Wikimedia-l July 2004

wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org

40 participants
84 discussions

[Foundation-l] Projekt GALILEO (Wikipedia with Geographical information)
by Jakob Voss 22 Jul '04

22 Jul '04

You are not allowed to post to this mailing list, and your message has been automatically rejected. If you think that your messages are being rejected in error, contact the mailing list owner at foundation-l-owner(a)wikimedia.org. Subject: Projekt GALILEO (Wikipedia with Geographical information) From: Jakob Voss <gmane-user(a)nichtich.de> Date: Thu, 22 Jul 2004 11:39:52 +0200 To: foundation-l(a)wikipedia.org, wikide-l(a)wikipedia.org, vorstand(a)wikimedia.de Hi, As some of you already may have noticed there is the "First European Idea Competition of the Satellite Navigation" called "GALILEO Masters 2004" [1]. Stefan Richter announced the idea to participate. Only european companies are allowed so Wikimedia Germany or freiheit.com [2] (the company where Stefan Richter works) would apply. Deadline is Friday the 30th of this month. To participate you have to fill in a questionaire [3] and you may add up to two images. We already have most of the proposal and a discussion with collections of ideas [4] - the latter mostly in German but the proposal is the most important. Missing tasks: * We need the cooperation of Wikimedia Foundation and the community * Who should participate (the competition is aimed to small companies so maybe freiheit.com would be good choice for a cooperation)? * Formulating the missing answers * Perfecting all the answers * Two images for demonstration purpose (I drew [5] but some fictious screenshots may be more suasive) * Summarizing and translating the discussion and the ideas (mainly for us and later) Everybody is invited to participate until next wendsday (deadline). Please try to seperate discussion and proposals or summaries. We should have a conclusive concept before starting to implement anything. I am sure that we will have the most useful database of free annotated geographical data in two years! There are applications most of the normal internet or encyclopedia reader has not even dreamed of. Let's go for it! Jakob [1] http://www.galileo-masters.com [2] http://www.freiheit.com [3] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/GALILEO_Masters_2004/Questionaire [4] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:GALILEO_Masters_2004 [5] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:GALILEOArchitecture.png

2 1

[Foundation-l] Projekt GALILEO (Wikipedia with Geographical information)
by Jakob Voss 22 Jul '04

22 Jul '04

Hi, As some of you already may have noticed there is the "First European Idea Competition of the Satellite Navigation" called "GALILEO Masters 2004" [1]. Stefan Richter announced the idea to participate. Only european companies are allowed so Wikimedia Germany or freiheit.com [2] (the company where Stefan Richter works) would apply. Deadline is Friday the 30th of this month. To participate you have to fill in a questionaire [3] and you may add up to two images. We already have most of the proposal and a discussion with collections of ideas [4] - the latter mostly in German but the proposal is the most important. Missing tasks: * We need the cooperation of Wikimedia Foundation and the community * Who should participate (the competition is aimed to small companies so maybe freiheit.com would be good choice for a cooperation)? * Formulating the missing answers * Perfecting all the answers * Two images for demonstration purpose (I drew [5] but some fictious screenshots may be more suasive) * Summarizing and translating the discussion and the ideas (mainly for us and later) Everybody is invited to participate until next wendsday (deadline). Please try to seperate discussion and proposals or summaries. We should have a conclusive concept before starting to implement anything. I am sure that we will have the most useful database of free annotated geographical data in two years! There are applications most of the normal internet or encyclopedia reader has not even dreamed of. Let's go for it! Jakob [1] http://www.galileo-masters.com [2] http://www.freiheit.com [3] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/GALILEO_Masters_2004/Questionaire [4] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:GALILEO_Masters_2004 [5] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:GALILEOArchitecture.png

1 0

[Foundation-l] Re: Rethinking Meta (was- Wikiquote now has subdomains)
by Jakob Voss 22 Jul '04

22 Jul '04

Daniel Mayer wrote: > Meta in *particular* is there for multiproject and multilingual > coordination. How is that coordination going to happen on separate > wikis? Ray Saintonge wrote: > I too oppose balkanization of Meta and other projects. People would > certainly feel more at ease working in their own language groups, but > always at the risk of not seeing what others are doing. Once the > languages are separated there would never be any incentive to get them > back together again, even if the right software were developed. Full ack. The German Wikimedia Association settled at meta and not at de.wikipedia because we do not want to be seperated. We startet to write short abstracts for german pages at meta. Naming problems can be solved. For instance [[Merchandising]] could point to [[Merchandising (en)]] and [[Merchandising (de)]]. What is missing is the possibility to change the interface's language but not dividing the pages. Jakob

1 0

[Foundation-l] USPS
by Brian 21 Jul '04

21 Jul '04

Jimbo, There are probably a dozen military bases in Germany, and the USPS can be used by anyone who has access to getting on a base - that will be your problem (military ID). As far as Evian goes - they send it on a container ship. It only takes about 10-15 days to reach the states =) You can do this with DHL if you like, but it's still very expensive for the consumer. Last year I sent a 68 pound monitor to myself from San Francisco and I believe your quote of $500 was about right (i used USPS in the end). I will be out of the country from August 13-21 for the Olympics so keep that in mind. I may also be moving back to the states in mid-September. Brian

1 0

[Foundation-l] Re: foundation-l Digest, Vol 4, Issue 17
by Brian 21 Jul '04

21 Jul '04

Anthere, I am stationed in Naples, Italy on a US Navy base. I just ran over to our post office (USPS) and here are the shipping options to a standard address in Florida: 1) Maximum length + girth = 108 inches. Weight 70 pounds. If sent via Space Available price will be $25.43 2) Maximum length + girth = 130 inches. Weight 70 pounds. If sent normally $65.34 (this is considered oversize) 3) #2 + priority, $67.15 My base has a standard italian address available (we are connected to the international airport here) for possible shipping from France to here, so those prices would need to be checked (they SHOULD be minimal as well). I am also willing to pick up the USPS shipping charges as they are minimal (including insurance). But, these servers could be huge =) Do you have the dimensions? Brian

3 3

[Foundation-l] All Wikis can block logged in users now.
by Ronny Raschkowan 21 Jul '04

21 Jul '04

Hello! I just have added a line to the CommonSettings.php (and deleted the individual lines at InitialseSettings.php) allowing each wiki to block logged in users. Please note that whilst this feature is technically available, this doesn't mean you necessarily have the right to use it, because there might be policies on your wiki restricting this. You can block a logged in user like you would block an IP, typing in an username instead of an IP. Sincerly yours, Fire

1 0

[Foundation-l] HP Hardware donation
by Anthere 21 Jul '04

21 Jul '04

Though it is not entirely fixed, here are some news of a hardware donation made to Wikimedia Foundation ------------- An employee at HP in France has contacted us, offering us free hardware. This is a no-strings-attached donation from a few friends at HP who want to support Wikipedia. They reserve the right to mention this donation. The machines offered are:* One 4U 6 CPU Xeon 750 with 1GB of RAM* One 4 CPU Xeon 700 with 2GB of RAM* One 6U 8 CPU Xeon 900 with 16GB of RAM and 2 SCSI drive max (which might work as a web server box immediately)* 3 Celeron 600 1U with 20G/ide and 128M of memory. There were a lot of discussion on irc these days about these servers and many people got involved to determine what would be best doing. First we decided to accept the offer :-) The 6 servers will be picked up 2 french contributors, Med and Cereal Killer on thursday. There will be a small shipping cost from Grenoble (the city where the servers come from) to Paris, which will be taken by the WMF. Med will install the Celerons. They will have a memory upgrade (the WMF will pay for this). Yann has found us a hosting company ready to host the three squids for free, http://lost-oasis.fr/ :-) The three bigger servers will be shipped from Paris to Florida. We are currently trying to find cheap shipping cost. Any help/suggestion for *cheap* shipping is most welcome. We'd prefer a company with good credentials, but there is no requirement in terms of shipping speed, so we might be able to find a good price. Please, help us if you know a good shipping solution. ----------- I will set a page on the future wikimediafoundation website (http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/WMF/Main Page) to begin listing corporations helping Wikimedia projects. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers!

2 2

[Foundation-l] Wikimedia Foundation website meeting
by Angela 20 Jul '04

20 Jul '04

On Saturday 24 July 2004, there will be a meeting in the #wikimedia IRC channel (irc://irc.freenode.net/wikimedia) regarding the Wikimedia Foundation website (http://wikimediafoundation.org). The meeting will start at 21:00 UTC. All are welcome to attend. There is no requirement to sign up for the meeting, but the Board do reserve the right to remove anyone causing undue disruption. A log of the meeting will be published on Meta on Sunday. Please see http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Foundation_website_meeting,_July_2004 for further details, including a draft agenda. Angela.

1 0

[Foundation-l] splitting meta in sub domains
by Anthere 20 Jul '04

20 Jul '04

Translation for french people Erik propose de faire une collection de sous domaines pour meta. Il soutient que nous serons plus efficace dans notre collaboration globale en b�n�ficiant d'un sous site personnel, chacun restant d�sormais bien gentillement dans son domaine perso. Les pages de d�cision et r�gles communes pourront �tre traduites. Anthere n'est pas d'accord et pr�f�rerait que le language de l'interface puisse �tre choisi dans les pr�f�rences, et un syst�me de navigation entre langues mis au point. Erik Moeller wrote: > Anthere- > >>Meta is the only place where we can really meet, and find information >>that someone else left. > > > Can you give me a single example where splitting Meta by subdomain would > do any harm in bringing people together? I would like to move this > discussion from the general, emotional "Don't split us up!" to the > specific, rational "This is where it would cause problems" level. What > recent policy discussion or vote would have been harmed by this approach? http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Membership_fees and related pages A lot of it was the result of online discussions, more by email, and more on meta. I cannot really figure spreading the result of these on 150 subwikis, and I cannot really figure following discussion about it on 150 subwikis either. A central place is the only option. A central place where everyone is allowed to give his opinion. > Let's take the "Stewards" discussion and vote as an example. The whole > discussion was mostly English as was the voting page. If we used > subdomains, we could have made it a requirement that the page be > translated into the main languages before we vote. We could have > aggregated the votes from the different language Wikimedias so that each > community could express their preferences in their language. We could have > translated important arguments from the discussion in realtime (in the > form of localized "pro" and "cons" lists, for example). We could have Did we ? > This is a lot better than having a single page with the occasional piece > of untranslated French or Japanese between a couple of participants. In > that case, the main part of the page is English - excluding those who > don't speak it - and some parts of the discussion are not - excluding > those who don't speak that language. It's a lose-lose situation. Spreading the discussion in 150 subwikis is the lose-lose situation. >>In my experience, it does bring people together, provided that you >>welcome the interaction. > > > I can't interact with someone whose language I do not speak, unless > someone translates it for me. A Wikipedia-style setup facilitates that. No. You will not be able to interact with the others in both cases, but in the current case, you will at least see that they make effort to communicate. Or you at least give them the opportunity to try. When they are parked in a submetawiki, you will not even know they tried to communicate. >>Plus, there are japanese and chinese people currently over there. We >>have Tomos, Suisui, Britty etc... > > > Exactly - the people on Meta are mostly the ones who speak some amount of > English. Someone who doesn't speak any English won't even understand the > user interface. Correct. Then what about fixing the interface so that we could choose the interface language ? This would be the win-win situation, not packing people in another place. We could also find a way to navigate between languages. >>This is what is happening on the multinlingual mailing lists, because >>each time someone DARE putting a word in a language different than >>english, he is severely told that "of course, he could write in english, >>because really, no one can understand him". > > > First, I must remind you that my main objection in the last debate on this > matter was using a different language in order to exclude others from a > certain comment. This is a completely separate issue, and I would have the > same objection on Meta. > Second, if you want to reach the *largest number* of people, you should > either use English or make sure that what you say gets translated into > English. That should be very obvious, no? It would be helpful if you could > acknowledge this simple point. I acknowledge this point. But this is not a valid argument to technically separate people. > This is about giving non-English projects a larger voice instead of > relying on multilingual people like you to act as mouthpieces for those > who don't speak English. Ah, the mouthpiece is back :-) You have not been much on meta and mediawiki these days Erik. Or you would have seen that now two french people are now part of the developers, and on meta, people like Villy, Looxix, Yann just to cite a few, are very regularly participating. And we definitly do not always agree. They participate to wikimedia wide issues by being on *common* mailing list, and *common meta*. Park us on separate meta, and on separate mailing list, our interaction with you all will stop. It just make no sense to try to maintain most pages on meta in 150 languages. What makes our force is to make them together. It would be great that they are translated, and I intend to have a french version of the wikimediafoundation website the more I can. However, there are just not enough people interested to do the translation. This is a structural issue we can not go against, however hard we try. Just like there is a Wikipedia community for > every language, there should be a Wikimedia community for each. Once you > have something like ja.wikimedia.org, the creation of a Japanese Wikimedia > chapter becomes more likely as well because people will find it far easier > to interact when there is no constant interference by what is *effectively > indistinguishable from random noise* to them. The problem of creating > project-wide policies is addressed through board review and voting > standards. > > It may be a good idea to put this issue to a Wikimedia-wide vote if we > fail to reach consensus. > > Regards, > > Erik Ah voting ! Yes, sure. Well, you are welcome :-) But I would be happy that this vote is not a 3 days sampling this time, but really a wikimedia-wide vote. With say 1 month of discussion, translation of all relevant argument in all major languages, and at least 2 week long vote. My, this would really be a major decision for our future as a global community. It deserves that. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Vote for the stars of Yahoo!'s next ad campaign! http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/yahoo/votelifeengine/

4 3

[Foundation-l] Re: Rethinking Meta (was- Wikiquote now has subdomains)
by Anthere 19 Jul '04

19 Jul '04

Erik Moeller wrote: > Anthere- > > >>The reason of wikimediafoundation site is to present a unified front to >>outside. It should be clean, with no dispute, and it should be >>consistent with the Foundation frame of mind. It should also contain a >>whole bunch of data, which should not be modified too easily by anyone >>(like financial issues). > > > This can be done using rights management and page approval. Having a > combined wiki helps in collaborating as a community on matters such as > press releases and general news. Right management do not exist, but I think they could be very useful here. >>Now, I remember very well your CPOV proposition, which aimed at strongly >>limiting access to meta, by requesting that people identify themselves >>by real names to have the right for their edits to be claimed >>trustworthy, when the edits of non real people were labelled "untrusted >>or non representative of a so-called community point of view" by default. > > > Wow. This is a gross misrepresentation of what I said. I am frankly > flabbergasted. See: > http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Community_point_of_view > > In the *discussion* I suggested that *personal essays which deviate from > the CPOV* (such as our favorite troll pages) should be signed, and that > unsigned pages could be refactored or removed. This was a compromise > proposal towards you to not have to completely exclude such pages. Next > time you "remember something very well", you may want to look it up first. Tatata, we already fought enough on this Erik. You wrote to me : But if you want to write a paper or essay on a subject related to Wikipedia, and do not want it to be edited into CPOV form, then you should have the courage and conviction to stand for it with your real name. Alternatively, put it on your user page. -Eloquence 13:28, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC) Given the number of editors who accept to edit under their real name, and given the risks associated with using our real name on the net, ***requesting*** from people to sign their comments and participation with their real name in order to have those allowed in the main space is just something bad. We are allowed to write fabulous article under ip, why would not we be allowed to write what we think of Wikipedia under the same procedure ? I say, if we request from editors on meta to sign their participation with their real name, then we'll cause dramatic drop down in collaboration. >>This CPOV proposition will have to happen over my dead body :-) > > > Fortunately, Wikimedia is democratically governed. > > Regards, > > Erik Oh, yes, thank god, it is democratically governed :-) ------ Btw, how are the new projects building going on ? ant

2 1

← Newer
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
Older →

2024

2023

2022

2021

2020

2019

2018

2017

2016

2015

2014

2013

2012

2011

2010

2009

2008

2007

2006

2005

2004

Wikimedia-l July 2004