Wikipedia has been a third tier social media platform since its inception.
Luckily we are better known for being an encyclopedia.
On Thu, Sep 10, 2020 at 10:31 AM Dan Szymborski <dszymborski(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
I am absolutely flabbergasted that a generic reference
of an organization
to flatulence, something we see in rated-G television isn't considered
"collegial" enough yet the actions that the WMF has taken over the last 18
months, many of which were pushed by people on this list *are* considered
collegial.
If a joke that would be appropriate for a four-year-old leads to special
moderation, what action ought be taken for someone on the list pushing the
failure of a collaborative process that WMF is foisting upon the community?
One of the people "doth protesting too much" about the reference is also
someone banned from English Wikipedia for a whole litany of *actual* things
that took up countless hours of community time, including making legal
threats based on finding offense in normal Wikipedia actions.
I am a longtime, accredited journalist, possibly even slightly respected in
the field -- though there's always that risk of Dunning-Kruger -- who has
written for a ton of outlets and there's not an editor in the world that
I've worked with who would've asked me to change the *very* gentle wording.
If anything, I was too mild. *I'm* grossly offended by the WMF's actions
over the last 18 months. *I'm* grossly offended by the perversion of a free
information movement being converted into a third-tier social media app.
*I'm* grossly offended by board policies that empower the vested, the
connected, the politically adept to judge the weak and the voiceless. *I'm*
grossly offended by the people here who cheerfully announce the board
arbitrarily changing board terms or that the community has no actual say in
what the *community* (not the board) built. The Wiki movement is far bigger
than the WMF; which is a good thing because I can't imagine it being
smaller than the board's self-dealing petty bourgeoisie affair.
No, I didn't mean petit.
Yet I don't call for anyone to be silenced because, well, disagreeing
vigorously is what adults are able to do.
It matters not if this message is censored by the list overlords. One of
the few benefits of being a journalist is that combination of
self-righteousness and having myriad ways to prevent an opinion from being
suppressed on dubious grounds.
Cheers,
Dan
On Thu, Sep 10, 2020 at 2:55 AM Natacha Rault via Wikimedia-l <
wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org> wrote:
Hello,
A code of conduct id something many of us have asked the WMF to write for
many years. We are asking the WMF to take an active part in stopping
abusive behaviors in our community.
On fr wiki, many admins say they are tired of conflicts and that they did
not enroll to deal with them. A code of conduct could help then take
action
because it offers a frame.
This is COMPLETELY different with the branding process.
We are one of the few projects in the open source world without a code of
conduct.
So thank you for this draft, thank you for opening up for discussions,
and
I hope the language will remain respectful.
I believe moderators should ban from this list the person who spoke about
« wmf flatulence ».
I dont want to read that type of language among people who are
supposedly
asked to write neutral enccyclopedias.
It puts pressure and stress on those who would like to answer on this
thread, it sets an aggressive climate.
Please could we all feel empowered to apply our founding principles and
refuse any such language here and on meta in these discussions?
Kind regards,
Nattes à chat
Envoyé de mon iPhone
> Le 10 sept. 2020 à 03:53, Gnangarra <gnangarra(a)gmail.com> a écrit :
>
> Yair
>
> I was in the room in 2017 when the first community consultation on the
> strategy program took place. Affiliates were asked to send a person
> specifically for the strategy process, and WMF also invited some other
> community members. There was absolutely no coercion, or control over
what
topics
were raised during those discussions. The program was not run by
the
WMF and everyone was free to contribute any ideas
they had, as the
program
> went on we chose which areas and topics we wanted to be the focus.
Trust
> and safety, and user conduct were areas that
were identified as
necessary
> to the future development of the movement.
This process has been open
for
> ideas, comments, and suggestions. Yes the
WMF has funded the process
but
every
choice has been made by community members without any duress or
reward as to where each step lead.
As someone who actively runs projects for the last 10 years to bring in
new
> contributors, I have concerns about the UCoC process in giving
advantages
> to those who have been around longer but
that is not something that
will
be
unique to this as its already an issue in all
projects where the new
person
is the one frequently dismissed as wrong when
there is a clash between
them and someone who has been around long enough to be known.
> On Thu, 10 Sep 2020 at 09:11, Yair Rand <yyairrand(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> The UCoC is obviously a WMF-driven project. It was announced in June
2019
>> by a member of the WMF Trust and Safety team, was added to the
strategy
>
process by the group of WMF appointees (or sometimes WMF
> appointee-appointees) who made up the working group, had
> pseudo-consultations about it started by WMF staff (with
wildly-misleading
>> reports written up afterward, again by the WMF), and the UCoC itself
was
>
drafted by a mixed group of WMF staff and WMF appointees, through a
process
>> set by the WMF.
>>
>> The communities have repeatedly expressed unambiguous consensus
against
>> having a WMF-imposed UCoC. The WMF has
absolutely no business in
setting
>
ordinary conduct policy, and they could have the ED and every board
member
>> and C-level declare the UCoC to be policy, and threaten every
affiliate
>> into declaring it as policy, and the
only impact would be
demonstrating
how
>> far removed they are from Wikimedia. The communities are
self-governing
and
> will implement policy based on community
decisions.
>
> That said, I disagree with Dan's calls for
nonparticipation/noncooperation
> or for specifically withholding funds or
support. If we end up in a
> situation where the WMF tries to block, desysop, threaten, or sue
> contributors, or to seize control over the projects, that would be the
time
> for all editors and affiliates and donors to
level-headedly level the
> Foundation to its foundations. Until then, we should attempt to work
with
> them, even when their behaviour leaves much
to be desired.
>
> -- Yair Rand
>
>
>
> בתאריך יום ד׳, 9 בספט׳ 2020 ב-16:03 מאת Jackie <
> jackie.koerner@gmail.com>:
>
>> Hi Dan,
>>
>> I hear that you are upset by the suggestion and likely implementation
of
>> a
>>> Universal Code of Conduct. I also hear that you feel like this is a
>>> WMF-driven project. I cannot change your opinion about the UCoC, but
I
>> can
>>> say your feelings about this being a WMF-driven project are untrue.
It
>>> doesn't matter how strongly you
feel this, it's actually many groups
of
>>
people working together. It was determined as a major need during
>> discussions I had as part of the Community Health Working Group and I
am
>>> glad to see this moving forward.
>>>
>>> I am glad you feel comfortable expressing yourself and your feelings
>> about
>>> the UCoC. I also would like to say the way in which people express
>>> themselves and mask insults as "lively discussion" is a huge
reason
why
> we
>> need a UCoC. To that point, I agree with Isaac and would suggest you
> share
>> in a (collegiate) conversation on the Meta talk page. I just cannot
take
>> you seriously with the language you used
in your email. I, however,
would
>> love to take your comments seriously and
have you engage in a
good-faith
>> discussion about the UCoC.
>>
>> Our roles in the discussion should consider not only our needs as
>> individuals but the needs of the broader communities. To dismiss the
UCoC
>>> is failing to recognize privilege and power structures and their
effect
> on
>> people in and outside of the Wikimedia community.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Jackie
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 8, 2020 at 1:42 PM Isaac Olatunde <
reachout2isaac(a)gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hello Dan,
>>>>
>>>> You are allowed to offer an opinion but I Honestly think that's
better
>>> and
>>>> more useful on the Draft talk page.
>>>>
>>>> That being said, by "effective vote or representation in the
>>> proceedings",
>>>> you probably expected a different model where different language
>>>> Wikip(m)edia community would be represented or vote on weather to
have
> a
>>> UCoC.
>>>
>>> The current model isn't bad. I do think we should review the draft
and
>> if
>>> there are specific wording we disagree with, we can either suggest
>>> improvement or removal altogether. I honestly think we need to help
and
>>>> support the drafting committee at this stage.
>>>>
>>>> Regards
>>>>
>>>> Isaac
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, 8 Sep 2020, 19:25 Dan Szymborski, <dszymborski(a)gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I'm also perfectly free to express to the IRS that I'd
really like
to
>>>> get a
>>>>> $10 million check from them at tax time. The ability to offer an
>>> opinion
>>>> on
>>>>> proceedings with no effective vote or representation in the
>> proceedings
>>>> is
>>>>> about as good as a fart in the wind. I'd prefer the WMF keep
its
>>>> flatulence
>>>>> to itself.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Sep 8, 2020 at 2:17 PM Isaac Olatunde <
>>> reachout2isaac(a)gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On the contrary, I do not think this is an imposition by the
Board
>> or
>>>> WMF
>>>>>> as we are allowed to comment on the draft, and suggest
improvement.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have been following the process closely and I do not see
anything
>>> that
>>>>> looks like an "imposition"
>>>>>
>>>>> The Universal Code of Conduct is not a substitute to the existing
>>> policy
>>>> or
>>>>> guidelines but a behavioural guidelines expected of users in any
>>>> Wikimedia
>>>>> project.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards
>>>>>
>>>>> Isaac
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, 8 Sep 2020, 16:11 Dan Szymborski,
<dszymborski(a)gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> As this is being explicitly imposed by the board from above
> without
>>>>>> community approval, participating in any way is ethically
> unsound.
>>>> Doubly
>>>>>> so without a board election preceding this as the WMF has
>> arbitrarily
>>>>>> denied communities the right, as manifested in the election of
> the
>>>>>> community seats, to voice their opinions of actions that WMF has
>>> taken
>>>>> over
>>>>>> the last 18 months. A collaborative process is a collaborative
>>> process
>>>>> when
>>>>>> it's actually a collaborative process, not just when it's
called
>> one.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The best use of time at this point is to organize the
communities
>> to
>>>> use
>>>>>> every means at its disposal to resist such an imposition.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Sep 7, 2020 at 4:18 PM Patrick Earley <
>> pearley(a)wikimedia.org
>>>>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hello, everyone.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We are excited to share a draft of the Universal Code of
> Conduct
>>>>>>>
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Universal_Code_of_Conduct>,
>> which
>>>> the
>>>>>>> Wikimedia Foundation Board of Trustees called for earlier
this
>> year
>>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_Board_noticeboard/May_…
>>>>>>>> ,
>>>>>>> for your review and feedback. The discussion will be open
until
>>>> October
>>>>>> 6,
>>>>>>> 2020.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The UCoC Drafting Committee
>>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Universal_Code_of_Conduct/Drafting_committee
>>>>>>>>> wants
>>>>>>>> to learn which parts of the draft would present
challenges for
>>> you
>>>> or
>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>>> work. What is missing from this draft? What do you like,
and
>> what
>>>>> could
>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>> improved?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Many thanks to the Committee, and everyone who has
helped with
>>>>>>> translations
>>>>>>>> so far.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Please join the conversation
>>>>>>>> <
>>>>>>
>>>
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Universal_Code_of_Conduct/Draft_review
>>>>
>>>>>>> and share this email with others who may be interested to
join,
>>> too.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> To learn more about the UCoC project, see the Universal Code
of
>>>> Conduct
>>>>>>> page
>>>>>>>
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Universal_Code_of_Conduct>,
> and
>>> the
>>>>> FAQ
>>>>>>>
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Universal_Code_of_Conduct/FAQ
>> ,
>>> on
>>>>>> Meta.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [1]
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Universal_Code_of_Conduct
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [2]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_Board_noticeboard/May_…
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [3]
>>>>>>
>>>
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Universal_Code_of_Conduct/Draft_review
>>>>>>>> [4]
>>>
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Universal_Code_of_Conduct/FAQ
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Patrick Earley
>>>>>>>> Policy Manager, Trust and Safety
>>>>>>>> Wikimedia Foundation
>>>>>>>> pearley(a)wikimedia.org
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Jackie Koerner, Ph.D.
>>>
jackiekoerner.com
>>> _______________________________________________
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--
GN.
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