I am not sure it would qualify as a public statement rather than a sentence
taken and quoted out of context from a closed meeting - in other words, it
was not made at a public, accessible location, rather at a closed meeting
(with limited places, an entrance fee, etc.). While there are published
notes, the apparent quote is not present in them, and I would not be
surprised if the person in question was merely making a point to foster
debate.
For what its worth, rules like the one at the meeting can in theory foster
open debate on controversial topics (see e.g. the [[Chatham House Rule]])
and we should respect them. I for one would be sad if we were not able to
experiment with new models that foster open debate (while still maintaining
a level of transparency).
Best regards,
Bence
On Mon, Apr 7, 2014 at 2:25 PM, Fæ <faewik(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Michael,
Wikimedia UK is in the fortunate position that due to my original work
with Peter on governance, you and all trustees on your board have
signed a trustee code committing them to the Nolan principles. This
makes it obvious that if any of the UK Trustees that made public
statements of this sort (this was a publicly funded workshop with
public minutes) they would be required to resign their position.
Making public personal attacks against community members I would say
could easily be a resigning matter too.
Other chapters are not so fortunate to have such a professionally
created body of bureaucracy.
I am disappointed, for reasons already expressed in this thread.
Fae
On 7 April 2014 13:09, Michael Maggs <Michael(a)maggs.name> wrote:
I am really saddened by the incessant demands
that the community needs
public investigations, heads to roll, public apologies and
so on. I am
also saddened by repeated demands that specific community members state
publicly whether they do or do not agree with something allegedly said by a
third party, but restated shorn of all context.
One would have thought that we would all have learned from history that
witch
hunts never turn out well, but apparently not. It’s almost as if
the community has a death wish and has far greater interest in internecine
warfare than in actively attempting to work together to further our mission
(which we all agree on, surely?).
I was not myself at the governance workshop, and have no idea who said
that, if
anyone, but I do find it odd that Fae would find it necessary to
demand of a trustee whether he does or does not accept the alleged quote as
a “philosophy”.
Would it help if I, as WMUK chair, said that such a “philosophy” would
be anathema
to us? No, that probably won’t help, as it is an entirely
self-evident statement. Answering direct questions, unfortunately, does not
make much difference to those who find witch hunts fun.
Michael
On 7 Apr 2014, at 12:27, Fæ <faewik(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> Chris, rather than again[1] using school-boy politics by defaming
> people you don't like with personal attacks, please read Tomasz'
> request: "the idea that chapters can "fuck the community" is
> absolutely unacceptable and should by rejected by all chapters
> immediately".
>
> Now, show some leadership and answer a simple direct question. Do you,
> or do you not as a trustee of Wikimedia UK and the person that was
> responsible for leading this costly workshop, reject the philosophy of
> "fuck the community"?
>
> I have asked for the person that made this statement to come forward
> and explain themselves. If they cannot, then they must realise they
> can no longer claim to be accountable to the community and neither can
> their board.
>
> Links:
> 1.
http://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Commons:Administrators/Reque…
> Fae
>
> On 7 April 2014 12:10, Chris Keating <chriskeatingwiki(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
>> I'd certainly hope not. One of the
ground rules for the workshop was
that
>> individual contributions were made on a
confidential and
non-attributable
>> basis.
>>
>> This was exactly because we wanted people to speak freely and not worry
>> about a witch-hunt on an email list if a couple of trolls got hold of
some
>> out-of-context quotes.
>>
>> Chris
>> On 7 Apr 2014 11:56, "Fæ" <faewik(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Steffen, the Wikimedia movement expects board members on Wikimedia
>>> organizations to be fulfilling their role as representatives of our
>>> movement. If you misquoted please explain that this is the case.
>>>
>>> As at a public workshop that cost the movement a significant amount of
>>> our donor's money to pay for, there is no reason for secrecy about
>>> this, everyone there is accountable for their time spent at that
>>> workshop. The quote has not been challenged. It would benefit us all
>>> to hear why this was said and to be open to questions about their
>>> leadership role, from the person that made this public statement.
>>>
>>> Personally, if an elected or appointed board level member of a chapter
>>> is making public statements like this, I do not want them representing
>>> our movement if they are going to hide away in secret when asked about
>>> it. You know who they are, please ask them to speak for themselves
>>> rather than relying on you and your colleagues to run interference or
>>> take this story on tangents.
>>>
>>> Fae
>>>
>>> On 7 April 2014 11:42, Steffen Prößdorf <
steffen.proessdorf(a)wikimedia.de>
>>> wrote:
>>>> Hi Folks,
>>>>
>>>> please do not pick out that single point and overestimate it.
>>>> I have not mentioned this to dupe anyone, but only to illustrate the
>>>> conflict of alignment or the objective of the chapters. The opposing
>>>> opinions are represented by several Wikimedians on both sides,
please do
>>>> not harp on this single quote.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Steffen
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 2014-04-07 12:33 GMT+02:00 Fæ <faewik(a)gmail.com>om>:
>>>>
>>>>>> If that is indeed the case, the comment to "fuck the
community"
would
>>> fit
>>>>>> quite well in the divisions that /some/ people are alleging
exist.
>>>>>> Tomasz
>>>>>
>>>>> Could whoever is being quoted as saying this please come forward
>>>>> publicly and explain what they meant?
>>>>>
>>>>> If this was anything more than a bad joke, then I would expect
someone
>>>>> who made views like this,
while representing our community of
>>>>> volunteers to be asked by their Board to resign their elected or
>>>>> appointed position. I urge those who were at the meeting, to
>>>>> demonstrate appropriate community leadership and encourage the
person
>>>>> they know to have expressed
this viewpoint to come forward and
explain
>>>>> themselves in their own
words.
>>>>>
>>>>> Fae
>>> --
>>> faewik(a)gmail.com
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae
>>>
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>
> --
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> Personal and confidential, please do not circulate or re-quote.
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