Hello
I have started to use moodle and I am very pleased by its forum module. Because
- there is a nice threading
- your receive a notification, if somebody answers a post of you.
Now moodle relies on PHP, apache (or other servers), an a mysql (or other) database.
Could its forum module be used for the mediawiki discussions page? which frankly is quite a PITA.
I know that the subject of threading in mediawiki discussions page pops up from time to time, but given that moodle offers a better interface the question is why can't mediawiki not benefit from it.
regards
Uwe Brauer
Uwe Brauer wrote:
Hello
I have started to use moodle and I am very pleased by its forum module. Because
- there is a nice threading - your receive a notification, if somebody answers a post of you.Now moodle relies on PHP, apache (or other servers), an a mysql (or other) database.
Could its forum module be used for the mediawiki discussions page? which frankly is quite a PITA.
Take a peek at http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:LiquidThreads
A demo's up at http://wikieducator.org/Talk:LiquidThreads
-- brion vibber (brion @ wikimedia.org)
"Brion" == Brion Vibber brion@wikimedia.org writes:
Could its forum module be used for the mediawiki discussions page? which frankly is quite a PITA.
Take a peek at http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:LiquidThreads
A demo's up at http://wikieducator.org/Talk:LiquidThreads
That looks much better than the original I agree, however I still find the forum solution used by Moodle better because of the reasons I already mentioned.
Could any of the mediawiki developers comments on this subject?
Uwe Brauer
On Jan 22, 2008 2:31 AM, Uwe Brauer oub@mat.ucm.es wrote:
That looks much better than the original I agree, however I still find the forum solution used by Moodle better because of the reasons I already mentioned.
It's not likely that we're going to try to mash together a totally third-party project with MediaWiki. Our goals as a wiki will tend to differ from other software's, and it's important that it obey MediaWiki conventions for both coding and user interface. David McCabe is the only one working on this that I know of, and I don't know how well LiquidThreads is doing right now, but I haven't heard any ETA (or seen any commit activity recently).
As for the reasons you mentioned, these appear to be 1) Moodle offers threading, and 2) it notifies you if someone responds to your post. While I haven't looked much at LiquidThreads, I assume it addresses both of these concerns, or at least plans to.
Could any of the mediawiki developers comments on this subject?
Brion Vibber is the lead developer of MediaWiki. I'm also a developer, FWIW.
"Simetrical" == Simetrical Simetrical+wikilist@gmail.com writes:
It's not likely that we're going to try to mash together a totally third-party project with MediaWiki. Our goals as a wiki will tend to differ from other software's, and it's important that it obey MediaWiki conventions for both coding and user interface. David McCabe is the only one working on this that I know of, and I don't know how well LiquidThreads is doing right now, but I haven't heard any ETA (or seen any commit activity recently).
Ok I see the point, however in my experience MediaWiki conventions are not so important in discussion, where besides the 2 aims I mentioned I should add another one:
- one cannot edit other people comments
As for the reasons you mentioned, these appear to be 1) Moodle offers threading, and 2) it notifies you if someone responds to your post. While I haven't looked much at LiquidThreads, I assume it addresses both of these concerns, or at least plans to.
I think to use LiquidThreads would considerably ease discussions however as far as I can see you still could edit other people comments. Thats why I thought of that clean moodle interface.
Could any of the mediawiki developers comments on this subject?
Brion Vibber is the lead developer of MediaWiki. I'm also a developer, FWIW.
Oops sorry, but good to know.
Uwe Brauer
On Jan 24, 2008 6:22 AM, Uwe Brauer oub@mat.ucm.es wrote:
Ok I see the point, however in my experience MediaWiki conventions are not so important in discussion, where besides the 2 aims I mentioned I should add another one:
- one cannot edit other people comments
The ability to edit other people's comments (in, of course, an obvious, traceable, and reversible manner) is desirable, and should be present in any discussion system attached to a wiki. It may be useful to edit other people's posts for a wide variety of reasons, such as incorrect formatting, or policies like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:RPA . Inappropriate editing of posts can be reversed and, if necessary, penalized.
Lack of focus on logging and transparency is generally a significant problem with standard forum software in the context of wiki integration, which probably makes any mainstream forum package undesirable for integration with MediaWiki.
"Simetrical" == Simetrical Simetrical+wikilist@gmail.com writes:
On Jan 24, 2008 6:22 AM, Uwe Brauer oub@mat.ucm.es wrote:
Ok I see the point, however in my experience MediaWiki conventions are not so important in discussion, where besides the 2 aims I mentioned I should add another one:
- one cannot edit other people comments
The ability to edit other people's comments (in, of course, an obvious, traceable, and reversible manner) is desirable, and should be present in any discussion system attached to a wiki. It may be useful to edit other people's posts for a wide variety of reasons, such as incorrect formatting, or policies like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:RPA . Inappropriate editing of posts can be reversed and, if necessary, penalized.
Well I see that boils down to a philosophical question then. I think individual post in a _discussion_ should not be edited, by other users just because it seems to be too messy to sort out, whether the change was appropriate or not. That is how mailing lists and newsgroups work successfully for decades.
Uwe Brauer
On Jan 24, 2008 1:44 PM, Uwe Brauer oub@mat.ucm.es wrote:
Well I see that boils down to a philosophical question then. I think individual post in a _discussion_ should not be edited, by other users just because it seems to be too messy to sort out, whether the change was appropriate or not. That is how mailing lists and newsgroups work successfully for decades.
Content generated by a small and closed group of users with high barriers to entry also worked for decades. Now we have wikis. In practice, people observe appropriate decorum when they can edit people's comments, or else they get blocked, like with any vandalism. There is no reason to add restrictions on editing that do not narrowly serve a demonstrated need, and there is no need here. Being able to edit other people's comments is not something that I think almost anyone who's used to it has a problem with -- even though, of course, the concept can be unsettling at first, as with the concept of a wiki generally.
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