FYI making main stream media
http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2016-02-15/wikimedia-foundation-aims-to-take-o...
On 14 February 2016 at 00:49, Anthony Cole ahcoleecu@gmail.com wrote:
Anne, we're talking about almost the same thing, but not exactly. I say "advised" you say "consulted". "Consulted" implies soliciting or expecting some kind of response or engagement - probably approval/disapproval/critique/input. "Advised" means they got the memo. I think "advised" is enough, and if the board wants more engagement, they can initiate it - presuming the notification is clear and comprehensive, of course.
Anthony Cole
On Sat, Feb 13, 2016 at 10:37 AM, Risker risker.wp@gmail.com wrote:
Well, I'm not sure about that, Anthony. By "consulted", I would mean something to the effect of "We're looking at applying to XX for a grant
of
$YYY to do ZZZ" and asking the Board if they would be likely to agree to accept such a grant if the application is successful. The grant application, evaluation and approval process is costly in both time and resources, and for both the applicant and the grantmaker. Being informed that a grant has been approved sounds more like a fait accompli situation for the Board - they look petty and ungrateful if they say no, even if
they
don't think it was a reasonable grant application. In this case, we're only dealing with $250,000. What if this was $1 million? $10 million?
I think it is healthier for everyone if the Board is properly consulted before the application is submitted. (And again, I note that we don't
know
how much was actually requested in this case, only what was granted.)
Risker/Anne
On 12 February 2016 at 21:23, Anthony Cole ahcoleecu@gmail.com wrote:
Anne, regarding:
"Since the Board must approve acceptance of any donations over $100,000 USD, it seems to be obvious that they should be consulted and possibly should actively approve any grant applications where the dollar value sought is higher than that amount."
I'm not sure that the board should be *consulted* ahead of such applications' or should prior-approve all such applications. That
seems a
bit like micromanagement. But it makes sense to me for the board to be *advised *of such applications and when they're being actively contemplated or prepared.
Anthony Cole
On Fri, Feb 12, 2016 at 9:11 PM, Risker risker.wp@gmail.com wrote:
I'm sorry to hear that you feel this way, Gerard. I personally would
like
to feel more assured that the WMF is looking into the longer future
and
actively plannning for the day that donations no longer support a
large
staff doing lots of things.
I am concerned today that the team specifically tasked to work
closely
with
so many elements of the community has lost 7% of its staff, and 30%
of
its
leaders, in a single week. This should be a concern in any
organization.
With respect to the Knight grant - I know that many times grant applications are made for considerably more than is given, and I am interested to know how much the WMF requested in the first place. I
would
also like to know whether or not the Board was formally advised of
the
request before it was submitted. Since the Board must approve
acceptance
of any donations over $100,000 USD, it seems to be obvious that they
should
be consulted and possibly should actively approve any grant
applications
where the dollar value sought is higher than that amount. I don't
believe
the current policies require advance approval or even advance
notification,
though.
Risker/Anne
On 12 February 2016 at 03:54, Gerard Meijssen <
gerard.meijssen@gmail.com
wrote:
Hoi, I am not complaining. I point out that all this huha does not get
us
anywhere. I am not afraid to give an opinion and I am not afraid to
be
a
contrarian when I think it makes sense. Yes, things happened that
were
not
beautiful. They are not what upset me. What upsets me is that
people
like
Siko and Anna are leaving. Because they are part of "my" Wikimedia Foundation. What upsets me is that I routinely use Magnus's tool
and
process hundreds of thousands of records and am to understand that
official
query is stunted and does not allow for this "because it was not in
the
design" and it is then pointed out that it takes money to solve
this...
My point is that baying for blood is not what helps us forward.
What
I
do
know is that when sheer negativity is not coupled with an ability
to
stop
and move forward, we will get in a downward spiral. I fault Pine
for
not
being able to stop. What I wish for is for people like Anna and
Siko
and
money for our environment and not for an endowment. Thanks, GerardM
On 12 February 2016 at 09:35, Michel Vuijlsteke <wikipedia@zog.org
wrote:
Gerard,
I was waiting for this mail. For me personally, your complaining
is
achieving exactly the opposite of what you think.
It sounds as if you'd much rather prefer to stick your head in
the
sand
and
hope things will blow over. "Move along, nothing to see here --
oh
look!
something positive over there!" is not going to solve anything.
Michel
On 12 February 2016 at 09:24, Gerard Meijssen <
gerard.meijssen@gmail.com
wrote:
> Hoi, > Pine as you are talking about "self inflicting wounds" I take
it
you
are
> not talking in your personal capacity. When is it enough for
you?
When
are > you going to talk about positive things, things that will move
us
forward. > Why ask for blood and more blood? What is it that you hope to
achieve?
> > Who do you represent in this unending litany of negativity and
what
have
> you achieved in this way? When Lila was engaged in her role,
she
was
to
> direct in a different direction and she is doing that. You may
not
like
it > and that is ok. > Thanks, > GerardM > > On 12 February 2016 at 08:43, Pine W wiki.pine@gmail.com
wrote:
> > > Dariusz, thanks for continuing to engage here. Besides the
good
questions > > that others have asked, I'll add a few: > > > > 1. If the Knowledge Engine is such an important project, why
is
it
not
> > mentioned in > >
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_Annual_Plan/2015-16
> ? > > > > 2. I realize that as a percentage of the WMF budget, $250k
is a
> relatively > > small number. As others have said, this is not a reason for
opacity
about > > it, nor a reason for not having a conversation with the
community
about
> > something so strategically important as a decision to explore
the
> question > > of "Would users go to Wikipedia if it were an open channel
beyond
an
> > encyclopedia?" It's one thing to have a blue-sky exercise
thinking
about > > possibilities, and another thing to take a $250k step in that direction, > > especially without consulting the community. > > > > 3. I am getting tired about seeing bad news in general about
WMF
> > governance, planning, and turnover. I am curious how you plan
to
address > > those issues. Like you, I would rather that we be talking
about
our
> > movement plans for the next 10 years. However, it's difficult
to
have
> those > > conversations when WMF is making so many self-inflicted
wounds.
The
> recent > > round of resignations is of respectable people from the WMF
staff
is
> making > > the situation that much more concerning and that much more
difficult
to
> > recover from. It seems to me that WMF leadership has lost
control
of
this > > situation, and I'd like to hear what the recovery plan is.
Personally,
I > > feel that we need leadership that can build good
relationships
with
the
> > staff and community, is transparent by default, and is
capable
of
> restoring > > the credibility of the organization's planning, execution,
and
goodwill. > I > > think that we may need new leadership to make that happen. I
am
> interested > > to hear your thoughts. > > > > Pine > > > > > > > > On Thu, Feb 11, 2016 at 7:32 PM, Dariusz Jemielniak <
darekj@alk.edu.pl
> > > wrote: > > > > > 11.02.2016 10:23 PM "SarahSV" sarahsv.wiki@gmail.com
napisał(a):
> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > Hi > > > > Dariusz, > > > > > > > > T > > > > he grant application doesn't restrict the search engine
to
Wikimedia > > > projects. It says that the "Knowledge Engine by Wikipedia
[is
a]
system > > for > > > discovering reliable and trustworthy public information on
the
> Internet. > > > > > > My understanding is that the top range could potentially be
all
> > open/public > > > resources, but this is the far stretched total goal, and
still
not
a
> > > general search engine of all content including commercial
one.
> > > > > > And a rrasonable realistic outcome can be just improving
our
searches
> > > across projects. > > > > > > I can't comment on the initial ideas or goals, as I was not
on
the
> Board > > > before August 2015, but this is what I understand we build
now.
> > > > > > . > > > > > > > > The document says the "Search Engine by Wikipedia" budget
for
> 2015–2016 > > > ($2.4 million) was approved by the board. Can you point us
to
which
> > board > > > meeting approved it and what was discussed there? > > > > > > > > > > I dont recall this specifically, and I'm going to elude
this
question
> by > > > going to sleep (and hoping someone better informed may
pick).
> > > > > > Good night! > > > > > > Dj > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines > > > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > > <mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org
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