I'm wondering about usage of `:' and `;' This:
:::Triple indent Paragraph
Generates this:
<p> <dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd> Triple indent </dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl>Paragraph
What makes absolutely no sense.
Any idea to do it in a saner way ?
Tomasz Wegrzanowski wrote:
I'm wondering about usage of `:' and `;' This:
:::Triple indent Paragraph
Generates this:
<p> <dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd> Triple indent </dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl>Paragraph
What makes absolutely no sense.
Wookee does this:
<p class="indent3">Triple indent</p>
and sets stuff in the stylesheet :)
On Thu, Aug 07, 2003 at 05:33:18PM +0100, tarquin wrote:
Tomasz Wegrzanowski wrote:
I'm wondering about usage of `:' and `;' This:
:::Triple indent Paragraph
Generates this:
<p> <dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd> Triple indent </dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl>Paragraph
What makes absolutely no sense.
Wookee does this:
<p class="indent3">Triple indent</p>
and sets stuff in the stylesheet :)
That's nicer, but it won't work in non-css browsers like most text browsers.
Any idea of doing it in a way that's both sane and text-browser-compatible ?
Tomasz Wegrzanowski wrote:
On Thu, Aug 07, 2003 at 05:33:18PM +0100, tarquin wrote:
Wookee does this:
<p class="indent3">Triple indent</p>
and sets stuff in the stylesheet :)
That's nicer, but it won't work in non-css browsers like most text browsers.
Any idea of doing it in a way that's both sane and text-browser-compatible ?
There is no such way.
<blockquote> would work, but you're not _supposed_ to use it for indentation of things that aren't quotes.
-- brion vibber (brion @ pobox.com)
On Thu, Aug 07, 2003 at 12:15:46PM -0700, Brion Vibber wrote:
Tomasz Wegrzanowski wrote:
That's nicer, but it won't work in non-css browsers like most text browsers.
Any idea of doing it in a way that's both sane and text-browser-compatible ?
There is no such way.
<blockquote> would work, but you're not _supposed_ to use it for indentation of things that aren't quotes.
We're even less supposed to use "definition lists" for indentation.
On Thursday 07 August 2003 12:15, Brion Vibber wrote:
<blockquote> would work, but you're not _supposed_ to use it for indentation of things that aren't quotes.
The 4.01 standard says 'The usage of BLOCKQUOTE to indent text is deprecated in favor of style sheets.'
"Deprecated" doesn't mean "you can't do that", it's closer to "avoid doing that if possible, and if you go to a later standard, be ready to not be able to do it". But the doctype line at the top of Wikipedia's pages doesn't say "the latest standard", it says "HTML 4.01 Transitional", and HTML 4.01 transitional says "you can do it if you really want to". And since we appear to be stuck on supporting browsers that can't keep up with 5-7 year old standards, it would appear we "really want to".
On Thu, 7 Aug 2003 15:11:06 -0700, Nicholas Knight nknight@runawaynet.com gave utterance to the following:
On Thursday 07 August 2003 12:15, Brion Vibber wrote:
<blockquote> would work, but you're not _supposed_ to use it for indentation of things that aren't quotes.
The 4.01 standard says 'The usage of BLOCKQUOTE to indent text is deprecated in favor of style sheets.'
"Deprecated" doesn't mean "you can't do that", it's closer to "avoid doing that if possible, and if you go to a later standard, be ready to not be able to do it". But the doctype line at the top of Wikipedia's pages doesn't say "the latest standard", it says "HTML 4.01 Transitional", and HTML 4.01 transitional says "you can do it if you really want to". And since we appear to be stuck on supporting browsers that can't keep up with 5-7 year old standards, it would appear we "really want to".
But do text browsers actually indent blockquotes, or do they use colour to distinguish them such as they do for B, I, EM and STRONG? I think some graphic browsers Italicize a blockquote, and some screen readers might change voice. There is no legitimate way to indent text via HTML, and there never has been. So let's just write it off it for the tiny proportion of users with non-css capable UA's rather than harming things for the vast majority.
Richard Grevers wrote:
But do text browsers actually indent blockquotes, or do they use colour to distinguish them such as they do for B, I, EM and STRONG?
lynx renders blockquotes indented two extra columns:
<p>this is text</p>
<blockquote>a blockquote</blockquote>
<p>this is text</p>
as
this is text
a blockquote
this is text
I think some graphic browsers Italicize a blockquote, and some screen readers might change voice.
That's why we have style sheets. :)
-- brion vibber (brion @ pobox.com)
Richard-
But do text browsers actually indent blockquotes,
lynx, w3m and links all do. None of them support CSS margins.
or do they use colour to distinguish them such as they do for B, I, EM and STRONG?
No.
I think some graphic browsers Italicize a blockquote,
Which ones?
and some screen readers might change voice.
Which is better than doing nothing at all in our context, as they would in the case of CSS.
Regards,
Erik
Tomasz Wegrzanowski wrote:
That's nicer, but it won't work in non-css browsers like most text browsers.
Any idea of doing it in a way that's both sane and text-browser-compatible ?
Text indent is presentational, not structural. So it could be argued that it's correct for text-only and non-CSS browsers not to show it.
having said that, we *need* it for talk pages, otherwise it is hard to follow the lines of conversation.
And I think we can stand to break the rules for talk pages, since the structure is pretty much all over the place anyway ;)
When do we use indentation in articles? Lists should use * or # Apart form that, I use it to indent <math> and quotations .... bingo! BLOCKQUOTE is perfect for that!
So I think BLOCKQUOTE is the best option.
Tomasz Wegrzanowski wrote:
That's nicer, but it won't work in non-css browsers like most text browsers.
Any idea of doing it in a way that's both sane and text-browser-compatible ?
Text indent is presentational, not structural. So it could be argued that it's correct for text-only and non-CSS browsers not to show it.
having said that, we *need* it for talk pages, otherwise it is hard to follow the lines of conversation.
I find it hard to follow lines of conversation on talk pages even with indenting.
On Fri, 8 Aug 2003 lists@dramatic.co.nz wrote:
Tomasz Wegrzanowski wrote: having said that, we *need* it for talk pages, otherwise it is hard to follow the lines of conversation.
I find it hard to follow lines of conversation on talk pages even with indenting.
Not to worry -- the lines of reasoning are often equally difficult to follow... ;)
-- brion
--- Brion Vibber vibber@aludra.usc.edu wrote:
On Fri, 8 Aug 2003 lists@dramatic.co.nz wrote:
Tomasz Wegrzanowski wrote: having said that, we *need* it for talk pages,
otherwise it is hard to
follow the lines of conversation.
I find it hard to follow lines of conversation on
talk pages even with
indenting.
Not to worry -- the lines of reasoning are often equally difficult to follow... ;)
-- brion
Haha. But maybe flaws in expression and reason are attributable to flaws in the technology, not the intellect-- eh? 'Blame the equipment' in other words.:)
-S-
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