PixelACHE 05 Stockholm Panel, April 12 2005
Finnish Embassy, Stockholm
Our own Anthère was on a panel of 4 speakers, on the topic of
"Dot-org Boom": How internet organizations are taking their place alongside
journalists and experts. She spoke on the history and success of Wikipedia.
Judging by the comments, Wikipedia was definitely the star of the day.
Attendance<http://gmail.google.com/gmail?view=att&disp=thd&attid=0.4&th=1033adf97eac80…>included
Lars Aronsson, the founder of "Project Runeberg" (the swedish
Project Gutenberg) and "susning.nu", a Swedish project similar to Wikipedia
that had great success during 2001-2002 before the Swedish wiki started to
pick up steam.
The panel
http://gmail.google.com/gmail?view=att&disp=inline&attid=0.8&th=1033adf97ea…
Naeem Mohaiemen
(from New York, London and Bangladesh) who spoke on a combination of
participatory websites and art installations he has created to draw
attention to the American muslim community and the gap between their
perception in America and the reality.
There were thre more speakers:
Robert Stachel (Austria, topic:
community tv and radio), Kai Kuikkaniemi (Finland, topic:
digitalopenandfree.org <http://digitalopenandfree.org>), Juha Huuskonen
(Finland, topic: electronic
subcultures).
I think I can confidently say that Florence's talk was the best received and
the most relevant to the audience, at the end of the day. She's an excellent
speaker, by the way.
If there's interest I can write more about the 4 speeches.
Steve Rapaport
On 4/13/05, foundation-l-request(a)wikimedia.org <
foundation-l-request(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. TheWorldForum.org <http://TheWorldForum.org> adds Wikinews logo (Erik
> Moeller)
> 2. Re: Comment on Copyright Orphans (Ray Saintonge)
> 3. Re: Re: [Wikipedia-l] Expanding CheckUser permissions
> (David Gerard)
> 4. Re: TheWorldForum.org <http://TheWorldForum.org> adds Wikinews logo
> (Sj)
> 5. Re: TheWorldForum.org <http://TheWorldForum.org> adds Wikinews logo
> (Tim Starling)
> 6. Re: Re: TheWorldForum.org <http://TheWorldForum.org> adds Wikinews logo
> (Ray Saintonge)
> 7. Talking about stewards (Walter van Kalken)
> 8. Did I just violate the GFDL? (Richard Holton)
> 9. Re: Did I just violate the GFDL? (Erik Moeller)
> 10. Re: TheWorldForum.org <http://TheWorldForum.org> adds Wikinews logo
> (Angela)
> 11. Re: Did I just violate the GFDL? (Andre Engels)
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 19:19:06 +0200
> From: Erik Moeller <erik_moeller(a)gmx.de>
> Subject: [Foundation-l] TheWorldForum.org <http://TheWorldForum.org> adds
> Wikinews logo
> To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List <foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org>,
> wikinews-l(a)wikimedia.org
> Message-ID: <425C030A.9040109(a)gmx.de>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed
>
> Hi,
>
> for the last couple of months, Wikinews and The World Forum
> (www.theworldforum.org <http://www.theworldforum.org>) have enjoyed a very
> productive cooperation. TWF
> reposts Wikinews stories (allowing us to appear on the news.google.com<http://news.google.com>
> frontpage several times), and the editor, "Drog", has now also started
> submitting his own stories to Wikinews as public domain.
>
> I've given Drog the go-ahead to link to Wikinews using our logo on the
> frontpage. I thought that given the recent discussions about logo
> copyright & licensing, it might be a good idea to report this here.
>
> (On a related note, I feel that David Vasquez has done an excellent job
> refining the logo. It looks much more optimistic and welcoming than the
> logos of most news sites.)
>
> All best,
>
> Erik
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 11:41:11 -0700
> From: Ray Saintonge <saintonge(a)telus.net>
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Comment on Copyright Orphans
> To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List <foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org>
> Message-ID: <425C1647.5040606(a)telus.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed
>
> Yann Forget wrote:
>
> >Hi,
> >
> >Le Tuesday 12 April 2005 16:35, The Cunctator a écrit :
> >
> >
> >>We should be making an official comment on the issue of copyright
> orphans
> >>now before the U.S. Copyright Office. The deadline is May 9.
> >>
> >>From http://www.copyright.gov/orphan/:
> >>
> >>
> >(...)
> >
> >
> >>This is clearly something the Wikimedia Foundation should officially
> weigh
> >>in on.
> >>
> >>
> >I totally agree with this.
> >
> I already put my previous submissions into the mailing list. It's No.
> 697 in the records of the Copyright Office. All 714 submissions may be
> read as pdf files. Is there a way to do a text search for all those pdf
> files to see if any other submissions used the string "wiki"?
>
> The current round of submissions is for responses to what has already
> been submitted. In the sampling that I have looked at there seems to be
> a very strong something-needs-to-be-done trend.
>
> One observation that I have made about the submissions favouring the
> status quo is the emphasis on the rights of current authors, and seem
> not to mention the rights of the author's descendants at all. Having
> Life + 70 really doesn't do anything for the authors themselves. More
> ironic is their tendency to view proposed changes to the copyright
> regime as attempts by corporate interests to undermine the rights of
> authors and artists. It seems to me that the corporate interests have
> sold them a bill of goods.
>
> Another important article to read from "Wired" is this by Julian
> Dibbell: http://wired-vig.wired.com/wired/archive/12.11/linux.html
> There is a lot for many of us to learn from what is going on in Brazil.
>
> Ec
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 04:43:36 +1000
> From: David Gerard <fun(a)thingy.apana.org.au>
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Re: [Wikipedia-l] Expanding CheckUser
> permissions
> To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List <foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org>,
> wikipedia-l(a)wikimedia.org
> Message-ID: <20050412184336.GP23009(a)thingy.apana.org.au>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Puddl Duk (puddlduk(a)gmail.com) [050413 02:36]:
> > On Apr 12, 2005 8:35 AM, David Gerard <fun(a)thingy.apana.org.au> wrote:
>
> > > > ...invasion of privacy by potentially removing anonymity from the
> use of
> > > > Wikipedia. Please let this tool be a last resort in serious cases.
>
> > > Precisely. That's why anyone using it needs to have an awareness of
> these
> > > issues and proceed with extreme caution.
>
> > Guarantees of restraint from the current users of this feature are
> > fine, I'm sure that Tim and David are trustworthy, but that's the here
> > and now. The feature needs some built in oversight.
>
> Those with access to it see all uses, ever. Tim has also made this list
> available to others.
>
> > Users should be notified when CheckUser is run on them (something like
> > a message notice, that only they can see). Waerth noted that this
> > will cause some controversy with users when they see they have been
> > investigated, which is true. But this makes a good deterrent of abuse.
> > Anyone who runs it will have a damn good reason, knowing that they
> > may have to explain themselves. Also, many requests for sockpuppet
> > checks are public, so informing the users who were checked isn't any
> > different in these cases.
>
> You're writing the code to do this, then?
>
> > Waerth also notes on, meta, that 90% of the checks will be on innocent
> > users. If this is the case, then I have to question how solid the
> > reasoning is for checking those 90%.
>
> One thing I've just asked on [[m:CheckUser]] is for ideas on what the
> criteria should be. As I noted, spurious allegations of sockpuppetry are
> de
> rigeur on en: arbitration cases. One thing that frustrates me at present
> is
> there are quite a few I think I should *maybe* look into but don't feel
> certain enough to because there isn't a clear case to hand.
>
> > Finally, notifying a registered user when their identity is checked is
> > just a decent thing to do.
>
> There is that. OTOH, when I was investigating the socks of the 'Baku Ibne'
> troll, I came across use of the same IPs by good users and checked their
> IPs as well. Now, should we be revealing too much information to them
> about
> an ongoing investigation?
>
> And also: any website will look through the logs in detail if they suspect
> abuse. The devs do this *all the time already*. And they *do not* notify
> anyone in particular. The key to this feature is not doing anything that
> isn't done already, it's giving access to a small subset of it to people
> who aren't actually Wikimedia system administrators, mostly so the system
> administrators can get on with running the site.
>
> - d.
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 12:32:26 -0700
> From: Sj <2.718281828(a)gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] TheWorldForum.org <http://TheWorldForum.org>adds Wikinews logo
> To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List <foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org>
> Message-ID: <742dfd0605041212321c49fd1e(a)mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Yes, M. Vasquez managed to polish a vaguely worrisome logo into a
> world-class one. And with the wikinews skin redesign approaching...
> the *fully operational* wikistar will be beautiful as well.
>
> SJ
>
> > (On a related note, I feel that David Vasquez has done an excellent job
> > refining the logo. It looks much more optimistic and welcoming than the
> > logos of most news sites.)
>
> Does anyone know of other uses of a globe icon rotated to that longitude?
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 05:55:10 +1000
> From: Tim Starling <t.starling(a)physics.unimelb.edu.au>
> Subject: [Foundation-l] Re: TheWorldForum.org <http://TheWorldForum.org>adds Wikinews logo
> To: foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org
> Message-ID: <d3h8t4$9ke$1(a)sea.gmane.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Sj wrote:
> > Does anyone know of other uses of a globe icon rotated to that
> longitude?
>
> An amusing example:
>
> http://www.lhup.edu/~dsimanek/fe-scidi.htm
>
> "Uncle Joe (Stalin), Churchill, and Roosevelt laid the master plan to
> bring in the New Age under the United Nations," Johnson discloses with
> confidence. "The world ruling power was to be right here in this
> country. After the war, the world would be declared flat and Roosevelt
> would be elected first president of the world. When the UN Charter was
> drafted in San Francisco, they took the flat-earth map as their symbol."
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 13:30:36 -0700
> From: Ray Saintonge <saintonge(a)telus.net>
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Re: TheWorldForum.org<http://TheWorldForum.org>adds Wikinews logo
> To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List <foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org>
> Message-ID: <425C2FEC.8030504(a)telus.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
> Tim Starling wrote:
>
> >Sj wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Does anyone know of other uses of a globe icon rotated to that
> longitude?
> >>
> >>
> >An amusing example:
> >
> >http://www.lhup.edu/~dsimanek/fe-scidi.htm
> >
> >"Uncle Joe (Stalin), Churchill, and Roosevelt laid the master plan to
> >bring in the New Age under the United Nations," Johnson discloses with
> >confidence. "The world ruling power was to be right here in this
> >country. After the war, the world would be declared flat and Roosevelt
> >would be elected first president of the world. When the UN Charter was
> >drafted in San Francisco, they took the flat-earth map as their symbol."
> >
> LBJ could only wish so much.
>
> Some of his successors still believe that they have been elected leaders
> of the free world.
>
> Ec
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 07:42:40 +0700
> From: Walter van Kalken <walter(a)vankalken.net>
> Subject: [Foundation-l] Talking about stewards
> To: wikipedia-l(a)Wikimedia.org, Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List
> <foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org>
> Message-ID: <425C6B00.2010405(a)vankalken.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
> With all the talk about stewards ...... I thought the stewardcollection
> would be expanded in March? Either through election or by Jimbo's choice?
>
> Waerth/Walter
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 22:45:34 -0500
> From: Richard Holton <richholton(a)gmail.com>
> Subject: [Foundation-l] Did I just violate the GFDL?
> To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List <foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org>
> Message-ID: <4a37983b0504122045749fab74(a)mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> I just copied the contents of [[template:inuse]] from en:wikipedia to
> meta, to a page of the same name. Do I also need to copy the edit
> history? Or do I need to link back to the en page? Or just mention
> that it came from the en wikipedia?
>
> Should I sleep with my boots on in case the GFDL police come beating on my
> door?
>
> --Rich Holton
>
> [[W:en:User:Rholton]]
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 06:13:44 +0200
> From: Erik Moeller <erik_moeller(a)gmx.de>
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Did I just violate the GFDL?
> To: Richard Holton <richholton(a)gmail.com>, Wikimedia Foundation
> Mailing List <foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org>
> Message-ID: <425C9C78.8010007(a)gmx.de>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> A link in the edit summary
> GFDL, copied from http://__.wikipedia.org/wiki/____
> should be sufficient in cases where display of the notice in the body is
> clearly impractical.
>
> Erik
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 08:40:09 +0200
> From: Angela <beesley(a)gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] TheWorldForum.org <http://TheWorldForum.org>adds Wikinews logo
> To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List <foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org>
> Message-ID: <8b722b80050412234028ab80c1(a)mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> On 4/12/05, Erik Moeller <erik_moeller(a)gmx.de> wrote:
> > I've given Drog the go-ahead to link to Wikinews using our logo on the
> > frontpage.
>
> http://www.theworldforum.org/
>
> World Forum is not just using the logo. It is also claiming to be "In
> Association With Wikinews", which implies a lot more than simply
> making use of our content.
>
> The logo appears directly underneath a "Visit our advertisers" notice.
> This needs to be removed to prevent people being misled into thinking
> that their donations to the Foundation are being wasted on paying for
> advertising on such sites.
>
> Something stating that _some_ content is from Wikinews would be more
> appropriate. At the moment, the Wikinews logo appears more prominently
> than the site's own logo, giving the impression that Wikinews has far
> more influence over the site than it does.
>
> Angela.
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 10:19:23 +0200
> From: Andre Engels <andreengels(a)gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Did I just violate the GFDL?
> To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List <foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org>
> Message-ID: <6faf39c9050413011943a43041(a)mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> On 4/13/05, Erik Moeller <erik_moeller(a)gmx.de> wrote:
> > A link in the edit summary
> > GFDL, copied from http://__.wikipedia.org/wiki/____
> > should be sufficient in cases where display of the notice in the body is
> > clearly impractical.
>
> Better would be to give the usernames of the main authors as well.
>
> Andre Engels
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org
> http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>
> End of foundation-l Digest, Vol 13, Issue 12
> ********************************************
>
>
--
\Steve
With all the talk about stewards ...... I thought the stewardcollection
would be expanded in March? Either through election or by Jimbo's choice?
Waerth/Walter
I've wanted to inform everyone who isn't aware yet, that the Polish
Wikimedia community started to plan the upcoming of the Wikimedia
Poland community, which would act as a local chapter to the Wikimedia
Foundation.
Right now, we're gathering info and informing users on the good and
the bad sides of having a more "legal" way of operating the Polish
projects.
We need at least 15 interested people to start the organization. We
won't spend almost any money on start, apart from some basic
registration fees (a few dollars) and a domain - Wikimedia.pl.
The current list of people interested in founding the organization is
listed over on meta, to be more precise, here -
http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikimedia_Polska#Lista_ch.C4.99tnych
We haven't informed the local communities on anything yet. First we
want to gather more info, and when we'll actually have the first real
participants and some words of courage, we'll post the info on every
local village pump in every project.
Now, my only question is, what should we exactly do after registering
our organization, to become a local Wikimedia chapter?
I'll try to inform foundation-l on any new progress as soon as it happens.
--
Best regards,
Dariusz Siedlecki
First, thanks for the public and private support you
offered me. I feel better now, and physically, things
look okay now.
Just a short word as the museum is closing soon and I
am on a loaned computer (really nice guy left it to me
for a little while).
The presentation today in Helsinki went very well.
Wikipedia was offered a full hour for presentation and
questions, very generous time ;-) Most of the audience
was Nokia, plus some artists, people from the museum
and organisers. 40 or 50 people I think. The Nokia
organiser is setting up a wiki himself, so we also
discussed mediawiki and community building privately
afterwards.... busy building human network ;-)
I wish that more of you live this kind of experience,
because it is always great to present Wikipedia, as
most of the audience (everyone today probably) is SO
excited by the whole project. It is really a very
powerful experience. There is a third presentation on
saturday, which should be the largest one by far.
There would be plenty of things to relate, but...short
of time.
One funny thing happened yesterday in Stockholm. There
was a french correspondant for Le Figaro, and she
absolutely tried to know what was Jimbo opinion on
politics, what was his religion... it seems she was
trying to uncover a huge conspiracy.... so... Jimbo, I
blew up your cover sorry, I admitted you were a
communist muslim under cover, trying to throw a world
revolution....
Journalists have so strange ideas sometimes.... she
just could not imagine this could be done.... just
because it is worth it in itself.... rather than to
push a specific pov... (though freeing information is
in itself a pov... but well...)
more seriously, I was absolutely amazed by the
confusion in people minds (even those who claim to
work on free and/or open projects) of what is open,
what is free, what do licences mean... I think we have
a lot of work to do to explain those things.... BEFORE
we can go ask to... for example... governmental
organisations to "please, free content". While even
those who are near professionals of libre, gratis and
open are confused, I do not think officials are neatly
informed to a sufficient level about the implications
for us, them and everyone, to take a fully informed
decision on freeing content.
Anyway, that was my philosophical thought tonight....
now I will go for a beer.
My best to all of you.
/me under cover, preparing revolution with Naeem (http://www.disappearedinamerica.org/)
__________________________________
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I just copied the contents of [[template:inuse]] from en:wikipedia to
meta, to a page of the same name. Do I also need to copy the edit
history? Or do I need to link back to the en page? Or just mention
that it came from the en wikipedia?
Should I sleep with my boots on in case the GFDL police come beating on my door?
--Rich Holton
[[W:en:User:Rholton]]
I feel that this tool should be rarely if ever used to find sock
puppets. If this tool simply tells you which accounts have been used
from which ip address this is not enough evidence to prove the use of
"sock puppet" accounts. I for instance access Wikipedia via a machine
which has no real ip address but rather shares a real ip address with
several hundred machines. I know for a fact that other people on my
network use Wikipedia, and I have no doubts that some of them will be
browsing similar pages as me. So, while this tool might be helpful, I
feel that it provides far too much opportunity for abuse if it were to
be allowed to be used by the general population. Admins already block
IPs in similar ranges when fighting "vandals" often blocking
legitimate users. Also, this tool could and would provide a huge
invasion of privacy by potentially removing anonymity from the use of
Wikipedia. Please let this tool be a last resort in serious cases.
On Apr 11, 2005 11:42 PM, Angela <beesley(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> Requests have recently been made to the Board asking for verification
> that a user is sockpuppeting on one of the larger Wikipedias. At least
> two of the developers felt this was a matter for the Board or for an
> arbitration committee (although that Wikipedia doesn't have an
> arbcom), and were therefore not happy to give out details about the IP
> address of this user. Checking IPs is no longer a developer-only task
> since a new feature allows sockpuppet checks.
>
> [[Special:CheckUser]] allows a user with "checkuser" permissions to
> find all the IP addresses used by a particular logged in user, and to
> show all the contributions from a given IP address, including those
> made by logged in users.
>
> Currently the only people with the necessary permissions to use
> CheckUser are Tim Starling (who wrote the code for this) and David
> Gerard (who uses it on behalf of the English Wikipedia Arbitration
> Committee).
>
> This data is only stored for one week, so edits made prior to that
> will not be shown via CheckUser. A log is kept of who has made which
> queries with the tool. This log is available to those with the
> checkuser permissions.
>
> I would personally like to see this feature be made available to more
> communities than just the English Wikipedia, but I am concerned about
> potential misuse of it, and the violation of privacy for users who
> have not been disruptive. I would appreciate any comments about this
> feature, and answers to the questions below, either here or on on Meta
> <http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/CheckUser>.
>
> Do you think this feature should be made more widely available?
>
> If so, who should be given access to it?
>
> Should it be limited to stewards, or to wikis with arbitration committees?
>
> Does the privacy policy
> <http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Privacy_policy> need be adjusted to
> allow the use of this feature?
>
> Angela.
>
> --
> Angela Beesley
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Angela
> _______________________________________________
> Wikipedia-l mailing list
> Wikipedia-l(a)Wikimedia.org
> http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-l
>
--
Michael Becker
--- Dariusz Siedlecki <datrio(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> Right now, we're gathering info and informing users on the good and
> the bad sides of having a more "legal" way of operating the Polish
> projects.
Chapters are not charged with operating projects. They most certainly are not
charged with operating specific language versions of projects. The purpose of
chapters is to provide a legal presence in a nation and to help organize *all*
Wikimedia-related activities in that nation.
-- mav
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hey all,
sorry if this is a FAQ - and I'm not sure if this question belongs in this
mailing list - but since it concerns the legal side of the fence wrt
wikipedia contributions here goes:
What's the legal status of data retrieved from non-public domain sources?
I understand that text that is retrieved from copyrighted materials is
copyrighted, but how about data and figures that deal with common interest
topics? Can you really copyright the amount of wheat grown in a year in
bangladesh, or the number of accidents in a year on california roads?
And how about graphs? Is data that is extrapolated from graphs and
used in derivative graphs considered a 'creative work' of its own?
I'd think so, but I just want to be sure..
Ed
Simply from a technical point of view, the wide use of this tool as it
is currently implemented would probably involve synchronization issues
resulting in the corruption of the log (I had a similar experience
with the paypal donations script I've worked on).
On Apr 12, 2005 8:39 AM, Tim Starling <t.starling(a)physics.unimelb.edu.au> wrote:
*SNIP*
> I put the log in a flat file on NFS
> (/home/wikipedia/logs/checkuser.log)
*SNIP*
>
> -- Tim Starling
*SNIP*
--
Michael Becker