Hoi,
Mike you are absolutely right but you are missing the point that I am
trying to make. Yes, what is exposed by Hay's SDSEARCH tool is based on all
the work that was done before and as such it relies absolutely on the work
that has been done before. Without it, this tool would not be possible.
This work is key for us to move forward.
What is so vitally important about this proof of concept is that it readily
opens up Commons depending on a localised user interface. Even when that is
not available search, it is possible based to search based on the
availability of labels in a language. This proof of concept dramatically
shows that nothing more is needed to open up Commons to a multilingual
public.
This proof of concept is an invitation to adopt this approach and make it
available in properly internationalised code as part of a multilingual
Commons user interface. It invites people to participate and with some
social engineering it the shore that turns the ship in making Commons a
much more positive place. Why, because making Commons usable even useful is
what we have not done for all the languages but English. When people are
happy to use Commons, they are more likely to participate and join its
community.
So far we could not care less as long as it was used in our own projects.
The challenge that I present to you is to make Commons *my goto place* for
illustrations for my blog. When you can convince me, you convince the world.
Remember our approach is that of a wiki. It does not have to be perfect, it
has to empower us to move forward.
Thanks,
GerardM
On Sun, 24 May 2020 at 15:12, Michael Peel <email(a)mikepeel.net> wrote:
Hi all,
It’s worth remembering that this functionality is built in to Commons,
it’s just not as user-friendly. From the example below, if you put
"haswbstatement:P180=Q191931” into the Commons searchbox, you will get the
same results. Thanks to the structured data on commons project+team!
Also, around half of the Commons categories now have multilingual labels
embedded in them through the Wikidata Infobox, which means that if you do
an ordinary search for a phrase in a different language, you should find
the correct commons category if it exists. E.g., try searching for
“Telescopio Lovell”, or "洛弗尔望远镜". The infobox also has a link at the bottom
of it that you can click on to search depicts statements for that
category’s topic without having to look up the QID first.
Thanks,
Mike
On 24 May 2020, at 10:30, Gerard Meijssen
<gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Hoi,
Two more localisations became available, one for German and one for
Swedish. I have asked Alolita if she would help us with a localisation in
an Indian language. Anthere, would you be so kind and reach out so that
we
have a localisation in an African language as
well.. (French would also
be
good to have :) )
In the mean time I have linked pictures of the kakapoa to its Wikidata
item, you can search for it in Maori.
For me the point of this proof of concept is that we already can expose
material in any of our languages. We can make this available and promote
the addition of "depicts" statements in Commons and labels in Wikidata.
In
a true Wiki way it brings additional
functionality to any and all of our
users.. It will improve over time.
When we are to know the extend of its usefulness, we need continuous
statistics (we have them for Reasonator as well, just as an example).
Thanks,
GerardM
On Sun, 24 May 2020 at 07:33, Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com
wrote:
> Hoi,
> Florence I totally agree that proper internatonalisation, localisation
is
> key. What is key for me is that this already
provides an easy and
obvious
> search function for mediafiles that have a
link to a Wikidata item.
Just to
> stress the point, this is a wiki, we do not
need a fully functional
search
> engine (for all the Commons files); that is
what we aspire to that is
what
> we work towards.. That will take years. But
with a proper search tool, a
> tool that makes it EASY to use Commons, it may fool me into using
Commons
> for my blog.
>
> To show you that it works, I just looked for "baisikeli
> <https://nl.wiktionary.org/wiki/baisikeli#Swahili>" and made a
screenshot
> [1]. The screenshot is with other files
showing the evolution of this
tool
> in a Commons category [2]
>
> Important to notice is that the tool DOES invite you to localise the
> labels to French, Swahili et al for best results!!
>
> A minor observation, there are all kinds of things that could change in
> the user interface. Key is that this is a prototype. It is showing us
how
> we can make Commons work for us.
> Thanks,
> GerardM
>
> [1]
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Appelmoes3.png
> [2]
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Hay%27s_SDSEARCH
>
> On Sun, 24 May 2020 at 01:21, Florence Devouard <anthere(a)anthere.org>
> wrote:
>
>>
>> Le 24/05/2020 à 00:23, Erik Moeller a écrit :
>>> On Fri, May 22, 2020 at 10:10 AM Gerard Meijssen
>>> <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hay Kranen created a proof of concept where Commons is searched for
>>>> pictures that (per standard) use a "depicts" statement.
>>> This is a beautiful proof of concept; thank you for sharing it,
>>> Gerard, and thank you, Hay, for developing it. It really illustrates
>>> the power and importance of the Structured Data efforts.
>>>
>>> To pick a different example, imagine that you want to illustrate an
>>> article about the importance of wheelchair accessibility at your
>>> university. You might try a major search engine like Google Images.
>>> Try replacing the word "wheelchair" with translations in other
>>> languages. Note how the result sets are different, and how you may get
>>> a much smaller set of results in languages with a smaller Internet
>>> presence.
>>>
>>>
https://www.google.com/search?q=wheelchair&tbm=isch (English)
>>>
https://www.google.com/search?q=kitimaguru&tbm=isch (Swahili, far
less
>>> relevant and smaller set)
>>>
>>> In contrast, the use of Wikidata items means that, as long as a label
>>> exists for a given language, you can search in _any_ language and get
>>> the same images:
>>>
>>>
https://tools.wmflabs.org/hay/sdsearch/#q=haswbstatement:P180=Q191931
>>>
>>> The fact that the UI of this tool is currently English is an
>>> implementation detail; even with Hay's implementation, you can type in
>>> "kitimaguru" and get the same results as in English.
>>
>>
>> Sorry Erik, but I do not follow you here...
>>
>> For some reasons, it is true for "kitimaguru", but if I search for
>> "lamp" (EN) versus "lampe" (FR), or "key" (English)
versus "clé"
>> (French), I really do not get the same results at all and of course, it
>> does not proposes me the same Qs.
>>
>> I love that functionality, do not get me wrong, I am delighted to see
it.
>>
>> But except for English speakers (and now Dutch speakers it seems), it
>> can not be used.
>>
>> So wonderful proof of concept. But please... let's have all languages
>> here !
>>
>> Florence
>>
>>
>>>
>>> It would be wonderful to see this functionality developed further, and
>>> to ultimately make this kind of search functionality central to the
>>> user experience for Wikimedia Commons, so that speakers of any
>>> language are given _meaningful_ access to freely reusable media.
>>>
>>> Warmly,
>>>
>>> Erik
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>>
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
>>
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
>>> New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org
>>> Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
,
<mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
<mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
<mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
<mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>