lars(a)aronsson.se> wrote:
Dan Rosenthal wrote:
Lodewijk, it's worth noting that several of
the board candidates
(myself included), have interpreted "community selected seats"
as inherently being "community representative seats", meaning
These board seats were originally explicitly intended to represent the
community (in fact two different subsets of it), so this is not just the
interpretation of some current candidates.
the desires of the community. There's no
written rule that says
it has to be that way, but rather a moral obligation towards the
community, even beyond that of the electorate.
Yes, this obligation certainly extends beyond the electorate; I don't agree
with effe at all that those who cannot vote are not represented; indeed as
many of the newer and more interesting ideas in any community come from its
newest members, those deserve attention for their fresh perspective just as
longstanding contributors do for their commitment and experience.
I agree with you though (even if you disagree with me ;-) ) that
people who can or may not vote are not necessarily not represented. I
do however feel that if you are not in the group that is being
represented, that you should not be able to vote either. There is a
subtle difference here. And it might or might not be that one counts
newer members of "the community" to belong to that community. One
could or could not count teachers as part of it. However, if you are
going to set who is able to vote and who not, you should *first* ask
yourself the question who exactly is this community that is selecting
/ being represented, before going into details.
In particular, we have many people who could be counted as our
community, but who aren't currently allowed
to vote for the board.
This is true, and in some ways unfortunate -- at least if 'voting' is what
really counts in our Board elections. but our Board and community are
unusual, and significantly more directly engaged than most. Directly asking
and answering questions, proposing specific detailed ideas or [re]solutions,
and amplifying the voices of others can be done by anyone so motivated...
This has significantly more impact than one's actual vote.
When this happens, that is a good thing indeed. However, I do feel the
urge to mention that only very few community selected board members do
this, unfortunately. (Which means that we should maybe select more
specifically board members who do this, which is the whole thing we
can do with this vote)
I suggest that the people who are elected or
appointed in various
ways see this as a strike of luck, and once on the board they only
claim to represent themselves, as best they can, for the good of
all mankind. I don't mind the WMF being undemocratic. I think
Lars, I generally agree with your ideas, but I can't understand how you
would say on the one hand that a Board member who feels responsible to
represent the community should not say so; and on the other that they should
represent themselves "for the good of mankind", something fare more complex.
Community representatives should make every effort to represent the views of
the community, not their own -- personal opinions should take a back seat to
revealing, understanding, organizing and clearly expressing the drives,
fears, priorities, and ideas of different community groups. This is true
whether said representatives are elected, appointed, or emerge fully formed
from the top of The Great Wikiball.
SJ
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