Is it true that {{header|previous= |next= }} must be filled in manually for each chapter? Couldn't this be automated in the same way as ProofreadPage links "<" and ">" in a linear sequence, if you provide the table of contents in a central place? If that TOC contained the page number intervals and sections, everything in the chapter page could be automated, right?
Is it true that full text search leads to to the Page: and not to the main namespace page that transcludes it? And that the former has no link to the latter?
If I search "the right understanding of the machine", I find http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page:The_Kinematics_of_Machinery.djvu/24 but I don't find http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Kinematics_of_Machinery/Introduction
How could that be improved? Is another Extension necessary?
This feature exists already, if you use <pages header=1 /> The sequence of chapters of a book is defined on the index page.
See for example : http://fr.wikisource.org/wiki/Pierrot_%28Contes_de_la_b%C3%A9casse%29
See also http://fr.wikisource.org/wiki/Utilisateur:ThomasV/headers for a comprehensive demonstration of what can be done with headers
Lars Aronsson a écrit :
Is it true that {{header|previous= |next= }} must be filled in manually for each chapter? Couldn't this be automated in the same way as ProofreadPage links "<" and ">" in a linear sequence, if you provide the table of contents in a central place? If that TOC contained the page number intervals and sections, everything in the chapter page could be automated, right?
Is it true that full text search leads to to the Page: and not to the main namespace page that transcludes it? And that the former has no link to the latter?
If I search "the right understanding of the machine", I find http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page:The_Kinematics_of_Machinery.djvu/24 but I don't find http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Kinematics_of_Machinery/Introduction
How could that be improved? Is another Extension necessary?
the previous / next mechanism is normally no longe used on Pages with page numbering, It is used on pages were the link is text, e g. the name of the next or previous poem, or the name of the previous or next chapter (when there is a title not a number) here a poem example: http://de.wikisource.org/wiki/Malerin_Klugschnack
Before the proofread 2 (ThomasV) mechanism we used this mechanism for page numbering to, and there a some older projects, which aren't converted up to now, due to some irrigations in the pr2 extension about user rights.
greetings joergens.mi
2010/5/10 Lars Aronsson lars@aronsson.se
Is it true that {{header|previous= |next= }} must be filled in manually for each chapter? Couldn't this be automated in the same way as ProofreadPage links "<" and ">" in a linear sequence, if you provide the table of contents in a central place? If that TOC contained the page number intervals and sections, everything in the chapter page could be automated, right?
Is it true that full text search leads to to the Page: and not to the main namespace page that transcludes it? And that the former has no link to the latter?
If I search "the right understanding of the machine", I find http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page:The_Kinematics_of_Machinery.djvu/24 but I don't find http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Kinematics_of_Machinery/Introduction
How could that be improved? Is another Extension necessary?
-- Lars Aronsson (lars@aronsson.se) Aronsson Datateknik - http://aronsson.se
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
Michael Jörgens wrote:
the previous / next mechanism is normally no longe used on Pages with page numbering, It is used on pages were the link is text, e g. the name of the next or previous poem, or the name of the previous or next chapter (when there is a title not a number) here a poem example: http://de.wikisource.org/wiki/Malerin_Klugschnack
Exactly! The ProofreadPage extension has solved half of the problem, so we no longer need to manually link to the previous/next scanned page.
But we still have to deal with the other half of the problem: previous/next chapter. This should also be possible to solve with an extension, shouldn't it?
Only if the chapter is without a name, when there are Names they should be linked by names. And if more than one chapter / item is on a page the schould be possible too. A lot of books eg "Die Gartenlaube" have several items (chapters) articles on one page an they must be adressed too. the actual solution with the next previous together with section fits exactly, even if it is a little bit more work for the author.
2010/5/10 Lars Aronsson lars@aronsson.se
Michael Jörgens wrote:
the previous / next mechanism is normally no longe used on Pages with page numbering, It is used on pages were the link is text, e g. the name of the next or previous poem, or the name of the previous or next chapter (when there is a title not a number) here a poem example: http://de.wikisource.org/wiki/Malerin_Klugschnack
Exactly! The ProofreadPage extension has solved half of the problem, so we no longer need to manually link to the previous/next scanned page.
But we still have to deal with the other half of the problem: previous/next chapter. This should also be possible to solve with an extension, shouldn't it?
-- Lars Aronsson (lars@aronsson.se) Aronsson Datateknik - http://aronsson.se
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
2010/5/11 Michael Jörgens joergens.mic@googlemail.com
Only if the chapter is without a name, when there are Names they should be linked by names. And if more than one chapter / item is on a page the schould be possible too. A lot of books eg "Die Gartenlaube" have several items (chapters) articles on one page an they must be adressed too. the actual solution with the next previous together with section fits exactly, even if it is a little bit more work for the author.
I'm facing with the same problem, but I think I'll use a different way: a bot job, to create chapters by the summary of chapters into main ns0 page or - better - from the summary into Index page. If such a summary is built once with sufficient care, adding too the relevant elements for pages index tag as a parameter (from, to, fromsection, tosection), I suppose that a bot could get all what it needs to build running chapters with prev and next parameters too.
Alex_brollo
On Mon, May 10, 2010 at 6:39 PM, Lars Aronsson lars@aronsson.se wrote:
Is it true that {{header|previous= |next= }} must be filled in manually for each chapter?
On English Wikisource we have a gadget which does this. It only works in Firefox.
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Help:Header_preloading_script_gadget
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Gadget-TemplatePreloader.js
-- John Vandenberg
2010/5/11 John Vandenberg jayvdb@gmail.com
On Mon, May 10, 2010 at 6:39 PM, Lars Aronsson lars@aronsson.se wrote:
Is it true that {{header|previous= |next= }} must be filled in manually for each chapter?
On English Wikisource we have a gadget which does this. It only works in Firefox.
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Help:Header_preloading_script_gadget
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Gadget-TemplatePreloader.js
Hi John, thanks, it's really excing! Can be,I'll upload a en.source text again just to see it at work. :-)
Nevertheless, I'm working about something deeply different. Our bot browse recent changes, and reads content new/edited pages of "interesting" namespaces. By now, it does banal jobs; but I guess, we'll add more and harder works, both "automatic" (t.i. something the bot "decides by himself" browsing the content of the page) or "requested" (I imagine into html comment: the first I'll implement will be something like this: <!-- Alebot, please keep away from this page --> ;-) to block Alebot without blocking other bots). I used some html comment "bot directives" into the last work I uploaded, they run but they aren't addressed to the Recent Changes script.
So, the mechanism will be browser-indipendent, since it will produce plain wiki code, just as a human diligent user; and it will be js-free too. I'll post news into my user WIP page if I'll got something decent (I'm not sure at all about!). But the en: pre-load idea is great, I'll try to study it, to customize it to it:source project!
Alex_brollo
Lars,
On enWS if you have the preload headers gadget activated it does this for you, RIDER, for the subpages for Chapters to work I believe that it needs for the Title page to have the links and it identifies where it is on the list and does prev/next. If necessary I can try and work it out from Remember the Dot's script.
At enWS, we started (though didn't complete) a naming convention discussion, though from that many of us are now defaulting to Chapter 1 .. 10 .. XX, rather than other variations (abbreviations, no chapter names, roman numerals, etc.) I have utilised Pathoschild's regex script to build a little function() to identify the current page, and then do the subsequent pages. So it needs me to click on my function link, however, it is fairly simply achieved.
Regards Andrew
On 10 May 2010 at 10:39, Lars Aronsson wrote:
Is it true that {{header|previous= |next= }} must be filled in manually for each chapter? Couldn't this be automated in the same way as ProofreadPage links "<" and ">" in a linear sequence, if you provide the table of contents in a central place? If that TOC contained the page number intervals and sections, everything in the chapter page could be automated, right?
Is it true that full text search leads to to the Page: and not to the main namespace page that transcludes it? And that the former has no link to the latter?
If I search "the right understanding of the machine", I find http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page:The_Kinematics_of_Machinery.djvu/24 but I don't find http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Kinematics_of_Machinery/Introduction
How could that be improved? Is another Extension necessary?
-- Lars Aronsson (lars@aronsson.se) Aronsson Datateknik - http://aronsson.se
This may work on chapters, but I dislike replacing the true name by a number. And it wo't work on Books with poems were this two pointers got to the name of the previous and next poem. And it won't work on magazines, with lot of articles in.
2010/5/11 Billinghurst billinghurst@gmail.com
Lars,
On enWS if you have the preload headers gadget activated it does this for you, RIDER, for the subpages for Chapters to work I believe that it needs for the Title page to have the links and it identifies where it is on the list and does prev/next. If necessary I can try and work it out from Remember the Dot's script.
At enWS, we started (though didn't complete) a naming convention discussion, though from that many of us are now defaulting to Chapter 1 .. 10 .. XX, rather than other variations (abbreviations, no chapter names, roman numerals, etc.) I have utilised Pathoschild's regex script to build a little function() to identify the current page, and then do the subsequent pages. So it needs me to click on my function link, however, it is fairly simply achieved.
Regards Andrew
On 10 May 2010 at 10:39, Lars Aronsson wrote:
Is it true that {{header|previous= |next= }} must be filled in manually for each chapter? Couldn't this be automated in the same way as ProofreadPage links "<" and ">" in a linear sequence, if you provide the table of contents in a central place? If that TOC contained the page number intervals and sections, everything in the chapter page could be automated, right?
Is it true that full text search leads to to the Page: and not to the main namespace page that transcludes it? And that the former has no link to the latter?
If I search "the right understanding of the machine", I find http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page:The_Kinematics_of_Machinery.djvu/24 but I don't find http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Kinematics_of_Machinery/Introduction
How could that be improved? Is another Extension necessary?
-- Lars Aronsson (lars@aronsson.se) Aronsson Datateknik - http://aronsson.se
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
2010/5/12 Michael Jörgens joergens.mic@googlemail.com
This may work on chapters, but I dislike replacing the true name by a number. And it wo't work on Books with poems were this two pointers got to the name of the previous and next poem. And it won't work on magazines, with lot of articles in.
2010/5/11 Billinghurst billinghurst@gmail.com
Michael, as see you'd like to have a fine-tuned control about what is "next" and "prev". This can be accomplished by "html comment bot directives" I mentioned before. Would you like to work with me to have a try with "my temptative, bot-oriented approach" to the problem? In my experience, this is best obtained working on a real case. So, if you are so bold to have a try, and you have one new work (t.i. a new book where chapters/sections hasn't be created) to use as a real test into en.source, tell me! I like exploring, and I've just registered a bot into en.source, that is waiting for some work to show what it can do... I can't promise you any result but some headache, but it could turn out an interesting adventure.
Feel free to use my personal mail or my user talk page into en.source or into it.source,if you like the idea.
Alex_brollo
Michael,
The mean reasons that we were looking to standardise chapter names is that we are now getting to the stage where we are putting in references to future books that we are planning to work upon. Ahead of time we don't know chapter names, or even if they have names, plus the references themselves usually refer to something like Ch.2, so they are already in that format. Some of that conversation is at http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource_talk:Naming_conventions in all its glory.
That is not to say that we don't use the chapter name in the header, as we do, it is just not in the subpage name.
Poems? Poetry? Don't even know what that is! ;-)
Regards Andrew <- poetry free zone
On 12 May 2010 at 7:17, Michael Jörgens wrote:
This may work on chapters, but I dislike replacing the true name by a number. And it wo't work on Books with poems were this two pointers got to the name of the previous and next poem. And it won't work on magazines, with lot of articles in.
2010/5/11 Billinghurst billinghurst@gmail.com
Lars,
On enWS if you have the preload headers gadget activated it does this for you, RIDER, for the subpages for Chapters to work I believe that it needs for the Title page to have the links and it identifies where it is on the list and does prev/next. If necessary I can try and work it out from Remember the Dot's script.
At enWS, we started (though didn't complete) a naming convention discussion, though from that many of us are now defaulting to Chapter 1 .. 10 .. XX, rather than other variations (abbreviations, no chapter names, roman numerals, etc.) I have utilised Pathoschild's regex script to build a little function() to identify the current page, and then do the subsequent pages. So it needs me to click on my function link, however, it is fairly simply achieved.
Regards Andrew
On 10 May 2010 at 10:39, Lars Aronsson wrote:
Is it true that {{header|previous= |next= }} must be filled in manually for each chapter? Couldn't this be automated in the same way as ProofreadPage links "<" and ">" in a linear sequence, if you provide the table of contents in a central place? If that TOC contained the page number intervals and sections, everything in the chapter page could be automated, right?
Is it true that full text search leads to to the Page: and not to the main namespace page that transcludes it? And that the former has no link to the latter?
If I search "the right understanding of the machine", I find http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page:The_Kinematics_of_Machinery.djvu/24 but I don't find http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Kinematics_of_Machinery/Introduction
How could that be improved? Is another Extension necessary?
-- Lars Aronsson (lars@aronsson.se) Aronsson Datateknik - http://aronsson.se
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org