A suitable error message for iPhones - Wikitech-l - lists.wikimedia.org

List overview All Threads
Download

A suitable error message for iPhones

New software engineering opening...

How wikimedia handle starting and...

David Gerard

6 Oct 2009 6 Oct '09

9:12 p.m.

Are you *sure* we can't put a narky message when iPhone users click a video? Adobe do! http://twitpic.com/kf361 (assuming it's real - can anyone with an iPhone please check?) - d.

Reply

Show replies by date

Michel Vuijlsteke

6 Oct 6 Oct

9:21 p.m.

It's real alright. Michel 2009/10/6 David Gerard <dgerard(a)gmail.com>

Are you *sure* we can't put a narky message when iPhone users click a video? Adobe do! http://twitpic.com/kf361 (assuming it's real - can anyone with an iPhone please check?) - d. _______________________________________________ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

Reply

David Gerard

10:30 p.m.

2009/10/6 Michel Vuijlsteke <wikipedia(a)zog.org>rg>:

2009/10/6 David Gerard <dgerard(a)gmail.com>

> Are you *sure* we can't put a narky message when iPhone users click a > video? Adobe do! > http://twitpic.com/kf361 > (assuming it's real - can anyone with an iPhone please check?)

It's real alright. Michel

I am of course ONLY JOKING and not advocating seriously that we do this. Unless it works for Adobe. Or for the lulz^U - d.

Reply

scs＠eskimo.com

10:35 p.m.

dgerard wrote:

Are you *sure* we can't put a narky message when iPhone users click a video? Adobe do! http://twitpic.com/kf361

I'm not up on the details of Flash, so this comment may be misguided, but *if* the reason Apple restricts these unstated "technologies" is for security reasons, then I'm quite glad Apple does, and I'd say it's Adobe that deserves the snarky comment.

Reply

Aryeh Gregor

10:59 p.m.

On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 6:35 PM, Steve Summit <scs(a)eskimo.com> wrote:

I'm not up on the details of Flash, so this comment may be misguided, but *if* the reason Apple restricts these unstated "technologies" is for security reasons, then I'm quite glad Apple does, and I'd say it's Adobe that deserves the snarky comment.

Any security considerations that apply to the iPhone probably apply to Mac desktop as well, so that wouldn't make much sense. Flash doesn't have a remarkable number of vulnerabilities compared to other large web-facing programs (like, say, browsers), and for almost all users, the slight added security threat is worth it. I imagine the actual issues here involve things like that iPhone/iPod uses ARM; Flash uses too much battery life; or insufficient money is going one direction or the other. I would take it for granted that Apple would like iPhone users to be able to view YouTube. I would *like* to say that all this just underscores the danger of proprietary, closed-source technologies like Flash, but of course, Theora isn't in a very different situation here.

Reply

Chad

11:18 p.m.

On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 6:59 PM, Aryeh Gregor <Simetrical+wikilist(a)gmail.com> wrote:

On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 6:35 PM, Steve Summit <scs(a)eskimo.com> wrote:

I'm not up on the details of Flash, so this comment may be misguided, but *if* the reason Apple restricts these unstated "technologies" is for security reasons, then I'm quite glad Apple does, and I'd say it's Adobe that deserves the snarky comment.

Any security considerations that apply to the iPhone probably apply to Mac desktop as well, so that wouldn't make much sense. Flash doesn't have a remarkable number of vulnerabilities compared to other large web-facing programs (like, say, browsers), and for almost all users, the slight added security threat is worth it. I imagine the actual issues here involve things like that iPhone/iPod uses ARM; Flash uses too much battery life; or insufficient money is going one direction or the other. I would take it for granted that Apple would like iPhone users to be able to view YouTube. I would *like* to say that all this just underscores the danger of proprietary, closed-source technologies like Flash, but of course, Theora isn't in a very different situation here. _______________________________________________ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

Fwiw, the HTC Dream and HTC Magic (first Android phones) run ARM processors, so I don't believe that's the sole concern; I believe that the Palm Pre is on ARM as well, but don't quote me :) Granted, doing intensive flash stuff will drain your battery on any phone, but I don't think the processor is the restriction here. I'm not sure how good the reporting is, but: "Adobe said that a Flash Player for the iPhone is not being made available because it uses a just-in-time compiler and virtual machine within a browser plug-in to play back website content - technologies that aren’t currently allowed on the iPhone." [1] -Chad [1] http://www.gizmag.com/flash-player-101-for-smartphones/13042/

Reply

David Gerard

11:22 p.m.

2009/10/7 Chad <innocentkiller(a)gmail.com>om>:

"Adobe said that a Flash Player for the iPhone is not being made available because it uses a just-in-time compiler and virtual machine within a browser plug-in to play back website content - technologies that aren’t currently allowed on the iPhone." [1]

Apple does not like Turing-equivalent machines being available on their precioussss. They rejected the Commodore 64 emulator for having the BASIC accessible! Perhaps it was a SECURITY MEASURE in case someone started WORLD WAR THREE on it. http://is.gd/41eVm Claiming "security" is about as plausible as their claim they don't want Ogg because of submarine patents. i.e., in no way whatsoever. - d.

Reply

Paul Houle

7 Oct 7 Oct

2:59 p.m.

David Gerard wrote:

Are you *sure* we can't put a narky message when iPhone users click a video? Adobe do! http://twitpic.com/kf361 (assuming it's real - can anyone with an iPhone please check?)

Adobe is the most feared company on the web right now. Even though Microsoft has the most popular browser, a number of excellent alternatives exist: Firefox, Safari, Opera, Konquerer, and Chrome. They don't support 100% of what IE supports, but you can browse the web all day with them and rarely find a site that they don't work with. There are no entirely satisfactory replacements for Flash and Acrobat, and certainly not cross-platform and widely installed. On top of all that, Apple and Microsoft both have personal vendettas against Adobe. Five years ago web video was buried beneath a three-way battle between the MicrosoftOnlyMediaPlayer, TheRealBadMediaPlayer, and TheQuicktimeMediaPlayerThatWorksOccasionally. Publishing video online would typically mean creating files for all three players, and probably at 2-4 different quality levels, so you might have 6-12 files. Then there would be a complex hunk of javascript that would try to guess which player you had, which would work right... if you were lucky. Then there was the whole codec nightmare; even if you had the right player, you probably didn't have the right codec. Although there were supposedly mechanisms for installing new codecs, you'd usually risk wrecking your ability to play video at all if you tried to install a codec. Macromedia (later aquired by Adobe) quietly introduced video capability in Flash... It was a few versions later when Flash video players were widespread, and then all of a sudden people realized that web video could be as simple as pushing "Play" and having the video really play. Apple and Microsoft, both of whom have ambitions to control digital video, will never forgive Adobe.

Reply

5322

days inactive

5323

days old

wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org

Manage subscription

7 comments

6 participants

tags (0)

participants (6)

Aryeh Gregor
Chad
David Gerard
Michel Vuijlsteke
Paul Houle
scs＠eskimo.com