^_^ If only PHP didn't suck in that area... If anyone has looked into that area, they'll understand that PHP cannot do upload progress bars. PHP does the uploading on it's own without giving the script any access to the raw file streams to permit that kind of progress meter. The only way to create an upload progress bar is to use another language to do the actual uploading of the file. Most commonly people end up using a perl upload script to allow the progress meter. Other than that, there is the option of flash. But you know what everyone things of proprietary software here. ~Daniel Friesen (Dantman, Nadir-Seen-Fire) ~Profile/Portfolio: http://nadir-seen-fire.com -The Nadir-Point Group (http://nadir-point.com) --It's Wiki-Tools subgroup (http://wiki-tools.com) --The ElectronicMe project (http://electronic-me.org) -Wikia ACG on Wikia.com (http://wikia.com/wiki/Wikia_ACG) --Animepedia (http://anime.wikia.com) --Narutopedia (http://naruto.wikia.com) Marco Schuster wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 I believe php 5.2 with some minor configuration supports upload status: http://www.haughin.com/2007/10/23/php-upload-progress-with-php-52-apc/ - --michael K. Peachey wrote: still

On Fri, Nov 21, 2008 at 9:30 PM, techman224 <techman224(a)yahoo.ca> wrote: Reading a bit more into that, I'm not convinced it's practical. Almost all of the information I'm reading has been negative, just to quote a few: [1]http://pecl.php.net/bugs/bug.php?id=13607 [2]http://pecl.php.net/bugs/bug.php?id=9323 [3]http://docs.php.net/manual/en/apc.configuration.php -Chad

techman224 schrieb: Uh... that sounds like an elaborate, ugly and unreliable hack. And that is all it really can be. Keep in mind: PHP does not perform uploading at all. It does not run in the browser, so it can't upload anything. It's the browser itself that does this, based on what the HTML tells it to do, and using basic features of HTTP. Browsers *could* easily show a progress indicator for file uploads -- but for some reason, they don't. Anyway, HTTP doesn't support feedback during upload (or any feedback, really), and HTML does not offer a way for multi-file uploads (which would also be quite handy). Any solutions I have so far seen for that are based either on a Java Applet or on Falsh. Both are rather cluncky and and ugly solutions. HTTP and HTML being what they are, I'm afraid we won't see a decent free, reliably and widely compatible solution for this any time soon. Or maybe HTML5 has something for this? -- daniel

Yes, that seems similar to the original proposal: track the status of the opload on the server side, store the status in some cross-request cache (like APC), and query it using JavaSCript (as an iframe or by injecting html doesn't really matter). That's a *little* lighter on the client, but still quite a fugly hack, ant not very reliable, IMHO. -- daniel

It gets run only after the upload is complete. And even if not, and you could get the size of the temporary file, what would you do with it? You can't start sending the response until the request is complete. And even if you could, the browser would probably not start resinging it before it has finished sending the request (i.e. the upload). This is the nature of HTTP... -- daniel

Marco Schuster schrieb: This is close to the original APC based proposal, and I'm sure it's somehow possible, even without using iframes. But it remains an ugly hack, which is tricky to setup and does not work in all environments. For wiki mediasites, the fact that requests are load-balanced between multiple webservers complicates things. The temporary upload file may be on one server while the request for status goes to another. Again: it's possible in theory, and maybe even in practice, but it remains a fugly unreliable hack. -- daniel

I mean uploading an arbitrary number of files, without having to pick each one individually. For example by picking a directory, or multiple files fron the same directory. Sure, HTML can give you 100 "choos file" fields. but who wants to use that? -- daniel

thinking about it, at the moment the best solution for multi file upload is a dedicated client. There are a couple of scripts that are hard to use, some windows-only stuff, and java-based Commonist. To get something that is easy to install and works cross-platform, how about a firefox plugin? Has anyone here any experience with writing one? -- daniel

Well, I mixed two things here: the general progress indicator thing, and the specific need for a good upload client for mediawiki. Both could be addressed by firefox ad-ons, btu you are right: for the progress indication, it should be generic, for any file upload. A mediawiki upload should be specific and provide more functionality besides picking multiple files and uploading them. Most importantly, it has to provide a way to provide the basic information about license, source and authorship. Programs for this exist, I was just thinking that a firefox ad-on would be simpler to deploy and maintain that a standalone program, and people would be more likely to iunstall and use it. -- daniel

On Sun, Nov 23, 2008 at 4:37 PM, Aryeh Gregor <Simetrical+wikilist(a)gmail.com> wrote: For my CommonsHelper [1] and flickr2commons [2] tools I have implemented a universal Commons user verification for the toolserver called TUSC [3] some time ago. All tools can use this to verify that someone using a tool does have a Commons (or any wikipedia) user login, and that account isn't blocked. We could offer mass-uploads via toolserver that way. Advantages: * Seperate from MediaWiki code * Quickly adaptable * Potentially many ways to upload (Perl, Java, ...) Drawbacks: * Additional one-time TUSC signup required (quick but potentially annoying) * Files would be uploaded under a bot name Or, we could enable my option in MediaWiki to "upload" by giving a URL; me could support multiple URLs that way. That would require people to upload their files on some public FTP or HTTP server, and then transfer them to Commons. My 2 pence, Magnus [1] http://toolserver.org/~magnus/commonshelper.php [2] http://toolserver.org/~magnus/flickr2commons.php [3] http://toolserver.org/~magnus/tusc.php

Aryeh Gregor schrieb: That would requrie a signed applet, with users having to click through scary warnings etc. not a good option. -- daniel

Hoi, When you know what is being indicated by the signing part of a signed message, it may not be scary. However, do you really expect everyone to know and appreciate it as such ? Thanks, GerardM 2008/11/23 Gregory Maxwell <gmaxwell(a)gmail.com>

Excuse my ignorance here but shouldn't it be possible to write an Apache handler to receive the file uploads (so we get instant notification instead on upload completion) and at the same time use the meta data to write basic progress information to the DB - The page then uses (say) an iframe to post the file(s) to the handler which updates the DB. You may need to do an initial hit to the handler to get the ID to track or similar - Depends on design. The progress can then be retrieved by the main page using AJAX to populate a progress box - No java so no warnings. If JS is disabled, it should be easy to fall back gracefully as the only real complex JS is for a progress bar - no JS = no progress bar but upload still works. Admittedly this doesn't solve the multiple file issue or the large file issue but would get you a progress bar. I don't believe JS will have file access permissions under most circumstances so couldn't do entire thing via AJAX (not to mention possible increase in transfer time based on encoding, etc...). To add my $0.02 to the previous suggestion of Java - Whilst most tech-savvy people would have no issues with a Javascript box, others might - but there's no reason you couldn't have a page explaining the process. Additionally, I've noticed (certainly in my family/friends) that most of them just click "OK" whatever it says - No matter how many times I drum it into them to read it first. I'd imagine a large portion of the world would assume Wikipedia is OK and just go with it. -----Original Message----- From: wikitech-l-bounces(a)lists.wikimedia.org [mailto:wikitech-l-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of Gregory Maxwell Sent: 24 November 2008 15:58 To: Wikimedia developers Subject: Re: [Wikitech-l] Upload filesize limit bumped On Mon, Nov 24, 2008 at 10:34 AM, Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijssen(a)gmail.com> wrote: to know I'm sorry, but I think we've miscommunicated. The discussion here is related to a uploader functionalty that would make uploading larger numbers (or large sized) files more user friendly and reliable. This could be accomplished with Java, but because the Java would need to access files on your system it would have to do things which are not permitted for "sandboxed" Java applets. When applets are "signed" they can perform actions outside of the "Java sandbox" without the really nasty security warnings. Signing is otherwise pretty much invisible to the user. The other point I was making was that in the past I had inadvertently left the media player triggering the nasty warning messages, and no one complained and many (virtually all? as far as I could tell) went ahead and used the player anyways. _______________________________________________ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l The information contained in this communication is privileged and confidential.  The content is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited.  If you have received this communication in error, please notify me immediately by telephone or e-mail, and delete this message from your systems. Teleperformance is a trading style of MM Teleperformance Ltd: Reg No. 02060289 England: Registered Office: St James House, Moon Street, Bristol, BS2 8QY. VAT No.763 0980 18. P Please think of the environment before you print this email

Aryeh Gregor wrote: Instead of an Apache Handler, I'd do it as a PHP module (PHP is still an Apache module, but i feel PHP is the right place to do it).

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Aryeh Gregor wrote: Loading a signed and certified applet pops up a dialog box that says roughly: "You are loading a Java applet which is signed by XYZ. The applet will have complete access to your computer. Do you trust the signed applet from XYZ?" to which the response is either going to be: "Yes, I want to see the dancing cats!" or "WTF is this? Am I being hacked?!?!" In the last three times we had this discussion, we already discarded the idea of a Java applet uploader for this reason -- the security warnings for signed applets are disruptive. (Now, as an opt-in for power users, it might still be neat. But if we can provide the same capability and *no warnings* using a Flash uploader [with no proprietary codecs involved!], there's probably not much need to do it in Java too. Be nice if someone could double-check if Gnash supports file uploading. :) - -- brion

Er... this has been stated a couple of times now, and it makes me wonder. I haven't tried recently, but my impression was that an applet ALWAYS has to ask before it gets out of the sandbox. The message is just less scary if the applet is signed *properly*, i.e. the signature is certified by a known CA. But you still have to click through. Otherwise, anyone with a certified key could write an applet and silently gain access to my file system... that would be quite nasty. -- daniel

On Sun, Nov 23, 2008 at 3:18 PM, Daniel Kinzler <daniel(a)brightbyte.de> wrote: They wouldn't have to click through if it was signed, would they? They'd certainly have to click through a scary dialog if you gave them a Firefox plugin to install (if they even used Firefox, what percentage is that?).

On Mon, Nov 24, 2008 at 2:31 PM, Brion Vibber <brion(a)wikimedia.org> wrote: I don't know anything about Java signing; I was relying on (my possibly incorrect reading of) what Greg Maxwell has said in this thread. I was assuming there was some kind of PKI being used here, as with HTTPS, so that "trusted" applets would silently run with more permissions. If not, then never mind what I said above.

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Gregory Maxwell wrote: I get a big scary dialog box here: == This applet was signed by "JCraft,Inc.," but Java cannot verify the authenticity of the signature's certificate. Do you trust this certificate? Click Trust to run this applet and allow it unrestricted access to your computer. Click Don't Trust to run this applet with standard Java restrictions. [Show Certificate] [Don't Trust] [Trust] == Click "Show Certificate" and it expands to show cert details and adds a little check box: [ ] Always trust "JCraft,Inc." This is with Firefox 3.0.4 on Mac OS X 10.5, whatever default Java VM/plugin comes on the system. - -- brion vibber (brion @ wikimedia.org)

2008/11/22 Daniel Kinzler <daniel(a)brightbyte.de>de>: Isn't it OK if we have a Java/Flash option for those who can use it, and current Special:Upload for those who can't? I think it's difficult to say that Java/Flash options are "clunky and ugly", considering all photo and video sharing sites offer this option. As someone on a slo.o.o.o.ow uploading speed feedback is a godsend. Brianna -- They've just been waiting in a mountain for the right moment: http://modernthings.org/

Brianna Laugher schrieb: And they frequently break. Imageshak's for example kills my firefox every time. I don't know why, but i'm sure i'm not the only one. If we provide something like this, it should be opt-in (a gadget?) unless ist's *very* smooth and reliable. Maybe that is possible, but I have not seen it yet even once. -- daniel

On Sat, Nov 22, 2008 at 7:13 AM, Ilmari Karonen <nospam(a)vyznev.net> wrote: We actually do have code in SVN that can resize large PNGs efficiently. The problem is though that it may or may not work for pallete based images.

use index.php inside that file <?php header("Location:http://wiki.1611kjb.org/mediawiki/index.php?title=Mai… "); ?> bilal On Sat, Nov 22, 2008 at 7:00 PM, Praising Jesus &lt;1611kjb(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote:

This index.php should be at the root where you placed index.html with the redirect. This is different than index.php that is used by Wiki inside your wiki directory. bilal On Sat, Nov 22, 2008 at 9:26 PM, Praising Jesus &lt;1611kjb(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Ilmari Karonen wrote: Nope, scaling is a totally unrelated issue. - -- brion