Thanks for all the pointers, Molly, and for disclosing that it was you
for the sake of adding a bit more info to the discussion; you haven't
done anything wrong as far as I know, and I didn't feel comfortable
mentioning your IRC nick in case there were any confusion. I simply
didn't get a chance to look at that diff before you revdeleted it; it
was the only concrete evidence that I saw linked there for why
badmachine was kicked. I probably should have clicked on it
immediately. My bad.
I've apologized to you here and on Wikipediocracy, but apologies are
always worth doing directly and for as many to see as possible: I'm
very sorry for mistaking you for a WMF employee. I take full
responsibility for my words and actions. I hope you can forgive me.
To be clear, a WMF employee did mail Lila with "safety concerns." That
was obviously not Molly, and, ultimately, I don't think it's important
who it was. It just made me personally uncomfortable communicating
with WMF employees in any private setting. I'm hoping that will change
as we all begin to trust each other more. Even then, I have no plans
to discuss WMF matters of any sort with WMF employees; that's to
everyone's benefit IMO.
On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 12:41 PM, Molly White
Wil Sinclair <wllm@...> writes:
Thanks, I wasn't aware I could do this. I'm assuming that it would be
obvious who was an employee at Wikimedia in the log, too.
Indeed you can. If you navigate to
and enter the title
of the page in the "Target (title or user)" field, you can see
"GorillaWarfare (talk | contribs | block) changed visibility of a revision".
I was the one who deleted the revision in question. I'd like to clarify that
I'm not an employee of the WMF. I'm an administrator, and a member of the
Arbitration Committee, but my membership on that committee is by community
election. It is neither paid by nor decided by the WMF. The deletion of that
revision was done in my administrator, not arbitrator, capacity.
As for determining who is and is not an employee of the WMF, WMF employees
editing as employees (and not community members) tend to have "(WMF)" in
their usernames. If nothing else, you can check their userpages, where they
will mention if they are employees.
Of course, it is entirely on me. I knew that the
IRC channels weren't
logged, and that it was a bannable offense to log them (for those who
aren't familiar with IRC, this essentially means that you aren't
supposed to save conversations there; in most channels that's A-OK,
but on all of the most used wikipedia channels it seems to be
As some have already pointed out, it is in fact just fine to log Wikimedia
channels. It is the publishing of these logs (from channels that restrict
logging) that is considered to be a bannable offense.
There is a discussion about this issue there, as well. It can be
followed at the link I posted earlier. Here's the last page of the
discussion that includes the comment above:
In fact, I'd suggest you *do* begin logging your IRC communications. Had you
been logging, you would have been able to refer to your logs to review my
explanation of why the user in question is typically immediately banned from
Wikimedia-related IRC channels. You also would have been able to refer to
the conversation in which I pointed you to the revision deletion policy, and
the specific criterion under which I removed the revision. You would also
have remembered that you did not ask me for any more detail about the
relationship between Wikimedia-related IRC channels and Wikimedia projects
_Wikipedia.3F), about the IRC channel guidelines
, also linked from
the channel topic in #wikipedia-en) or expectations of channel operators
or about the revision itself and its contents.
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: