Dear all, as many of you know, we are asking the Affiliation Committee to create a "Wikisource User Group" https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikisource_User_Group
The idea is very simple: we can create a group of interested Wikisource users, share ideas and experiences, and also interact with GLAMs in outreach activities. Many of you signed the page, so what I'm asking you is to decide together what we do want to do with the User Group, as the AffCom asked us additional questions. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikisource_User_Group#AffComm_questions
IMHO, the best way to do this is: * notify your own Wikisource about this idea, so we can spread the word * discuss on the Talk page (or here, if you prefer) about what we want to do, and what is your idea.
For you convenience, here are the questions with my own answers:
- Currently you are using an individual engagement grant, what about the future when the grant has finished or spent? How you will fund your UG?
Me and Micru are concluding our IEG, but currently no money were spent on the user group, and we don't see the need of funds coming for quite some time. It is possible that in the future, if the Ws UG is succesfull, it will need some funds, but there will be time to plan this and ask to the GAC, for example, for specific projects.
- I want to know if you are thinking in future. Are you thinking in a kind of organization for your UG like a proposal of Board, structure or membership requirements for WS UG?
Right now, no. We are thinking of gathering people from different Wikisource communities to boost coordination and join our forces in making Wikisource the great project it deserves. We need software development and together we can propose the WMF or other entities to fund some projects or dedicate some staff time.
- Untill now Aubrey and Micru are the most active in the UG, what about the rest of supporters? Are they really involved? Are there real-life activities to involve them? Have any plan for a future face-to-face meeting?
Well, this is up to you :-)
Aubrey
Andrea Zanni, 10/09/2013 11:37:
Dear all, as many of you know, we are asking the Affiliation Committee to create a "Wikisource User Group" https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikisource_User_Group
Personally, I don't like user groups; I suspect most Wikisource users don't either. It's a paradox but for this very reason I think it may make sense for us all to support it: the WMF likes user groups and pushed them a lot; so the formation of a semi-formal user group can affect them, but nobody else.
What I mean is that we can define a scope and a more concrete proposal and then decide if we like it or not: 1) the scope would not to be the rulers of Wikisource; even if the group tried to do so it wouldn't matter, nobody would be listening to their orders; 2) the scope *would* be to interact with the WMF, summarising "from the field" what the general direction of Wikisource is and what is really absolutely needed for it to reach goals X, Y and Z (read: make them confident enough to invest some developer time in very focused areas; the WMF is only very moderately willing, has no idea where to start and fears a black hole); 3) as a consequence, we *do* need some "structure", not for the sake of bureaucracy but for the contrary (otherwise the usergroup is just a layer of bureaucracy around yet another discussion page which should be on wikisource.org scriptorium); it can just be an open discussion among the participants without predefined rules other than it has to end with 2 names of coordinators/whatever (even the WMF chapter-selected board seats started like this).
If it's useful I support it, otherwise I don't care. My opinion. :)
Nemo
The idea is very simple: we can create a group of interested Wikisource users, share ideas and experiences, and also interact with GLAMs in outreach activities. Many of you signed the page, so what I'm asking you is to decide together what we do want to do with the User Group, as the AffCom asked us additional questions. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikisource_User_Group#AffComm_questions
IMHO, the best way to do this is:
- notify your own Wikisource about this idea, so we can spread the word
- discuss on the Talk page (or here, if you prefer) about what we want
to do, and what is your idea. [...]
Hi Nemo, thanks for you answer.
I wholeheartly agree with you, and thanks again for having expressed your ideas so clearly (much better than me).
You give me the chance to be much more sincere: I do not care of having another layer of bureacracy, or eventually be in a board of whatever structure. I actalluy *don't* want to, unless it is necessary.
I really really want that Wikisource can be the project we all work for. I think (it's my opinion but I know many of you whom I've spoken with agree) that we need some core features (metadata management, good mobile UI, visual editor in the proofread extension, perfect epub export, etc.) to achieve our goals, (one of which is to be the best free digital library out there :-).
My feeling is that, until we are scattered communities, and Wikisource do not coordinate, we cannot ask the WMF to dedicate some staff time/money/development for us.
It's over and over the same recurring problem: it's systematic and vicious. They won't hear us until we are big and strong enough to say that the "wikisource community as a whole" wants something. If we reach that point (if we manage to agree on one request, at least), I'm confident that they will give it to us.
This is the underlying motivation on the Individual Engagement Grant that me and Micru are doing. All the things we are proposing are just means for this end.
And this is way is crucial that everyone interested in the future of Wikisource speaks up and join us in working on this. We would really love you to give us even a ton of negative feedback, if the discussion can lead the project to be more effective.
If you are interested in this, tell us your opinion and if you agree with the plan, please engage your community. It is really important, because there isn't other way to reach Wikisource editors (we are trying with this ml, or some message bot in village pumps, and even talk pages. non of which is really effective).
So, again, it's up to you :-)
Aubrey
On Tue, Sep 10, 2013 at 12:02 PM, Federico Leva (Nemo) nemowiki@gmail.comwrote:
Andrea Zanni, 10/09/2013 11:37:
Dear all,
as many of you know, we are asking the Affiliation Committee to create a "Wikisource User Group" https://meta.wikimedia.org/**wiki/Wikisource_User_Grouphttps://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikisource_User_Group
Personally, I don't like user groups; I suspect most Wikisource users don't either. It's a paradox but for this very reason I think it may make sense for us all to support it: the WMF likes user groups and pushed them a lot; so the formation of a semi-formal user group can affect them, but nobody else.
What I mean is that we can define a scope and a more concrete proposal and then decide if we like it or not:
- the scope would not to be the rulers of Wikisource; even if the group
tried to do so it wouldn't matter, nobody would be listening to their orders; 2) the scope *would* be to interact with the WMF, summarising "from the field" what the general direction of Wikisource is and what is really absolutely needed for it to reach goals X, Y and Z (read: make them confident enough to invest some developer time in very focused areas; the WMF is only very moderately willing, has no idea where to start and fears a black hole); 3) as a consequence, we *do* need some "structure", not for the sake of bureaucracy but for the contrary (otherwise the usergroup is just a layer of bureaucracy around yet another discussion page which should be on wikisource.org scriptorium); it can just be an open discussion among the participants without predefined rules other than it has to end with 2 names of coordinators/whatever (even the WMF chapter-selected board seats started like this).
If it's useful I support it, otherwise I don't care. My opinion. :)
Nemo
The idea is very simple: we can create a group of interested Wikisource users, share ideas and experiences, and also interact with GLAMs in outreach activities. Many of you signed the page, so what I'm asking you is to decide together what we do want to do with the User Group, as the AffCom asked us additional questions. https://meta.wikimedia.org/**wiki/Talk:Wikisource_User_** Group#AffComm_questionshttps://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikisource_User_Group#AffComm_questions
IMHO, the best way to do this is:
- notify your own Wikisource about this idea, so we can spread the word
- discuss on the Talk page (or here, if you prefer) about what we want
to do, and what is your idea. [...]
wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org