Hi,
At the same time, if we highlight the cultural heritage of Russia, we are
not just highlighting the volunteer work but Russia's national achievements and imperialism. The participation can be exploited as part of Russian propaganda even if the organizers or Wikimedia movement doesn't mean it so.
Let us find the red line then about when to bar volunteers from a country to participate in WLM. Shall we exclude the USA which has invaded middle eastern countries many times in the past and still has strong forces there or any NATO countries which left Afghanistan giving it back to the Taliban who had destroyed the world heritage site of Bamiyan in the past? Shall we exclude China because of its policy towards Taiwan or Tibet or shall we exclude Turkiye because of its engagement with the Kurds and Syrians in the recent past or Saudi Arabia because of the bombardments in Yemen? Shall we exclude both Israel and Palestine because of what is happening there? Shall we exclude some of the African countries because of their civil wars which have destroyed the livelihoods of many people there? Or shall we exclude all the past colonial nations of Europe like Britain, France, Nederlands, Belgium, Spain, Germany, Denmark, Italy etc. which have committed horrible atrocities to more than half of the world and looted their culture and heritage to store in their museums and still not paid reparation or even asked for forgiveness? Or shall we exclude the countries participating in the two World Wars or countries with nuclear warheads? There are allies on all sides, shall we exclude them too? I guess, if we start excluding, there will be almost no countries in the world left to participate in WLM.
We all are strongly against any war and invasion and we all have deep empathy towards the people of Ukraine for their hardships in these difficult times, but we also have to be empathetic to other parts of the world which are facing hardships from wars from the present or from the past and not forget about them or their lost culture. WLM is a photographic competition to preserve built heritage from around the world digitally, let's keep it that way and not make it a forum for geopolitical debates. We need not want to open up a Pandora's box and fight with each other because our governments are doing so.
Regards, Bodhisattwa
On Wed, 14 Dec 2022 at 11:43, Kimmo Virtanen kimmo.virtanen@gmail.com wrote:
Geopolitical differences and conflicts among governments should never be a
factor to sanction and obstruct volunteer activities from those nations. We need to remind ourselves that the government and the Wikimedia volunteers or affiliates of a country are different entities and the Wikimedia communities cannot be held responsible for the action of their governments. Russian heritage photographers have nothing to do with the Ukraine war and they have equal rights to have their photographs compete and judged like the other participating countries.
Interpretation is more complex. Russia is destroying Ukraine's landmarks and cultural heritage as part of its methods to wage war.
For example, they have been burning the archives of the Stalin era human rights crimes. Another highly problematic thing is that Russia is systematically stealing cultural heritage and other properties from the areas which they have occupied. For example, they stole scientific equipment from Tšernobyl or art from the museums.
At the same time, if we highlight the cultural heritage of Russia, we are not just highlighting the volunteer work but Russia's national achievements and imperialism. The participation can be exploited as part of Russian propaganda even if the organizers or Wikimedia movement doesn't mean it so.
Br, -- Kimmo Virtanen, Zache (organizer of WLM Finland)
On Tue, Dec 13, 2022 at 8:46 PM Bodhisattwa bodhisattwa.rgkmc@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Rubén,
I find the decision of WLM international team completely reasonable to not exclude Russian photographs from the competition.
Geopolitical differences and conflicts among governments should never be a factor to sanction and obstruct volunteer activities from those nations. We need to remind ourselves that the government and the Wikimedia volunteers or affiliates of a country are different entities and the Wikimedia communities cannot be held responsible for the action of their governments. Russian heritage photographers have nothing to do with the Ukraine war and they have equal rights to have their photographs compete and judged like the other participating countries.
Also, WLM is not only a photography competiton, it's a way to digitally preserve heritage. Digital conversation has inverse relationship with destruction of war.
Apart from Ukraine, there are conflicts, invasions and wars happening in the Middle East, Africa, Asia Pacific and other regions. There had been many in the past and surely there will be more in the future. WLM need not have to be involved in all these geopolitical complexities and take sides, rather if it can bridge gaps among people who are in conflicting countries by including them all, it can rather play that significant role instead of excluding and dividing them further.
Regards, Bodhisattwa
On Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 18:33 Rodelar rodelarwiki@gmail.com wrote:
Hi everyone,
The Wiki Loves Monuments international team has been asked if photographs from Russia should be allowed or excluded from participating in this year's international contest. We have been in contact with the organising teams of Wiki Loves Monuments from Ukraine and from Russia to discuss this and to find a solution.
We greatly appreciate that the team from Ukraine has organized the local edition of the competition while there is war in their country! We understand that there are reservations against seeing images from Ukraine and Russia presented side by side in the galleries of nominated or winning pictures.
The volunteer team organising Wiki Loves Monuments Russia emphasizes to have no ties to the Russian government or the Russian Wikimedia affiliate. They are submitting the 10 finalist images to the international final round of Wiki Loves Monuments 2022, but the occupied areas, including Crimea and Sevastopol, have been excluded from the Wiki Loves monuments campaign. Also, in Russia there is no freedom of panorama for works of art. This excludes, in fact, any images of monuments and statues erected since World War II, and which for example glorify the war, from being legally uploaded to Wikimedia Commons.
If images from Russia are excluded because of the war in Ukraine, this could, without being based on a rule for the competition, set a precedent for other territories where there is war around the world. Rules would have to found, before deciding case by case, if a country should not be allowed to send its nominations to Wiki Loves Monuments international.
With these considerations in mind, the WLM organising team does not see a reason to exclude the submission of Russian finalists images to the international final round.
On behalf of the WLM 2022 organising team,
Rubén Ojeda
International jury coordinator, Wiki Loves Monuments 2022 _______________________________________________ Wiki Loves Monuments mailing list To unsubscribe send an email to wikilovesmonuments-leave@lists.wikimedia.org http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org
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