Hi Pete,
Philippe is on vacation, so I'm forwarding this to Rachel.
Pine On Apr 22, 2015 11:59 PM, "Pete Forsyth" peteforsyth@gmail.com wrote:
Philippe, can you address what you were talking about here last fall -- was the draft feature, and the way it directed new contributors toward the Articles for Creation process, the thing you alluded to, that WMF did in response to ACTRIAL?
If so -- has there been any study of whether its intended outcomes panned out? If not -- could you outline what you meant by "[WMF] proposed and built a set of tools to directly address that problem without compromising the core value of openness"?
Pete [[User:Peteforsyth]]
On Mon, Sep 1, 2014 at 5:06 PM, Pete Forsyth peteforsyth@gmail.com wrote:
I hope that's not the feature Philippe meant, but maybe. For my clients and students I think it's generally caused more confusion than it's
solved,
since now they have an additional layer of bureaucracy to navigate (AFC). Is there any data suggesting that's been a net improvement for new users?
Pete On Sep 1, 2014 4:38 PM, "Risker" risker.wp@gmail.com wrote:
Wasn't the creation of the DRAFT namespace at least in part a response
to
concerns raised at ACTRIAL, in particular new, poorly developed articles showing up in mainspace?
Risker/Anne
On 1 September 2014 19:08, Joe Decker joedecker@gmail.com wrote:
This, to the best of my knowledge, represents the entirety of the
WMF's
response to ACTRIAL. To the extent that there was additional feedback given, it was not given at WP:ACTRIAL, nor any other venue I am aware
of.
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30208
--Joe
On Mon, Sep 1, 2014 at 3:44 PM, Todd Allen toddmallen@gmail.com
wrote:
That's the issue I cited above. You haven't heard more complaints,
because
the complaint was pointless the first time and took a massive effort
to
produce.
The underlying issue isn't fixed. We're still drowning in crap and
spam
from people who never have the slightest intent of editing
helpfully,
and
those who are newbies who genuinely want to help but need guidance
get
caught in the crossfire aimed at the vandals and spammers. It is
relatively
rare that when a genuinely new editor's first edit is a creation, it
is
the
creation of an appropriate article on a workable subject, and that's normally more by dumb luck than them having actual knowledge that
they
should do it.
So, consider that a complaint. The proposed fix didn't work, and
most
people at the time didn't figure it would work, but it was clearly
the
best
we were going to get.
On Mon, Sep 1, 2014 at 4:20 PM, Philippe Beaudette < pbeaudette@wikimedia.org
wrote:
> On Sep 1, 2014, at 8:45 AM, Todd Allen toddmallen@gmail.com
wrote:
> > That's contradicted by, among other things, ACTRIAL as mentioned
above.
The > en.wp community came to a clear consensus for a major change,
and
the
WMF
> shrugged and said "Nah, rather not."
That's... Not exactly what I remember happening there. What I
remember
was
that a pretty good number (~500) of enwiki community members came
together
and agreed on a problem, and one plan for how to fix it and asked
the
WMF
to implement it. The WMF evaluated it, and saw a threat to a basic
project
value. WMF then asked "what's the problem you're actually trying
to
solve?", and proposed and built a set of tools to directly address
that
problem without compromising the core value of openness. And it
seems
to
have worked out pretty well because I haven't heard a ton of
complaints
about that problem since.
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