[[m:Help:Redirect#A redirect to an anchor]] states that: ---- An example of this: <nowiki>#REDIRECT [[definitions#G]]</nowiki> This is not possible. You will still be redirected to <nowiki>[[definitions]]</nowiki> but you will not be sent to the #G anchor. This feature '''will not''' be implemented in the future, so such redirects should not be used. ---- When was that last sentence added, and by whom, and on what authority?
There is minimal discussion on the talk page, which ends with one of the participants declaring their intent to drop a Feature Request on [[m:MediaWiki feature request and bug report discussion]], but nothing is said about any decision to forbid this change.
Did I miss something?
On 4/13/05, Phil Boswell phil.boswell@gmail.com wrote:
[[m:Help:Redirect#A redirect to an anchor]] states that:
An example of this: <nowiki>#REDIRECT [[definitions#G]]</nowiki> This is not possible. You will still be redirected to <nowiki>[[definitions]]</nowiki> but you will not be sent to the #G anchor. This feature '''will not''' be implemented in the future, so such redirects should not be used.
When was that last sentence added, and by whom, and on what authority?
Well, there has been discussion about it in the past, but no-one has come up with a very convincing scheme of how it would actually work - either technically, or in terms of content management. I would guess whoever added that was trying to discourage the optimistic view that "if we use it, it might start working some day" since the chances are it never will.
The only "live" bug report I've been able to track down is http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1282
That said, one suggestion that just might work is to have a custom redirect message appear with a link to the appropriate section. This would avoid the problems of being dumped in the middle of an article, at a header not necessarily 100% matching the topic searched for. i.e., the message might say something like "For 'The Knights who say Ni!', see [[#other characters]]"
[Note that in order to be useful for such messages, the redirect notice would have to be slightly more noticeable than it is now - we already have people not realising they've been redirected because monobook does too good a job of making the notice look like a minor decoration.]
Another key problem, though, is that the current system for linking to sections doesn't create stable links - that is, if the heading name changes, however subtly, all links to that heading become links to the top of the article. One interesting idea that could solve that is http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1521 which suggests manually specifying the anchor for a particular heading; this would make the anchors "sticky", so having redirects pointing to them would become far more useful.
So maybe saying this will "never" happen would be a bit strong, but I think it's a fair way off yet, unless someone really commits to designing and coding a decent solution.
On 4/13/05, Phil Boswell phil.boswell@gmail.com wrote:
[[m:Help:Redirect#A redirect to an anchor]] states that:
An example of this: <nowiki>#REDIRECT [[definitions#G]]</nowiki> This is not possible. You will still be redirected to <nowiki>[[definitions]]</nowiki> but you will not be sent to the #G anchor. This feature '''will not''' be implemented in the future, so such redirects should not be used.
When was that last sentence added, and by whom, and on what authority?
There is minimal discussion on the talk page, which ends with one of the participants declaring their intent to drop a Feature Request on [[m:MediaWiki feature request and bug report discussion]], but nothing is said about any decision to forbid this change.
Did I miss something?
The edit summary for the change in question reads: Making desc. of anchored redirects match "How to edit a page"
Apparently, this refers to [[W:en:wikipedia:How to edit a page]]. Perhaps there you can find more information.
-- Rich Holton
[[W:en:User:Rholton]]
On 4/13/05, Phil Boswell phil.boswell@gmail.com wrote:
[[m:Help:Redirect#A redirect to an anchor]] states that:
This feature '''will not''' be implemented in the future, so such redirects should not be used.
When was that last sentence added, and by whom, and on what authority?
I added "it is possible this feature will be implemented in future, so such redirects can be used now for future compatibility" to [[Wikipedia:How to edit a page]] last February. I still believe it's true, despite Bugzilla.
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:How_to_edit_a_page&d...
However, this was changed by Gracefool after Brion recommended against it at http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=218
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:How_to_edit_a_page&d...
Angela.
On 4/13/05, Angela beesley@gmail.com wrote:
I added "it is possible this feature will be implemented in future, so such redirects can be used now for future compatibility" to [[Wikipedia:How to edit a page]] last February. I still believe it's true, despite Bugzilla.
Well, it's not looking hopeful, really. Though I still think a custom "redirected from" message would be a helpful approach. But only if/when we have a stable way of linking to sections *at all* - the current ability to break all such links by editting the heading makes it unsuitable for links designed to last as long untouched as the average redirect does.
Also, in reference to Timwi's comment on bug 218 about not wanting an extra from= param to exist, I think it worth mentionning that interwiki redirects really need this rather badly, so that you can get back and edit the redirect. I can see the point about not wanting too many things to end up uncacheable though, so I'm not sure it's a good idea to use it for "ordinary" redirects. And as I've said before, I'm unsure that dumping a user in the middle of an article is always the best idea anyway.
Rowan Collins wrote:
On 4/13/05, Angela beesley@gmail.com wrote:
Also, in reference to Timwi's comment on bug 218 about not wanting an extra from= param to exist, I think it worth mentionning that interwiki redirects really need this rather badly, so that you can get back and edit the redirect.
From what I can see, inter-wiki redirects have been disabled. For example, http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/User_talk:Timwi no longer redirects you to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Timwi but instead displays the redirection as a big link. I would imagine the rationale being that this makes the redirects easier to edit.
Timwi
On 4/17/05, Timwi timwi@gmx.net wrote:
From what I can see, inter-wiki redirects have been disabled. For example, http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/User_talk:Timwi no longer redirects you to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Timwi but instead displays the redirection as a big link. I would imagine the rationale being that this makes the redirects easier to edit.
Ah, I hadn't realised that. I remember hearing that prefixes not marked as "internal" were no longer valid for redirections, but it seems you are right that they've all been disabled (unless there's just some bug somewhere). They've always been kind of controversial, but I think there may be justifiable uses, for which a from= parameter system would end up making sense. Maybe not; maybe a more traditional "See also:" is good enough...
wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org