Maybe, instead of thinking about CC0 vs CC-BY-SA, we should try to think at the goal: how can we, as a movement, "fight" the exploitation from over-the-top players of community-generated content?
Of course, license is the primary tool every one of us thinks about. But (and please correct me if I'm wrong) I don't think that things changed much from when Wikidata was not here and Google just scraped/crawled Wikipedia for their own knowledge base. Players like Google have resources and skill to basically do what they want, and if I recall correctly they didn't really stop with CC-BY-SA content. So license is not an obstacle for them.
As much as I don't personally like this, my question is: Is this a real problem? I don't like the idea of Wikimedia communities giving content for free to players so big that can actually profit hugely from this, (huge profits always translates to huge power), but I really don't know what we could do about this.
Aubrey
On Thu, Nov 30, 2017 at 11:04 AM, Amir E. Aharoni < amir.aharoni@mail.huji.ac.il> wrote:
2017-11-30 11:46 GMT+02:00 mathieu stumpf guntz < psychoslave@culture-libre.org>:
Nobody suggest in no way to do license laundering nor to violates
Wiktionaries licence,
It's not suggestion, it's what Wikidata is already doing with Wikipedia,
despite the initial statement of Wikidata team[1] that it wouldn't do that because it's illegal :
/"Alexrk2, it is true that Wikidata under CC0 would not be allowed to import content from a Share-Alike data source. Wikidata does not plan to extract content out of Wikipedia at all. Wikidata will provide data that can be reused in the Wikipedias./" – Denny Vrandečić
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikidata#Is_CC_the_ right_license_for_data.3F
I think that the extent to which massive import without respecting
license of the source should be investigated properly by the Wikimedia legal team, or some qualified consultants.
In the mid time, based on its previous practises, it's clear that
promises of Wikidata team regarding respect of licenses can not be trusted. So even if they suggested that that kind of massive import won't be done, it wouldn't be enough.
This is another personal attack, and it's unnecessary and incorrect.
The imports from Wikipedia were done by the Wikidata community, not by Wikidata team.
It's too easy to speak in retrospect, but there were these plausible scenarios:
- Editors who strongly care about reliable sourcing, in the style of
English Wikipedia verifiability policies, are strongly opposed to importing data from Wikipedia, because by itself it's a self-reference and not a reliable source. If it would succeed, data would not be imported from Wikipedia, not because of licensing, but because of content quality. I remember attempts to do this, but evidently this is not what happened.
- Editors who strongly care about the prevention of license whitewashing
object to importing data from Wikipedia and prevent it. This also could happen, but it didn't.
- Editors who are good at writing bots or making a lot of manual edits and
love seeing Wikidata getting filled with data, import a lot of data. Like it or not, this happened.
Could anybody know in 2012 what would actually happen? I don't know. If you would have asked me then, I'd possibly guess that scenarios 1 and 2 are likelier, but now we know that that would be very naïve.
Judging by what happened in the past, I can suspect that data from Wiktionary will be imported anyway. Public domain or not, the bots people will find a way around licenses. It's a certain eventuality. The bigger questions are under what license will it be eventually stored, under what licenses will it be reused, and will this contribute to the growth of Free Knowledge. My intuition tells me that using more CC-BY-SA and less CC-0 will contribute more to Free Knowledge, but what do I know. _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/ wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/ wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe