Hi,
I remembered how readily "the guys" assumed that any woman there was there
for more than just networking and learning. I remembered having my butt pinched, my breasts "accidentally touched", my questions ignored or laughed at. I remember how the buzz of background conversation is always much louder when the speaker is a woman than when the speaker is a man.
All of these behaviors fall somewhere on the spectrum from rude to depraved, but am I correct in thinking that most of them would not actually be covered by a code of conduct? Ignoring or laughing at someone's question, for example, is certainly rude, but I can't imagine anyone getting officially reprimanded for it, unless there's an additional element of confrontation there. (I don't know if this happened at a talk or during an outside discussion, but either way I'd think it's the same.) Certainly neither the Wikimedia code of conduct as currently drafted nor the WMF Friendly Space Policy cover simple acts of rudeness, even if motivated by bias.
-Yaron
On 8/24/15, Yaron Koren yaron@wikiworks.com wrote:
Hi,
I remembered how readily "the guys" assumed that any woman there was there
for more than just networking and learning. I remembered having my butt pinched, my breasts "accidentally touched", my questions ignored or laughed at. I remember how the buzz of background conversation is always much louder when the speaker is a woman than when the speaker is a man.
All of these behaviors fall somewhere on the spectrum from rude to depraved, but am I correct in thinking that most of them would not actually be covered by a code of conduct? Ignoring or laughing at someone's question, for example, is certainly rude, but I can't imagine anyone getting officially reprimanded for it, unless there's an additional element of confrontation there. (I don't know if this happened at a talk or during an outside discussion, but either way I'd think it's the same.) Certainly neither the Wikimedia code of conduct as currently drafted nor the WMF Friendly Space Policy cover simple acts of rudeness, even if motivated by bias.
-Yaron
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The "I remembered having my butt pinched, my breasts 'accidentally touched'" part would seem to fall under the proposed policy.
-- bawolff
On 08/24/2015 02:44 PM, Brian Wolff wrote:
The "I remembered having my butt pinched, my breasts 'accidentally touched'" part would seem to fall under the proposed policy.
As is "unwanted attention", even if verbal, and "sustained disruption, interruption", which would be applicable if people are continually interrupting your talk on purpose (similar to the "background conversation" note, though not the same thing).
Matt Flaschen
Hi,
As is "unwanted attention", even if verbal, and "sustained disruption, interruption", which would be applicable if people are continually interrupting your talk on purpose (similar to the "background conversation" note, though not the same thing).
Right - I got the sense from the original description that people were talking among themselves just because they thought what the speaker was saying was unimportant, not in an attempt to disrupt the speaker. (Though background chatter is always disruptive, and a pet peeve of mine, but that's another story.) I still contend that, for what it's worth, many of the reasons Risker offered for why a young woman might be afraid to attend Wikimedia events would still be valid even after a code of conduct was adopted and enforced. (Though the most egregious ones would be handled.)
-Yaron
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